14: Cody Grodzki, USA Chief Routesetter
Cody is the USA national chief routesetter, and in the 2023 IFSC season he had the opportunity to set boulders in Hachioji, Prague, Innsbruck, and the Bern world champs! In this episode, we’ll watch him read Youtube hate comments, and we’ll learn about the differences between IFSC vs USA vs commercial routesetting, as well as hear about a crazy cool gym that he will be opening up soon.
Timestamps
Timestamps of discussion topics
0:00 - Introduction
2:06 - Starting climbing + routesetting at the same time
12:58 - Juggling firefighting and setting
19:03 - How he started setting for the world cups
28:26 - Favorite World Cup wall to set on
31:08 - Hate comment: Hachioji too hard
43:44 - Hate comment: Hachioji did the setters have too much free time?
46:21 - Hate comment: Hachioji should setters be able to top their boulders?
51:37 - Hate comment: Prague M4/V4
55:44 - Hate comment: Prague calibrating difficulty of static climbing
57:43 - Why Oriane won Prague instead of Janja
31:48 - Differences setting for mens vs women climbing
1:01:30 - Hate comment: Innsbruck height comments
1:15:00 - Bern: How would Janja fare on a men's course?
1:18:28 - Innsbruck: Resetting a whole boulder before the comp
1:26:37 - The future of IFSC setting evolution
1:32:05 - Lower body coordination moves
1:37:17 - Feeling self conscious among athletes and setters
1:47:04 - Getting tips for competing at Vail
1:52:35 - The time it takes to set for IFSC vs national vs local comps
1:56:44 - What makes a great route setter
2:06:00 - Anyone else feel like US nationals setting looks different from IFSC?
2:12:09 - Cody's crazy cool gym in an old bank
2:25:50 - Discord Q: World Cup climbs vs comp style boulders in a gym?
2:29:29 - Discord Q: Favorite round of world cups to set for?
2:31:23 - Discord Q: Mistakes in commercial setting?
2:34:21 - I'm traumatized by route setting
2:37:07 - Discord Q: Will there be facilities in your gym for paraclimbers?
2:39:41 - Discord Q: What kind of athlete is hardest to set for?
2:44:49 - Discord Q: How much are setters able to sway rounds for athletes?
2:52:08 - Where to find Cody
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Okay, Hachioji was hard, but the season was awesome.
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It had a story.
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And Ai just doesn't have leg power.
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And she'd be the first to tell you.
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We might finish setting and taping qualities, let's just say, at Thursday night at midnight
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or 1 a.m., 2 a.m., get to the wall at 7, we're there from 7 until all the way, maybe until
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again, 1 a.m., 2 a.m., 3 a.m.
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Am I good enough?
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Is this imposter syndrome situation happening?
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Am I supposed to be here?
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Welcome to another episode of the That's Not Real Coming podcast.
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I'm your host Jinni and I'm excited to introduce my guest for today, Cody Grodzki.
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Cody is the USA national chief fraudsetter and in the 2023 IFSC season, he had the opportunity
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to set boulders in Hachioji, Prague, Innsbruck, and the burn world champs.
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In this episode, we'll watch him read YouTube hate comments and we'll learn about the differences
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between IFSC versus USA versus commercial route setting, as well as hear about his awesome
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new gym that's opening up soon.
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I am so excited to visit it someday.
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This is a super long episode, but there was so much to get into and he has some serious
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passion for setting, which is just inspiring to listen to.
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So please enjoy this episode with Cody and send him lots of thanks for the time he spent
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with me on this.
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Hope you enjoy.
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Yeah, yeah, totally.
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Okay, awesome.
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Well, let's just get right into it then.
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Yeah, how are things going?
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Are you preparing for your upcoming trip to Europe for this selection come?
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I am.
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Yeah, yeah, just slowly starting to pack my things and get everything organized.
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And you know, I travel quite a lot, so it's kind of the same strategy each time.
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Yeah, you've got the routine down.
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Yeah, exactly.
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So I guess getting right into it a bit, when did you start climbing and route setting?
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Let's see.
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So funnily enough, I started climbing and route setting and working at a climbing gym
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all like almost in the same day.
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Not exactly, but for sure, yeah, within maybe a few days or something like that.
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It was all pretty much all at the same time.
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I started climbing about 16 years ago, so I've been setting for about that long.
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And then just due to the nature of when I started at this climbing gym in town, they
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happen to be having a USA climbing regionals.
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And so I got to like for run, for run, like I had any concept of what that meant, right?
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I was just like, they're like, oh, there's people here setting competition routes.
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They invited us if we want to help them test.
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And I was like, okay, I'll help.
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And so kind of right out of the gate, got involved in just pure luck, just completely
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pure luck that it happened that way.
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Like right when you started climbing?
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Yeah, pretty much.
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I mean, I was fooling around.
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I mean, I went, I guess when did any of us start climbing?
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When I was two years or four years old, probably I went to a carnival and did one of those
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rock walls, right?
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But I don't consider that the start of climbing anymore than I had a birthday party at a climbing
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gym when I was a kid.
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Had someone bully me and my friends for a couple hours.
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Maybe that's the start of the climbing.
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I don't know.
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But when I started to actually get into it and I want to go to the gym and I want to
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participate in this community, that was all kind of at the same time.
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Yeah.
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Well, it's just kind of strange that they would ask someone who's still fairly new to
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climbing that they would ask them to start to for run or route set at all in any capacity.
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Unless you were just really good when you started.
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No, no, no.
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Pretty much on the contrary, terrible, terrible.
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I think though it's just like probably pretty indicative of the community up here in southern
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New England.
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And it's, you're also talking almost two decades ago, right?
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Like the climbing landscape has changed so incredibly much.
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It was very, very tight knit for every, you know, new climber in a facility.
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There was 15 mentors, you know, now you have every 15 new climbers.
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You might not even have a mentor.
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So I think I just got really lucky in that way where the community was like very excited
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and very open and they're like, oh, here's someone new that seems like they're wanting
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to share this passion with us, you know, and I did.
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I didn't realize how much so, but they helped foster that.
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And I think they're like, oh, if we just show them this and show them that, then maybe
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they're more likely to stick around and be involved.
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And they're right.
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Yeah, definitely.
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And so back then, was there a formal process at all to get into route setting or were there
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these, I guess, clinics and courses that you can take?
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Because I know right now in the US, there's like five levels of route setting.
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What's the word?
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Like certification?
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Yeah, exactly.
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Yeah.
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So is that like a new thing?
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It's not a new thing.
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I think I should know this, I'm one of the national chief instructors for US at climbing.
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I should know all the history except to go over it all the time.
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But I want to say it was like the route setting program and its founding was somewhere around
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like maybe 2007 or 2008.
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And that was kind of just like the first iteration of it, right?
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Of like, hey, we're formalizing this process in some way, shape or form.
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I don't even know if there was five levels at that point.
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I don't remember what the levels were.
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I do know though that for this, like they did at least have like local events and then
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like regional events.
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Maybe they had divisionals and then nationals.
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So to be the chief of any one of these events, you did have to have some sort of formalized
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education through USA climbing.
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And exactly what that looked like, I don't quite know.
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I think the first level two clinic might have been in 2009 or 2010.
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So it was all starting to be developed around this time.
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And I think that's where there was just so many loose ends all over.
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People could just be involved and as it's forming kind of as you go.
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So it's almost like you can't be too picky if you want the events to occur at various
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places around the country.
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And I'm just guessing here.
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I don't know.
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I've actually never talked to anyone about it, like really what it was like back then
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in terms of specifics for the certification process.
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But it'd be interesting to talk to someone, maybe like Chris Danielson.
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He'd be like just he started the whole program.
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So he would be a wealth of knowledge for that.
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Oh, interesting.
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Yeah, maybe I'll have to look into that.
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Yeah, he's a smart guy.
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He's a really good.
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And so I guess out of this, you've kind of managed to make a career out of climbing,
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which I think is something a lot of people wish they could do.
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It's yeah, I mean, it's a lot of people's passions.
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So was that like a very intentional step for you or did it just sort of happen like how
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you just sort of happened to start for running and route setting?
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Yeah, I think I'm trying to think back here.
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It was it was fairly intentional from I won't say from the get go.
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I won't say from day one or even maybe year one, but pretty, pretty early on, I realized
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that I was very invested in this whole idea.
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But I just didn't know what that looked like because there weren't really any careers.
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Like there was certainly no like careers in route setting as I knew it, at least in my
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little bubble of where I was here in like southern Massachusetts.
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And then it wasn't until I went away to school, I went to University of New Hampshire, that
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I was kind of like, oh, man, I need to make a decision here.
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Like, do I keep kind of pursuing this thing that I'm really excited about route setting?
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Like, I know I'll have climbing, like I know I'll keep climbing.
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I knew that much.
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But do I keep pursuing route setting?
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And what does that look like?
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So I just started Googling like climbing gyms in New Hampshire, climbing gyms in Boston.
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And long story short, eventually found Metro Rock, which maybe folks know or maybe not
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is the home of the Dark Horse bouldering series.
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And in my mind, and maybe this is just me being like, I don't know, I have like a deep,
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deep connection to it because I kind of was there and the foundings of it, I think maybe
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from season two until season six, so really the early days.
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And it just like ignited this huge passion for competition route setting, competition
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climbing.
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They had more of a professional environment for commercialized route setting.
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It was far from perfect.
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And if you compared it to today's day and age, you'd be like, what is going on?
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But for that time, it was very much like top end in a lot of, lot of metrics.
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And it got me super motivated.
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So much so that I went to school at the University of New Hampshire and then at various points
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in time either lived close by to the school, like around the Patuckaway State Park area.
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There's a lot of good climbing up there.
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And then would commute to work in Boston.
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It was like 80 miles each way.
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And then, or switch, or I was living in Boston and commuting to school and same number of
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miles each way.
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Gosh.
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Got kind of tricky at times and definitely, yeah, like asked myself like, what?
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What am I doing?
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Like, there's no money in this.
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Like I'm not getting, you know, I'm having to like pick up coaching shifts and coach
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teams as well as work full time, as well as, you know, travel all this way to school.
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And yeah, it wasn't without questions.
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That's for sure.
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But just kind of was like, you know what?
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I love this.
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So I'm just going to keep going for it until the road runs out.
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And so far the road hasn't run out.
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So yeah, that's awesome.
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And a lot of dedication.
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I mean, for like non-Americans, that's probably what?
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Like an hour and a half, at least of driving every day to and from.
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Yeah.
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Yeah, at least.
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I mean, depending on Boston traffic, too.
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I mean, when you're in New Hampshire, it's, you know, whatever.
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It's like all pretty open and pretty chill.
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But you get closer to the city and for sure tons of traffic.
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And then the weather in New England is pretty wild.
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Like you can get crazy bands of intense snow and rain or frost or whatever in one area
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and then be completely clear or vice versa.
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So you'd like I'd be traveling sometimes and they'd be like, oh, we're not canceling school.
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And then I'm in Boston and it's like two and a half feet of snow.
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And I'm like, damn it.
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This sucks.
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But you just manage and yeah, it's quite a drive though, for sure.
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Yeah.
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So for those who aren't aware of the Dark Horse competition, I guess people like me.
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Sure.
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What's the history?
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What's the history?
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I'm definitely not the best person to talk about it, but I was involved for a while.
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So it was kind of this brainchild of Josh Larson, who's now the US team coach, Olympic
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coach, national coach, and Dave Wetmore, who's another level five national chief root setter.
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He's been involved with the U.S.A. climbing for very long.
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He's been the chief of Open Boulders.
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He's been on like every career imaginable and just like integral to the sport.
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So they kind of came up with this concept along with the owners of Metro Rock.
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And it was kind of one of the more like one of the first big scale private competitions
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with a large cash purse and a dedicated finals round in like a more grand setting.
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And so for me, it kind of kicked off that, you know, kind of competition climbing as
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we know it, as we see it in today's day and age a little bit more.
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So like I remember for the first time, like it was at one of those competitions where
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I saw like a true paddle move be set and climbed, you know, and I was like just completely floored.
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Like I didn't know that, you know, something like this could even exist.
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And the energy and the people, it was it was like a really special time, at least for me
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in competition climbing and route setting.
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Yeah, sounds like a lot of fun.
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Yeah, I can't.
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I think probably the first time I saw a paddle move, I was also just like mind blown.
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I was like, okay, and then outside of your climbing career, we were talking a little
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bit about it earlier.
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You're also a firefighter.
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And also, I don't actually know.
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I've like never met a firefighter, I think outside of maybe when you're like in elementary
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school and you are taken on a field trip to like something like that, you like see a fire
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truck or something.
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What's that like?
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And how do you manage that along with climbing?
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It's very different in most ways.
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What's that like?
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Yeah, I don't know.
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It's just a completely different world.
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I kind of love it because it's just such an opposite of what I do with climbing.
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All the guys at the fire station, they're just their career firefighters or in construction
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or they're in fishing or any number of trades.
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And then we do this and to kind of just like help out the town or in the surrounding communities
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and stuff like that.
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And it's cool because I just kind of can like shut off the climbing brain and I can focus
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on this other set of skills that are vital to success and different type of career path.
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I had no intention.
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Like I never grew up and was like, I want to be a firefighter.
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My wife and I moved up to back up to Massachusetts in 2020.
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We were living in Chattanooga for a long while.
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We moved up here and then yeah, kind of long story short, they do like fire inspections,
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I guess, when you purchase a house.
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And the person who's doing the fire inspection was also the captain of the department.
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And my brother, I guess, had been trying to get on the fire department and he was like,
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oh, are you the captain that was doing hiring?
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And he's like, oh yeah, like because of COVID, things got crazy, but you should come back
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to the station and we'll do your interview like this weekend if that works for you.
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And my brother was like, oh, that's awesome.
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And then he looked at me and he's like, so what's your story?
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What are you doing?
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And I'm like, I don't know, I just like moved across the country and like trying to start
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this like new business concept and I don't know, like just getting married.
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Like he's like, you should consider being a firefighter.
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And I was like, no disrespect, like I have no fucking clue about anything to do with
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the fire service.
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Like I'm probably not your guy.
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And anyways, yeah, he explained the whole process and the support that the town gives
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and kind of like tangibles of an expectations on kind of either side of things and just
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kind of tip my toe in.
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And as I kept going, you know, coming around and moving forward, I was like, oh, this is
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really cool.
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Like this is really special and it's a really good group of people and everyone's like genuinely
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there to help.
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Like everyone who when you're responding to something, it's usually someone's like bad
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day.
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I don't know, people don't want to call 911, right?
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It's like a bad thing.
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And you're like something is occurring that you're like, damn it, this isn't good.
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So it's nice to be involved in a group of people who are like, yep, like we're here
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to help and we want to make a difference and try to make your day, you know, at least a
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little bit better or not suck as much as it is.
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So yeah, it's pretty wild for sure.
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But I really enjoy it.
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I don't know if you're recording recording on the beginning, but I don't know when when
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you started recording.
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But like yesterday, like I was saying, like, I like woke up at, you know, to my pager,
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I have this like little pager here and it like goes off if there's like a serious thing
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that they need us for and they alert us as to like where you're going and what you're
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doing and what the situation is basically and like hurry the hell up and get to the
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station basically.
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And that was for a commercial Scalper that caught fire in the town over.
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And so first thing in the morning, go to the town over and you see a pretty big plume of
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spoke from like, you know, eight miles away and you're like, oh, this is going to be
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a it's going to be a morning for sure.
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And it's definitely a juxtaposition from climbing where climbing can be a lot more
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peaceful if you'd like it to be.
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It can be intense if you'd like it to be, can be kind of whatever you'd like it to
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be because it's your own personal experience.
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Like climbing is for everyone.
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All types of climbing are valid indoor, outdoor, trad, crazy cordadina, you know, like you
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get to pick your experience every single time that you like step on the wall.
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Yeah, that's really cool.
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I mean, both very physically demanding jobs, though.
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Yeah, I'm noticing a theme in my life.
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I could probably pick easier careers in terms of demand on my own body and mind.
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But I guess there's something to it for me that I like.
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Yeah, has it ever, I guess, like interrupted around setting that you're doing?
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Or do you kind of separate those?
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I try to separate them as much as possible.
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So I do a ton of kind of my my full time gig now is I run a consulting firm for climbing
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and route setting and athlete workshops and wall design, kind of the whole gamut, anything
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under the umbrella of artificial climbing, wall management and whatever scope me and
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my team kind of work on.
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So I try to be selective as to when I can schedule certain things, whether that be for
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the fire department or for for myself for this business.
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But generally speaking, like they're super flexible and allows me to be allows me to
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do kind of both things.
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I mean, I have minimum requirements I have to meet at the station to do this type of
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training this much and I have to meet this many meetings or this many response, this
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much response volume each year.
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You know, there's like things I have to do, maintain certification, education, things
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like that.
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But as long as I'm hitting those or exceeding those, then all is well.
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Awesome.
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00:18:47,040 --> 00:18:53,080
So we've discussed a bit of your route setting career, your firefighting career.
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But this is like a climbing podcast, I guess.
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So we'll get back into the route setting.
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So you've discussed a bit about your setting journey in the US.
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How did you become an IFC route setter?
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Great question.
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And minor clarification or maybe major clarification.
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So I'm technically not like I would try to make sure that like this is like a people
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know this like so there's like a very, very rigorous and very specific and then arguably,
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depending on you're talking about political process as to like what who gets their IFC
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license.
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So it's a very specific thing.
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So I never want to take credit for that because I do not have that.
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We do have a couple of folks in the US who do have that, which is awesome and aspiring
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one day to hopefully get that opportunity.
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But I've managed to work on a number of international events because there's like certain requirements
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that say, okay, you need to have like this many route setters that are hired and hired
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by the IFC.
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And then there's like a number of other slots that basically get filled by the host federation
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of the event organizer, the head route setter kind of conglomerate.
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So depending on what their needs are and what they what the expectations are of the event
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or the event sponsors or the venue itself.
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I mean, there could be any number of things that might make the event a little bit easier,
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a little bit more logistically complex, typically if it's a little bit more logistically complex.
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And I'm just like painting broad strokes here.
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Like what I've found is they'll add an extra spot or an extra two spots in the setting
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team because they're like, oh, things could get crazy.
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There's more likelihood that like a mistake could be made or that the schedule could get
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shifted or the timelines could bounce around or you know what I mean?
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So they try to like in those situations, like add a couple extra folks.
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And then who they add is it's kind of like a three step process.
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The chief chief has to be involved, the event organizer and host federation has to be involved
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and the IFC has to kind of sign off on this.
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So it's a little can be good can be quite complicated to be completely frank.
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And I don't quite know my way around at all.
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But I just put my my hat my name in the hat, I guess.
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And especially last year, it was able to work out quite nicely.
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But I had experience prior to that.
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So my family is all from Poland.
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I'm a Polish citizen, Polish citizen and American citizen.
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And a few years ago, 2016, I went to visit my family in Poland and then also go on vacation
355
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and.
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Super long story short, ended up setting the European Youth Cup in Warsaw for its inaugural
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event, which was kind of just shit luck, to be completely frank.
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Another just lucky situation, maybe right place, right time.
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I contacted Chris Danielson, who I referenced earlier, and I was, hey, you know, I'm going
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to Poland and visiting my family.
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I noticed that there's a competition series going on over there.
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And like if you know, I don't know if you know anyone on that circuit or whatever, but
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like I'd be more than happy to just like wash holds or tape or brush or I don't know, whatever,
364
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just so I can like see what it's like to be involved in that type of circuit.
365
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Because at this point, I'd already set for numerous regionals, divisionals, dark horse,
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private comps had done a number of nationals.
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So I like, you know, I kind of I had some familiarity with the U.S. circuit and I knew
368
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that, OK, there's this other step and I just want to get involved and learn.
369
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So I was like, well, you know, go hang out for a little bit, learn from these guys.
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And Chris, you know, he was a busy guy, like he didn't really get back to me for a little
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while.
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And I'm like, that probably means that it's going to happen.
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And I was a little bit like, oh, well, I'll still go and watch the comp, you know, no
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worries.
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And then the day we were leaving, I got a phone call from Chris and he's like, hey,
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did you leave yet?
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And I was like, no, I'm like literally about to leave to like hop in the car and go to
378
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the airport in Atlanta.
379
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And he's like, if do you want to root set for this comp?
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Because something happened and two of the root setters got injured and they can't find
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any replacements, like any qualified people.
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And I was like, yes, yes, I do want to root set for this event.
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So that's kind of what kicked it off.
384
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And then I maintained these contacts and worked with these folks and other and other instances
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over the years.
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And yeah, here we are.
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Okay.
388
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Yeah.
389
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So not an IFSC route setter, but I guess you kind of just got picked to route set for a
390
00:23:35,320 --> 00:23:36,320
few of the competitions.
391
00:23:36,320 --> 00:23:40,120
Yeah, I think it's kind of like, kind of like what I was referencing earlier, like they
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already had their like official crew of people.
393
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But there's like for for like each event, you know, like let's say the IFSC picks three
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people like one chief and two official route setters.
395
00:23:52,800 --> 00:23:57,480
Every comp that I was a part of this year had a minimum of eight, eight route setters.
396
00:23:57,480 --> 00:24:02,160
So that's five other slots that are getting filled by the host federation.
397
00:24:02,160 --> 00:24:05,720
You know, like so for us, that's USA climbing, right?
398
00:24:05,720 --> 00:24:10,680
Or if it's, you know, Japan, it's the JMSCA.
399
00:24:10,680 --> 00:24:17,160
So the chief might say, hey, you know, you got good recommendations from so and so, like
400
00:24:17,160 --> 00:24:22,600
if you're around and we can get approval and IFSC checks off on this and the event organizers
401
00:24:22,600 --> 00:24:24,640
cool like maybe you want to come join.
402
00:24:24,640 --> 00:24:25,640
Yeah.
403
00:24:25,640 --> 00:24:32,400
So it does require a lot of I guess like self-starting, you know.
404
00:24:32,400 --> 00:24:38,640
So you know, like let's say for Hachioji, Remy, you know, message me and ask me, hey,
405
00:24:38,640 --> 00:24:41,640
love to have you on the crew would be super nice.
406
00:24:41,640 --> 00:24:43,000
I've enjoyed working with you.
407
00:24:43,000 --> 00:24:48,080
In the past, we worked a couple of events together and he's like, but it's not, it's
408
00:24:48,080 --> 00:24:50,880
not just like this like homeboy hookup situation.
409
00:24:50,880 --> 00:24:55,000
You can't just like be on the crew because I say that you can be on the crew, which at
410
00:24:55,000 --> 00:24:57,360
first I kind of honestly, I thought that's what it was.
411
00:24:57,360 --> 00:25:00,400
Like to be completely frank, I was kind of like, that's just what it is, right?
412
00:25:00,400 --> 00:25:01,840
Like that's just how this happens.
413
00:25:01,840 --> 00:25:07,880
And it's not, it's like it, it helps to have contacts just like any industry, maybe on
414
00:25:07,880 --> 00:25:08,880
planet earth, right?
415
00:25:08,880 --> 00:25:12,760
It helps to know people who have involvement in the thing that maybe you want to be involved
416
00:25:12,760 --> 00:25:17,840
in, but it is far from the buck stopping here, so to speak.
417
00:25:17,840 --> 00:25:23,880
So after that, I had to contact like on my own, I had to contact the event organizer
418
00:25:23,880 --> 00:25:27,080
and the director of sport for Japan.
419
00:25:27,080 --> 00:25:31,680
And I was like pretty petrified because I had no clue what this meant.
420
00:25:31,680 --> 00:25:36,240
And then they had a bunch of internal conversations.
421
00:25:36,240 --> 00:25:38,400
I wrote a bunch of emails in Japanese.
422
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Apparently, I didn't offend anyone too, too much.
423
00:25:41,600 --> 00:25:45,160
The translator was my friend.
424
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And just to like do the respectful thing, you know, try to do my best there.
425
00:25:48,520 --> 00:25:53,280
And then once those two things got approved, I guess, the IFSC said, okay, cool.
426
00:25:53,280 --> 00:25:55,080
Like this is Remy, this is your team.
427
00:25:55,080 --> 00:25:57,400
Okay, have all these like check marks been made?
428
00:25:57,400 --> 00:25:59,400
Yep, yep, yep, yep, yep.
429
00:25:59,400 --> 00:26:00,400
All right.
430
00:26:00,400 --> 00:26:01,400
Now you're green light.
431
00:26:01,400 --> 00:26:04,760
So that's a little bit of the behind the scenes, but it's not always that way.
432
00:26:04,760 --> 00:26:06,120
So this is just my experience.
433
00:26:06,120 --> 00:26:09,840
It's not like everyone's experience, always some other folks, if you interview them, they
434
00:26:09,840 --> 00:26:11,800
might say like, oh, for me, it was different.
435
00:26:11,800 --> 00:26:15,800
But that was more or less my experience over the past couple years.
436
00:26:15,800 --> 00:26:20,400
Well, it's a very kind of long and windy experience, I guess.
437
00:26:20,400 --> 00:26:31,480
I think, yeah, like the first guest I had talked to, Nicholas, Nikki, if you're familiar,
438
00:26:31,480 --> 00:26:39,120
he was saying that there was maybe like a like a Google Sheet kind of deal.
439
00:26:39,120 --> 00:26:43,080
And then you like sign up and then they choose people from that.
440
00:26:43,080 --> 00:26:46,600
Or like signing up on a Google form or something like that.
441
00:26:46,600 --> 00:26:52,480
Something just also very informal and like not a very strict process.
442
00:26:52,480 --> 00:26:57,280
So now it's become even more confusing for me as to how they choose people.
443
00:26:57,280 --> 00:26:58,280
Yeah, maybe.
444
00:26:58,280 --> 00:27:00,320
Yeah, I'd love to talk to him.
445
00:27:00,320 --> 00:27:03,880
I think I'll see him in a couple of weeks.
446
00:27:03,880 --> 00:27:05,600
But that's all I'll ask him about this.
447
00:27:05,600 --> 00:27:09,840
Maybe that has to do with their own internal Federation selection.
448
00:27:09,840 --> 00:27:15,160
So from like a formal Federation selection process, they might say, OK, here's our list.
449
00:27:15,160 --> 00:27:17,760
Like we at U.S. Air climbing, we do a version of this, right?
450
00:27:17,760 --> 00:27:25,160
Hey, based on certification level and experience, this group of folks is qualified to represent
451
00:27:25,160 --> 00:27:30,160
the U.S. So what we're going to do is we're going to have this application window.
452
00:27:30,160 --> 00:27:33,840
Are you, you know, and then on that window, maybe they maybe they just have a Google form,
453
00:27:33,840 --> 00:27:36,160
you know, to represent that application.
454
00:27:36,160 --> 00:27:40,160
And then from there, maybe like for us, our route setting committee reviews it and then
455
00:27:40,160 --> 00:27:43,240
our VP of sport reviews it and our CEO of U.S. Air climbing reviews it.
456
00:27:43,240 --> 00:27:48,080
And then collaboratively selection is made based on the best representatives for our
457
00:27:48,080 --> 00:27:49,840
country.
458
00:27:49,840 --> 00:27:55,080
So maybe I would assume that the German Federation does something similarly.
459
00:27:55,080 --> 00:27:56,080
Maybe that's what he's referencing.
460
00:27:56,080 --> 00:27:57,080
But I don't know.
461
00:27:57,080 --> 00:27:58,840
Yeah, it's a lot.
462
00:27:58,840 --> 00:28:01,800
Maybe one day there'll be like a more formal.
463
00:28:01,800 --> 00:28:04,160
I don't even know some kind of process.
464
00:28:04,160 --> 00:28:06,140
Yeah, they're working on it.
465
00:28:06,140 --> 00:28:07,140
They're working on it.
466
00:28:07,140 --> 00:28:10,120
It's slow going, but yeah, one day.
467
00:28:10,120 --> 00:28:16,360
So yeah, you sat in a lot of World Cups in the twenty twenty three season.
468
00:28:16,360 --> 00:28:24,840
I think it was Hachioji, Prague, Innsbruck and then also the World Champs in Bern.
469
00:28:24,840 --> 00:28:28,280
Of those, did you have like a favorite wall that you sat on?
470
00:28:28,280 --> 00:28:31,160
Oh, that's a good question.
471
00:28:31,160 --> 00:28:32,160
Favorite wall.
472
00:28:32,160 --> 00:28:35,960
I'm trying to think back.
473
00:28:35,960 --> 00:28:36,960
I don't know.
474
00:28:36,960 --> 00:28:39,400
They're all like.
475
00:28:39,400 --> 00:28:45,080
They're all so cool and so special for like totally different reasons.
476
00:28:45,080 --> 00:28:49,800
You know, the the wall in Hachioji, I mean, like it's it's Hachioji Japan.
477
00:28:49,800 --> 00:28:51,120
It's like the World Cup in Japan.
478
00:28:51,120 --> 00:28:54,600
For me, that's always been on this massive pedestal.
479
00:28:54,600 --> 00:28:55,600
I don't know why.
480
00:28:55,600 --> 00:28:59,440
Just like maybe looking back historically, like watching those comps, I was always just
481
00:28:59,440 --> 00:29:06,640
very engaged and always in my mind, I was like, man, be so cool one day to like just
482
00:29:06,640 --> 00:29:08,400
have a chance to be a part of something like that.
483
00:29:08,400 --> 00:29:14,160
So then with that being to like kick off the twenty twenty three season and until like
484
00:29:14,160 --> 00:29:18,160
I had never been to Asia before, you know, for me, just like that whole it was the whole
485
00:29:18,160 --> 00:29:23,760
combo, you know, and the wall itself, like from like a physical standpoint was like massive.
486
00:29:23,760 --> 00:29:26,080
We had amazing resources.
487
00:29:26,080 --> 00:29:30,920
GMSEA sent us like awesome, awesome, awesome holds all the hold manufacturers.
488
00:29:30,920 --> 00:29:34,560
You know, they were like just cranking out awesome new shapes.
489
00:29:34,560 --> 00:29:40,040
We got we got a lot of cool new holds to play with and create some cool, cool situations.
490
00:29:40,040 --> 00:29:41,040
So that's special.
491
00:29:41,040 --> 00:29:42,040
Right.
492
00:29:42,040 --> 00:29:43,800
But then you could look at all the other ones like Prague and Innsbruck.
493
00:29:43,800 --> 00:29:47,880
And I mean, Burn, like they're all just so special for their own ways.
494
00:29:47,880 --> 00:29:48,880
Burn was cool.
495
00:29:48,880 --> 00:29:49,880
It was in this huge venue.
496
00:29:49,880 --> 00:29:55,640
One of my personal dreams, like I even had on a notepad somewhere like a journal that
497
00:29:55,640 --> 00:30:01,600
I was like from years ago, I was like, I just want to set an event in like a huge arena.
498
00:30:01,600 --> 00:30:06,440
And I didn't really care really what the arena was or what the event was.
499
00:30:06,440 --> 00:30:13,200
But I would look at like Adidas Rockstars or like the World Cup in or sorry, the European
500
00:30:13,200 --> 00:30:17,140
Championships in Munich in twenty nineteen.
501
00:30:17,140 --> 00:30:18,320
Maybe it was.
502
00:30:18,320 --> 00:30:21,560
And just seeing like, oh, they're at the Mercedes Arena or something like that.
503
00:30:21,560 --> 00:30:23,560
And just being like, that's the pinnacle.
504
00:30:23,560 --> 00:30:24,560
Right.
505
00:30:24,560 --> 00:30:27,600
And then the arena for the sport that you're so passionate about.
506
00:30:27,600 --> 00:30:30,160
And then to be involved in that.
507
00:30:30,160 --> 00:30:35,680
Yeah, just like sometimes a little overwhelming almost just like stepping back and being like,
508
00:30:35,680 --> 00:30:38,760
holy shit, like this is so cool.
509
00:30:38,760 --> 00:30:40,320
And you got to reel it back in.
510
00:30:40,320 --> 00:30:45,120
But, you know, it ends up like it hit me a lot, hit me a lot a lot of times.
511
00:30:45,120 --> 00:30:47,240
So no, it's really cool.
512
00:30:47,240 --> 00:30:49,000
You kind of like manifested it.
513
00:30:49,000 --> 00:30:52,800
So that's always that's always good to hear.
514
00:30:52,800 --> 00:30:57,960
But speaking of Hachioji and how much you enjoyed that process, that kind of sounds
515
00:30:57,960 --> 00:31:02,320
like it was kind of your favorite based on how you're describing it.
516
00:31:02,320 --> 00:31:09,440
It kind of reminded me of one of the comments that I saw in YouTube for that competition
517
00:31:09,440 --> 00:31:11,600
about their outstanding.
518
00:31:11,600 --> 00:31:16,440
So I guess we'll sort of segue into this segment where you're going to read all the hate comments
519
00:31:16,440 --> 00:31:17,440
that I picked out.
520
00:31:17,440 --> 00:31:18,440
Perfect.
521
00:31:18,440 --> 00:31:24,880
This is bringing me back to like my commercial root setting days where we get like the little
522
00:31:24,880 --> 00:31:27,600
oh, like comments box.
523
00:31:27,600 --> 00:31:31,920
It's like one out of 15 is like, hey, nice job, guys.
524
00:31:31,920 --> 00:31:32,920
Keep it up.
525
00:31:32,920 --> 00:31:33,920
And the rest is like, this sucks.
526
00:31:33,920 --> 00:31:34,920
Perfect.
527
00:31:34,920 --> 00:31:41,280
So yeah, we'll get to see in real time what it's like when Routesitters read that.
528
00:31:41,280 --> 00:31:47,200
Yeah, I think it reminded me of this one where I don't remember if I picked it or not.
529
00:31:47,200 --> 00:31:49,880
You sounded really excited about Hachioji.
530
00:31:49,880 --> 00:31:54,040
And I think one of the comments was like, oh, I think the Routesitters had like too
531
00:31:54,040 --> 00:31:55,480
much time on this one.
532
00:31:55,480 --> 00:32:00,000
They like had too much fun with it and ended up being way overcooked.
533
00:32:00,000 --> 00:32:07,400
But let me share the Google Drive with you and then we can open them.
534
00:32:07,400 --> 00:32:09,080
Yeah, you can go for it.
535
00:32:09,080 --> 00:32:10,080
Okay.
536
00:32:10,080 --> 00:32:14,280
The root setting was one, too hard, especially since the semis already take a toll on basically
537
00:32:14,280 --> 00:32:15,280
everyone.
538
00:32:15,280 --> 00:32:16,280
Very fair point.
539
00:32:16,280 --> 00:32:21,560
Two, not especially effective in terms of separation.
540
00:32:21,560 --> 00:32:23,080
Arguable but fair.
541
00:32:23,080 --> 00:32:26,680
Three, not fun to look at.
542
00:32:26,680 --> 00:32:33,560
Depending on your perspective, again, arguable, but I see where they're coming from.
543
00:32:33,560 --> 00:32:37,040
And then let's see, every year we seem to get more and more new school setting.
544
00:32:37,040 --> 00:32:39,680
Now it's running dinos at about three meter height.
545
00:32:39,680 --> 00:32:44,020
It's about like nine feet accurate.
546
00:32:44,020 --> 00:32:47,080
So we watched six people attempt the same move for about 30 minutes.
547
00:32:47,080 --> 00:32:48,080
Great.
548
00:32:48,080 --> 00:32:50,480
Why not involve more actual climbing moves?
549
00:32:50,480 --> 00:32:52,560
You can still make it look appealing to a casual audience.
550
00:32:52,560 --> 00:32:56,040
Make the moves 3D, involve knee bars, hooks, campus moves, et cetera.
551
00:32:56,040 --> 00:33:00,000
There's so much bouldering that will look cool without resorting to parkour so often.
552
00:33:00,000 --> 00:33:01,000
Cool.
553
00:33:01,000 --> 00:33:08,080
I mean, the first thing is that it's nice that they kind of have like a, it's not quite
554
00:33:08,080 --> 00:33:12,880
like if then statements, but it's constructive.
555
00:33:12,880 --> 00:33:17,000
Maybe it's a little bit negative, but it's not like hate for hate's sake.
556
00:33:17,000 --> 00:33:18,560
They're not like, this sucks.
557
00:33:18,560 --> 00:33:23,440
I run a lot of clinics and I probably run 12 to 15 clinics a year and it's one of the
558
00:33:23,440 --> 00:33:27,800
things we talk about with giving feedback is kind of like make it actionable or at least
559
00:33:27,800 --> 00:33:32,280
express yourself why more than just like this is too reachy or this is bad.
560
00:33:32,280 --> 00:33:34,080
That doesn't help too much.
561
00:33:34,080 --> 00:33:38,600
So this person, Cedric, had some nice points.
562
00:33:38,600 --> 00:33:39,600
Too hard.
563
00:33:39,600 --> 00:33:40,600
So that's the first point.
564
00:33:40,600 --> 00:33:41,600
Yes, absolutely.
565
00:33:41,600 --> 00:33:48,960
I mean, no doubt at all, numerically or otherwise, that it was too hard, especially since the
566
00:33:48,960 --> 00:33:51,440
semis already took a toll on basically everyone.
567
00:33:51,440 --> 00:33:54,280
And yeah, they're not wrong.
568
00:33:54,280 --> 00:33:56,520
First comp of the season, we haven't seen a World Cup.
569
00:33:56,520 --> 00:34:06,600
We haven't seen really any high level route setting or competition climbing since, I mean,
570
00:34:06,600 --> 00:34:07,600
Munich.
571
00:34:07,600 --> 00:34:12,520
Yeah, Munich was 2022 European Championships.
572
00:34:12,520 --> 00:34:16,160
So like myself and a few of the other route setters who were in Hachioji were on that.
573
00:34:16,160 --> 00:34:20,120
We hadn't really seen anything or anyone since then.
574
00:34:20,120 --> 00:34:24,600
You watch their, maybe their videos online like, oh wow, Yoshioki is looking real strong
575
00:34:24,600 --> 00:34:30,040
or Miho looks amazing or, you know, Yanya is in peak form or whatever, right?
576
00:34:30,040 --> 00:34:31,440
There's all these like things.
577
00:34:31,440 --> 00:34:34,320
And then you get to the comp week and you're like, okay, we actually now have to make like
578
00:34:34,320 --> 00:34:38,800
pretty real decisions on what we want these moves to look like and feel like and kick
579
00:34:38,800 --> 00:34:43,820
it off with a bang and meet the obligations of the event while meeting the obligations
580
00:34:43,820 --> 00:34:47,380
of the audience.
581
00:34:47,380 --> 00:34:50,440
And so semis, semis are always hard.
582
00:34:50,440 --> 00:34:52,160
Like that's just the way that it is.
583
00:34:52,160 --> 00:34:56,460
You kind of have to have it that way to separate, to get as much separation as you possibly
584
00:34:56,460 --> 00:34:57,820
can going into finals.
585
00:34:57,820 --> 00:35:03,280
And then typically what that does is it allows us to have a better show for finals and we
586
00:35:03,280 --> 00:35:10,240
can, we can play a little bit more with movements and things like that if we have like a harder
587
00:35:10,240 --> 00:35:11,240
semis.
588
00:35:11,240 --> 00:35:15,520
But it can bite you in the ass, which it did for us.
589
00:35:15,520 --> 00:35:20,600
And that was because we set a really hard semis for both men's and women's.
590
00:35:20,600 --> 00:35:25,040
And it, yeah, it was just like too much of a toll with not enough rest, I think, for
591
00:35:25,040 --> 00:35:28,840
the athletes in between.
592
00:35:28,840 --> 00:35:31,280
Let's see, next point.
593
00:35:31,280 --> 00:35:34,120
It's kind of what we talked about, not especially effective in terms of separation.
594
00:35:34,120 --> 00:35:36,760
It's like we got the separation, right?
595
00:35:36,760 --> 00:35:42,480
So separation is, depending on how you want to look at it, maybe they're talking more
596
00:35:42,480 --> 00:35:48,320
like relatively speaking, but like objectively separation is like, do we have a ranking?
597
00:35:48,320 --> 00:35:50,520
One through whatever, 50.
598
00:35:50,520 --> 00:35:55,280
And we did, we had a ranking, but it just wasn't like the ideal ranking probably because
599
00:35:55,280 --> 00:35:59,680
of the way that optically the boulders performed, right?
600
00:35:59,680 --> 00:36:04,000
Which kind of then bleeds into like 0.3, which is not fun to look at.
601
00:36:04,000 --> 00:36:09,240
And yeah, straight up, it is like not that much fun to watch climbers try and fail, basically
602
00:36:09,240 --> 00:36:10,880
pulling off the mats, right?
603
00:36:10,880 --> 00:36:12,880
For minutes at a time.
604
00:36:12,880 --> 00:36:15,760
And then you're like hoping, ah, maybe this next athlete will figure it out and they don't
605
00:36:15,760 --> 00:36:16,760
figure it out.
606
00:36:16,760 --> 00:36:17,760
And you're like, damn it.
607
00:36:17,760 --> 00:36:19,000
It's not fun for anybody.
608
00:36:19,000 --> 00:36:24,200
The roots setters very, very, very, very much included.
609
00:36:24,200 --> 00:36:34,160
I think that the latter points in this comment are a little bit, how do I say this?
610
00:36:34,160 --> 00:36:42,160
Like how do I say this without even, it's not so simple.
611
00:36:42,160 --> 00:36:46,600
It's not so simple to just say, like, why not just involve actual more climbing moves
612
00:36:46,600 --> 00:36:51,840
to appeal to a casual audience and like add a knee bar or a heel or whatever.
613
00:36:51,840 --> 00:36:57,160
Every single one of these athletes, like if you look at any World Cup, semifinals and
614
00:36:57,160 --> 00:37:03,520
above for every event, and I don't even care, pick from 2020 onwards, nearly every single
615
00:37:03,520 --> 00:37:07,520
one of these athletes minimum climbs 8B boulders.
616
00:37:07,520 --> 00:37:08,600
Minimum.
617
00:37:08,600 --> 00:37:11,480
They're like maddeningly strong.
618
00:37:11,480 --> 00:37:13,140
They're so good.
619
00:37:13,140 --> 00:37:14,360
This is their full time job.
620
00:37:14,360 --> 00:37:15,760
This is their life.
621
00:37:15,760 --> 00:37:19,440
This is everything that they work for, train for, breathe for.
622
00:37:19,440 --> 00:37:24,080
They have six opportunities per year to give their absolute all.
623
00:37:24,080 --> 00:37:31,880
There's just like really not an effective, feasible way to put very straightforward,
624
00:37:31,880 --> 00:37:45,300
traditionally set rock climbing moves on the wall and achieve that ranking and visual appeal.
625
00:37:45,300 --> 00:37:49,240
It gets to the point where it's quite ineffective, I think, actually.
626
00:37:49,240 --> 00:37:50,760
You still need to represent physical style.
627
00:37:50,760 --> 00:37:53,880
You still need to represent climbing style.
628
00:37:53,880 --> 00:37:54,880
Don't get me twisted.
629
00:37:54,880 --> 00:37:57,480
That's not what I'm saying that like, oh, all these moves needs to be parkour or all
630
00:37:57,480 --> 00:38:00,040
these moves need to be like crazy, crazy things.
631
00:38:00,040 --> 00:38:07,400
But we have to introduce the concepts of risk, intensity and complexity in a very particular
632
00:38:07,400 --> 00:38:12,300
and exciting way for both the athletes and the audience to make sure that we get that
633
00:38:12,300 --> 00:38:14,480
separation in that amount of time.
634
00:38:14,480 --> 00:38:20,800
Because if we don't play with those other levels of risk and complexity and we just
635
00:38:20,800 --> 00:38:25,160
lean on intensity, you kind of end up with a situation of a yes or no or a black or a
636
00:38:25,160 --> 00:38:26,560
white or a zero or a one.
637
00:38:26,560 --> 00:38:31,720
Either do the move or don't do the move and there's no chance of creating any sort of
638
00:38:31,720 --> 00:38:33,920
crescendo effect.
639
00:38:33,920 --> 00:38:35,920
You kind of saw this maybe at the World Cup in Prague.
640
00:38:35,920 --> 00:38:39,840
There was a couple boulders that we set that were like the intensity during boulders and
641
00:38:39,840 --> 00:38:45,240
literally nobody but like Janya could touch them because nobody was straight up strong
642
00:38:45,240 --> 00:38:48,160
enough to pull on those holds.
643
00:38:48,160 --> 00:38:51,040
So it was like kind of cool in a way because you're like, oh wow, look how much stronger
644
00:38:51,040 --> 00:38:53,000
Janya is in the rest of the field.
645
00:38:53,000 --> 00:38:54,000
Great.
646
00:38:54,000 --> 00:38:57,800
But then you're still having the same situation occur where you're having five other people
647
00:38:57,800 --> 00:39:01,280
prior or 19 other people prior depending on the round.
648
00:39:01,280 --> 00:39:05,080
Kind of like try fail, try fail, try fail because it's just a yes or no question.
649
00:39:05,080 --> 00:39:09,440
There's no way for them to get better and learn the movements in any amount of time.
650
00:39:09,440 --> 00:39:10,720
Does that kind of make sense?
651
00:39:10,720 --> 00:39:11,720
Yeah, that makes sense.
652
00:39:11,720 --> 00:39:16,920
And I guess in the Janya situation or I guess on the men's side, I don't think there's like
653
00:39:16,920 --> 00:39:22,400
one guy that stands out as being so much stronger than anyone else.
654
00:39:22,400 --> 00:39:24,000
I would agree with that.
655
00:39:24,000 --> 00:39:25,000
For most things.
656
00:39:25,000 --> 00:39:30,440
I mean, there definitely are stylistic climbers more so on the men's side.
657
00:39:30,440 --> 00:39:35,160
Whereas the women's side, you kind of have Janya traditionally on all styles, maybe not
658
00:39:35,160 --> 00:39:38,380
so much slab, but even then she's really good.
659
00:39:38,380 --> 00:39:44,880
And then there's a hyper competitive field with the women below that two through 15 or
660
00:39:44,880 --> 00:39:46,360
something like that.
661
00:39:46,360 --> 00:39:48,800
So yeah, it's great.
662
00:39:48,800 --> 00:39:49,920
Great feedback though, for sure.
663
00:39:49,920 --> 00:39:52,760
And it's not something that we didn't think about.
664
00:39:52,760 --> 00:40:00,080
Basically the summary of this is that we pushed too many new concepts too frequently or out
665
00:40:00,080 --> 00:40:01,320
of the gate.
666
00:40:01,320 --> 00:40:02,320
That was it.
667
00:40:02,320 --> 00:40:07,600
This like crazy parkour thing that they're referencing, I think it was men's three, but
668
00:40:07,600 --> 00:40:12,680
it was teal volumes and yellow holds and it was like a pretty difficult and tricky move
669
00:40:12,680 --> 00:40:13,840
around the left side of the arete.
670
00:40:13,840 --> 00:40:16,440
And then you ran it like, yeah, probably two and a half meters.
671
00:40:16,440 --> 00:40:18,280
Did this like crazy parkour.
672
00:40:18,280 --> 00:40:22,520
I mean, it wasn't parkour as much as it was like a paddle dyno, but it was like multiple
673
00:40:22,520 --> 00:40:26,760
hand move paddle while also timing the feet quite high.
674
00:40:26,760 --> 00:40:33,040
And I think it was just too late in the boulder to push that much.
675
00:40:33,040 --> 00:40:37,240
Because if you get it wrong and you go too easy, then everyone just like stops and skips,
676
00:40:37,240 --> 00:40:38,240
stops and skips.
677
00:40:38,240 --> 00:40:43,640
And you saw this a couple of times in Meringen and I think in 2021 or 2022, where there was
678
00:40:43,640 --> 00:40:48,160
a couple of instances of that where they aired on the side of a little bit of caution to
679
00:40:48,160 --> 00:40:50,320
see more tops or more zones.
680
00:40:50,320 --> 00:40:55,760
But then there were a notable number of instances where the climbers were like stronger than
681
00:40:55,760 --> 00:41:01,200
the boulder and they kind of, it didn't look as exciting for the audience especially too.
682
00:41:01,200 --> 00:41:04,880
And then they got even less separation because they just kind of all ran it.
683
00:41:04,880 --> 00:41:05,880
I see.
684
00:41:05,880 --> 00:41:12,040
I think, yeah, another big one was probably the last boulder which was M4 with the jump
685
00:41:12,040 --> 00:41:14,360
into the press.
686
00:41:14,360 --> 00:41:16,600
But yeah, now people are used to that.
687
00:41:16,600 --> 00:41:17,600
So I think it's...
688
00:41:17,600 --> 00:41:24,920
Oh man, it's like, that's a boulder now where I just like, I would love, and there's no
689
00:41:24,920 --> 00:41:28,920
way to do it, but I would love to like get all those athletes back on the wall, four
690
00:41:28,920 --> 00:41:33,960
on four off, put that same boulder on the wall and then see what the results would be
691
00:41:33,960 --> 00:41:34,960
because of the familiarity.
692
00:41:34,960 --> 00:41:41,280
And we got a chance to do that in burn and we saw, it wasn't identical by any stretch,
693
00:41:41,280 --> 00:41:44,480
but it was a very, very similar style of move.
694
00:41:44,480 --> 00:41:50,960
And we saw, I think three of six got zoned and two top.
695
00:41:50,960 --> 00:41:54,600
And one person was actually getting, there was a fourth person, I believe it was Nikolai,
696
00:41:54,600 --> 00:41:56,120
got really close to getting zoned.
697
00:41:56,120 --> 00:42:01,280
So you almost had a four of six, whereas you saw zeros across the board for Hachi-Achi.
698
00:42:01,280 --> 00:42:07,560
Yeah, it was very confusing to see, but I guess pretty much a brand new move.
699
00:42:07,560 --> 00:42:09,280
I don't think we had seen it before.
700
00:42:09,280 --> 00:42:12,880
Yeah, brand new move, I think, especially at that level.
701
00:42:12,880 --> 00:42:18,960
I mean, maybe, I would imagine just like the probability is that someone has fooled around
702
00:42:18,960 --> 00:42:24,480
with that move somewhere in the world and maybe set a version of it, but not on that
703
00:42:24,480 --> 00:42:26,320
type of scale and that type of purity.
704
00:42:26,320 --> 00:42:31,040
I mean, that was also maybe the problem is that there was no way around it.
705
00:42:31,040 --> 00:42:36,920
It was, you had to do this and it was like just so complex because, and the complexity
706
00:42:36,920 --> 00:42:38,040
was high because you'd never seen it.
707
00:42:38,040 --> 00:42:39,520
So how do you know what you don't know?
708
00:42:39,520 --> 00:42:43,840
When we were testing it, it felt like bananas for so long.
709
00:42:43,840 --> 00:42:47,720
And then all of a sudden we just like took a break, got a coffee, put on some music and
710
00:42:47,720 --> 00:42:51,600
then Serhiu did the move, Remy did the move, I did the move, literally.
711
00:42:51,600 --> 00:42:54,880
I have like a video, it was like a running video of just like bang, bang, bang.
712
00:42:54,880 --> 00:42:57,120
And we were like, what?
713
00:42:57,120 --> 00:42:59,600
We've been working on this for two hours, tinkering, whatever.
714
00:42:59,600 --> 00:43:02,360
And then it's been right here like the whole time.
715
00:43:02,360 --> 00:43:06,200
And I think we undersold that aspect of it to be completely honest.
716
00:43:06,200 --> 00:43:08,280
We were like, oh, well, who the hell are we?
717
00:43:08,280 --> 00:43:11,480
Like they'll definitely figure that it's Mejdi Shalke.
718
00:43:11,480 --> 00:43:15,440
He's, we didn't know at the time, but he's like an Olympian now, right?
719
00:43:15,440 --> 00:43:18,240
You have the best athletes in the world.
720
00:43:18,240 --> 00:43:25,880
They're way better, but we didn't effectively turn the dial appropriately for the four-minute
721
00:43:25,880 --> 00:43:31,400
window that they had for on-site and the fact that it was so, so, so new.
722
00:43:31,400 --> 00:43:32,400
Yeah.
723
00:43:32,400 --> 00:43:34,120
So that was the first comment for Hachioji.
724
00:43:34,120 --> 00:43:40,000
And then I'll put images up of the comments as well as the boulders for people who are
725
00:43:40,000 --> 00:43:41,080
watching on video.
726
00:43:41,080 --> 00:43:43,560
So you can see that.
727
00:43:43,560 --> 00:43:47,460
Let's actually move on to the Hachioji Men's 3.
728
00:43:47,460 --> 00:43:49,560
So this was the one I was talking about.
729
00:43:49,560 --> 00:43:54,440
This one says, I just wish the setters would tone down the insanity next World Cup.
730
00:43:54,440 --> 00:43:56,240
They might've had too much free time.
731
00:43:56,240 --> 00:44:00,320
They convinced themselves their boulder problems are possible in four minutes.
732
00:44:00,320 --> 00:44:01,320
Yeah.
733
00:44:01,320 --> 00:44:05,120
I mean, I think I kind of hit on that at the end there a little bit.
734
00:44:05,120 --> 00:44:06,600
Like definitely I'll say this.
735
00:44:06,600 --> 00:44:10,080
It was 100% not too much free time.
736
00:44:10,080 --> 00:44:18,600
That was one of the more time restricted events due to the location of where we were hosting
737
00:44:18,600 --> 00:44:19,600
it.
738
00:44:19,600 --> 00:44:23,560
We were forced to, we couldn't enter the facility before a certain time and we had
739
00:44:23,560 --> 00:44:29,920
to leave the facility by, I think it was 10 PM every single day, which typically we have
740
00:44:29,920 --> 00:44:30,920
until there's no limit.
741
00:44:30,920 --> 00:44:36,480
I mean, we'll be at the wall until 1 AM, 2 AM, 4 AM.
742
00:44:36,480 --> 00:44:41,800
Like it's yeah, like, and it's not like because, oh, we're like just sitting there tinkering.
743
00:44:41,800 --> 00:44:46,920
It's like the work has to get done and to dial this right.
744
00:44:46,920 --> 00:44:49,000
That's just what it takes a lot of the time.
745
00:44:49,000 --> 00:44:51,360
So we didn't have, we did not have too much free time.
746
00:44:51,360 --> 00:44:55,520
If anything, maybe if we had more free time or more time in general, we would have been
747
00:44:55,520 --> 00:44:58,160
able to calibrate a little bit better.
748
00:44:58,160 --> 00:45:01,760
I would say that that could be a thing, but we did definitely convince ourselves that
749
00:45:01,760 --> 00:45:04,760
the boulder problems were possible in four minutes because we wouldn't have left them
750
00:45:04,760 --> 00:45:05,760
on the wall.
751
00:45:05,760 --> 00:45:10,960
Otherwise we don't want to like see a bloodbath of athletes.
752
00:45:10,960 --> 00:45:15,480
Like we want to create an environment where all the athletes have the best opportunity
753
00:45:15,480 --> 00:45:17,640
to showcase their skills and succeed.
754
00:45:17,640 --> 00:45:19,680
And it's up to them to make that happen.
755
00:45:19,680 --> 00:45:21,160
That's what we want to see.
756
00:45:21,160 --> 00:45:25,200
In the ideal world, you have this perfect crescendo and everyone's like getting closer
757
00:45:25,200 --> 00:45:29,560
and higher and there's this battle and there's this back and forth and who's going to win
758
00:45:29,560 --> 00:45:30,560
it.
759
00:45:30,560 --> 00:45:31,560
You know, like that's super cool.
760
00:45:31,560 --> 00:45:33,360
Like everyone loves that.
761
00:45:33,360 --> 00:45:37,240
Yeah, we missed the mark on that one.
762
00:45:37,240 --> 00:45:39,720
But how do you know until you try?
763
00:45:39,720 --> 00:45:42,640
And sometimes you just don't.
764
00:45:42,640 --> 00:45:47,160
And I think sometimes you need to have these events that pushes things because we pushed
765
00:45:47,160 --> 00:45:48,920
things.
766
00:45:48,920 --> 00:45:54,440
And I think it allowed for like a pretty cool season, like on the whole, like, okay, Hachioji
767
00:45:54,440 --> 00:45:57,480
was hard, but the season was awesome.
768
00:45:57,480 --> 00:45:58,480
It had a story.
769
00:45:58,480 --> 00:46:03,600
Like if you look at the season, like I'm sure Matt Groom could do, he's like awesome at
770
00:46:03,600 --> 00:46:04,600
this shit.
771
00:46:04,600 --> 00:46:09,840
He could probably put together a really cool 2023 story, you know, about all the feelings
772
00:46:09,840 --> 00:46:11,920
and the emotion and the timeline.
773
00:46:11,920 --> 00:46:17,640
And you don't get that from having identical, perfect events because I honestly, I think
774
00:46:17,640 --> 00:46:19,440
the sport becomes kind of boring.
775
00:46:19,440 --> 00:46:21,800
You know, like if it's always if you always know what's going to happen, then why the
776
00:46:21,800 --> 00:46:22,800
hell are you watching?
777
00:46:22,800 --> 00:46:24,800
Yeah, good point.
778
00:46:24,800 --> 00:46:31,320
Hachioji man comment for that I took just a couple, I guess, like the first sentences
779
00:46:31,320 --> 00:46:33,440
I wanted to go over.
780
00:46:33,440 --> 00:46:37,120
I feel like at least two setters should have to be able to top any set.
781
00:46:37,120 --> 00:46:40,960
Also, it would be nice to see a top from the centers during the boulder preview.
782
00:46:40,960 --> 00:46:45,760
Oh, I don't know what they mean exactly by the top any set.
783
00:46:45,760 --> 00:46:49,520
I guess, like any of the boulders.
784
00:46:49,520 --> 00:46:54,240
Yeah, like all these like all the moves went somebody did.
785
00:46:54,240 --> 00:46:56,240
Somebody did the moves.
786
00:46:56,240 --> 00:46:57,240
Maybe that was me.
787
00:46:57,240 --> 00:46:58,240
Maybe that was for me.
788
00:46:58,240 --> 00:46:59,240
Maybe that was Olga.
789
00:46:59,240 --> 00:47:00,840
Somebody did something at some point in time.
790
00:47:00,840 --> 00:47:06,240
And most of the time, I'll say it is one to three people.
791
00:47:06,240 --> 00:47:07,240
Any more than that.
792
00:47:07,240 --> 00:47:08,240
It's unreasonable.
793
00:47:08,240 --> 00:47:09,240
You're wasting skin.
794
00:47:09,240 --> 00:47:10,240
You're wasting energy.
795
00:47:10,240 --> 00:47:13,680
We should be good enough at our jobs to like evaluate a setter's performance and how they're
796
00:47:13,680 --> 00:47:20,280
moving on the wall and be able to provide and use feedback from our standpoint as well
797
00:47:20,280 --> 00:47:24,640
as what the setter is feeling while they're testing on the wall.
798
00:47:24,640 --> 00:47:33,200
There are unique situations where we'll lean on one person because it might be an extremely
799
00:47:33,200 --> 00:47:35,200
hyper specialized skill set.
800
00:47:35,200 --> 00:47:36,200
Right.
801
00:47:36,200 --> 00:47:39,880
Or it could also be like we're super running low on time or we're super running low on
802
00:47:39,880 --> 00:47:40,880
energy or skin.
803
00:47:40,880 --> 00:47:43,680
And like, hey, Ginny, you have this move dialed.
804
00:47:43,680 --> 00:47:48,840
Can you just like keep running this and we can keep tinkering and then, okay, Cody, you
805
00:47:48,840 --> 00:47:53,200
can try the different ways to cheat it because you're finding this strange way that only
806
00:47:53,200 --> 00:47:57,360
you or someone who's climbs like you can cheat it.
807
00:47:57,360 --> 00:47:59,000
So like we'll play off of one another.
808
00:47:59,000 --> 00:48:00,000
You know what I mean?
809
00:48:00,000 --> 00:48:03,000
So, but that's not to say that that's that's the exception.
810
00:48:03,000 --> 00:48:04,580
That's not the rule.
811
00:48:04,580 --> 00:48:09,280
So a lot of times we do actually we do mean we do these moves.
812
00:48:09,280 --> 00:48:11,080
We're not we're not ever setting a boulder, though.
813
00:48:11,080 --> 00:48:16,480
We don't ever there's unless we're like chilling and like things are great and we have like
814
00:48:16,480 --> 00:48:17,480
free time.
815
00:48:17,480 --> 00:48:21,320
No one's ever like said, he always says it's like, okay, one more time for the culture,
816
00:48:21,320 --> 00:48:23,680
for the culture, you know, and he's like, it's like a funny thing.
817
00:48:23,680 --> 00:48:26,560
Like he just because he wants to be a better climber and he wants to be, you know, to learn
818
00:48:26,560 --> 00:48:27,560
these things.
819
00:48:27,560 --> 00:48:28,680
But like that happens this much.
820
00:48:28,680 --> 00:48:36,080
Like we just don't have the time or the energy to to invest into like full sense.
821
00:48:36,080 --> 00:48:40,840
So we have to calibrate our experiences based on the sections and all the sections go and
822
00:48:40,840 --> 00:48:43,680
all the boulders they go for sure they go.
823
00:48:43,680 --> 00:48:48,320
But we could be asking too much at certain times or not enough or not enough.
824
00:48:48,320 --> 00:48:50,820
How do you do is too much.
825
00:48:50,820 --> 00:48:54,840
It would be cool to see like top from the setters during boulder preview.
826
00:48:54,840 --> 00:48:57,120
But to be frank, that's a lot to ask.
827
00:48:57,120 --> 00:49:01,200
I mean, any of these weeks, if they're talking about it live, there's just no fucking way.
828
00:49:01,200 --> 00:49:08,160
There's just no way to like go out during whatever finals or and like at that point,
829
00:49:08,160 --> 00:49:10,040
you've already.
830
00:49:10,040 --> 00:49:14,920
I mean, some of those days, let's say for qualities, we might finish setting and taping
831
00:49:14,920 --> 00:49:20,480
qualities, let's just say at Thursday night at midnight or one a.m., two a.m. get to the
832
00:49:20,480 --> 00:49:27,560
wall at seven where they're from seven until all the way maybe until again, one a.m., two
833
00:49:27,560 --> 00:49:31,760
a.m., three a.m. between stripping the wall after watch everyone climb and strip the wall
834
00:49:31,760 --> 00:49:37,320
and put up semis and make adjusting for semis and take tape, tighten those right.
835
00:49:37,320 --> 00:49:42,080
Then you're back on the wall three hours later to watch or four hours to watch semis.
836
00:49:42,080 --> 00:49:43,080
Then you what you know what I mean?
837
00:49:43,080 --> 00:49:45,880
Like it just ends up and that's not including the entire week prior.
838
00:49:45,880 --> 00:49:47,800
You're just like.
839
00:49:47,800 --> 00:49:51,520
That's not our job is to like the it's the job of the athletes to perform.
840
00:49:51,520 --> 00:49:54,640
It's not the job of the setters to like show the athletes how to do it.
841
00:49:54,640 --> 00:49:59,280
Because if I could just if I have to a 70 hour work like that, I could just fire boulders
842
00:49:59,280 --> 00:50:00,280
on command.
843
00:50:00,280 --> 00:50:04,200
I promise you I wouldn't be resetting and I would be climbing in a World Cup.
844
00:50:04,200 --> 00:50:07,000
I'd be I'd try to be an athlete.
845
00:50:07,000 --> 00:50:11,800
And I guess like it wouldn't really I mean, usually the athletes top it.
846
00:50:11,800 --> 00:50:14,600
So don't really need to see a route setter top it.
847
00:50:14,600 --> 00:50:19,200
I guess it was just in this one instance where nobody had talked and people really wanted
848
00:50:19,200 --> 00:50:20,800
to see what was going on.
849
00:50:20,800 --> 00:50:21,800
Yeah.
850
00:50:21,800 --> 00:50:27,800
I think I don't know when that comment was like posted or whatever, but I did post like
851
00:50:27,800 --> 00:50:29,800
I'd never posted reels before on Instagram.
852
00:50:29,800 --> 00:50:35,320
I didn't really know how that works, but I made a reel and it like showed the moves.
853
00:50:35,320 --> 00:50:38,600
It was like it's I've been doing it for each World Cup now.
854
00:50:38,600 --> 00:50:43,880
It's like testing versus setting or sorry, testing versus athletes or something like
855
00:50:43,880 --> 00:50:44,880
that.
856
00:50:44,880 --> 00:50:45,880
I forget what I titled it.
857
00:50:45,880 --> 00:50:49,480
So it just takes an event, takes just random highlight moves, basically more or less if
858
00:50:49,480 --> 00:50:52,760
I had my camera running or not, which sometimes I do and sometimes I don't.
859
00:50:52,760 --> 00:50:57,840
And so, hey, here's somebody on the team doing a move or not doing a move, depending.
860
00:50:57,840 --> 00:51:00,560
And then like here's the athlete doing the move or attempting to move in a different
861
00:51:00,560 --> 00:51:04,920
way or the same way and like seeing like a before and after.
862
00:51:04,920 --> 00:51:06,560
And it people seem to like it.
863
00:51:06,560 --> 00:51:07,560
Like it's kind of cool.
864
00:51:07,560 --> 00:51:11,520
It's kind of I think it's like I think it's fun, you know, and it shows that like, hey,
865
00:51:11,520 --> 00:51:14,560
we actually do this and we try our best.
866
00:51:14,560 --> 00:51:16,360
And it's definitely we're not trying to like screw people.
867
00:51:16,360 --> 00:51:18,840
We're trying to create great fields and great moments.
868
00:51:18,840 --> 00:51:24,080
Like it's we're definitely not root setting in any way, shape or form for like the money
869
00:51:24,080 --> 00:51:26,600
or the fame, because that just doesn't exist.
870
00:51:26,600 --> 00:51:27,800
We just love it.
871
00:51:27,800 --> 00:51:28,800
We're passionate about it.
872
00:51:28,800 --> 00:51:33,480
And so just like to share that with people, I think is the number one thing.
873
00:51:33,480 --> 00:51:41,520
Yeah, I'll link that first video in the show notes for people to see.
874
00:51:41,520 --> 00:51:47,240
But OK, moving on to Prague, I think also men's.
875
00:51:47,240 --> 00:51:49,280
So Prague men's two.
876
00:51:49,280 --> 00:51:54,400
This one says maybe the center saw M4 and misread it as before.
877
00:51:54,400 --> 00:51:56,760
Oh, I remember this one.
878
00:51:56,760 --> 00:51:59,160
Yeah, I had a lot of involvement in this one.
879
00:51:59,160 --> 00:52:01,600
That was tough.
880
00:52:01,600 --> 00:52:05,800
The summary is that conditions matter.
881
00:52:05,800 --> 00:52:10,000
We were for running this boulder.
882
00:52:10,000 --> 00:52:11,840
We had to have a screen cover up.
883
00:52:11,840 --> 00:52:12,840
That was part of it.
884
00:52:12,840 --> 00:52:13,840
So it was like an open air venue.
885
00:52:13,840 --> 00:52:18,040
We had to keep a screen cover up, otherwise everyone would see us testing and forning,
886
00:52:18,040 --> 00:52:22,880
including athletes and coaches and people could video like people walking by the street.
887
00:52:22,880 --> 00:52:23,880
So there was that.
888
00:52:23,880 --> 00:52:30,040
And then it was also probably like 85 degrees with no wind.
889
00:52:30,040 --> 00:52:32,120
So you add that to it.
890
00:52:32,120 --> 00:52:35,040
And it was like a literal oven in this venue.
891
00:52:35,040 --> 00:52:38,260
And even at sometimes we tried to move the screen around or whatever.
892
00:52:38,260 --> 00:52:39,400
It just didn't matter so much.
893
00:52:39,400 --> 00:52:46,040
It was so absurdly hot during the days that there were some very, very strong roots setters
894
00:52:46,040 --> 00:52:47,040
on this team.
895
00:52:47,040 --> 00:52:54,680
And they were having trouble dead hanging certain holds, just holding them, much less
896
00:52:54,680 --> 00:52:56,320
moving to and from them.
897
00:52:56,320 --> 00:53:00,120
And we were actually quite worried for that entire round that we were way overcooked the
898
00:53:00,120 --> 00:53:02,440
round, especially M4.
899
00:53:02,440 --> 00:53:09,560
I was like, we sometimes will place estimations or predictions on how we think the round will
900
00:53:09,560 --> 00:53:10,560
go.
901
00:53:10,560 --> 00:53:12,360
And I think every roots setter had like men's four.
902
00:53:12,360 --> 00:53:16,000
I was like, I don't know if it goes, but I don't know if they'll do it.
903
00:53:16,000 --> 00:53:17,000
You know what I mean?
904
00:53:17,000 --> 00:53:19,880
We're going to create a moment where someone's going to do this move and that's going to
905
00:53:19,880 --> 00:53:22,840
be the reason that they get gold.
906
00:53:22,840 --> 00:53:27,120
And boy, oh boy, was that not the case.
907
00:53:27,120 --> 00:53:29,480
The temperatures dropped.
908
00:53:29,480 --> 00:53:33,680
They had to have gone down till we should look and see.
909
00:53:33,680 --> 00:53:35,120
It felt freezing.
910
00:53:35,120 --> 00:53:44,280
People were in sweatshirts, puffy's, gloves, hats, like people in the crowd.
911
00:53:44,280 --> 00:53:45,280
You know what I mean?
912
00:53:45,280 --> 00:53:49,800
It was frigid and it made the entire world of a difference.
913
00:53:49,800 --> 00:53:53,000
That fiberglass just like, I mean, if anyone's ever climbed on sandstone, whether that's
914
00:53:53,000 --> 00:53:59,680
at font or at horsepans or in Chattanooga or anything like, you know, we have like slopey
915
00:53:59,680 --> 00:54:03,760
sandstone, the fiberglass can feel sometimes similarly to that, or at least how your skin
916
00:54:03,760 --> 00:54:06,160
and your hands and your body reacts to that.
917
00:54:06,160 --> 00:54:08,960
If it's really hot and greasy and sweaty, you know about it.
918
00:54:08,960 --> 00:54:13,520
If it's cold and sticky and almost feels velcro-y, again, you know about it.
919
00:54:13,520 --> 00:54:21,120
So that's a tough one to deal with, but you know, sometimes that's just the game we play.
920
00:54:21,120 --> 00:54:27,320
And I don't know if there's a great solution on how to fix that, but we could probably
921
00:54:27,320 --> 00:54:31,240
try to be more, if nothing else, a little bit more aware.
922
00:54:31,240 --> 00:54:36,680
I won't say shy away from certain moves, but just be more aware that like these situations
923
00:54:36,680 --> 00:54:42,140
could occur if, you know, the weather is this or the conditions are that.
924
00:54:42,140 --> 00:54:46,880
So do you look at the weather of the day of the comp when you're setting?
925
00:54:46,880 --> 00:54:47,880
Yeah.
926
00:54:47,880 --> 00:54:48,880
Yeah.
927
00:54:48,880 --> 00:54:52,000
So part of the thing that we didn't pay attention to is the wind, the wind picked up quite a
928
00:54:52,000 --> 00:54:53,000
bit too.
929
00:54:53,000 --> 00:54:57,160
So it was like whatever, however many degrees, which was like much colder, but not that much
930
00:54:57,160 --> 00:54:59,480
colder, but then you added no wind to a ton of wind.
931
00:54:59,480 --> 00:55:04,560
I mean, we were like, everyone there was in tank tops or in shorts with maybe no shirt
932
00:55:04,560 --> 00:55:07,440
on or something like that and pouring sweat.
933
00:55:07,440 --> 00:55:09,020
Couldn't even keep chalk on the hands.
934
00:55:09,020 --> 00:55:12,280
And then, like I said, you know, you fast forward 12 hours or whatever it is.
935
00:55:12,280 --> 00:55:18,080
And before you know it, you're like completely bundled up like a, you know, like you're going
936
00:55:18,080 --> 00:55:21,880
out to brave the North and yeah.
937
00:55:21,880 --> 00:55:27,440
So yeah, a little bit of a miss there, but I think we still got the separation for the
938
00:55:27,440 --> 00:55:28,440
run.
939
00:55:28,440 --> 00:55:29,440
Yeah.
940
00:55:29,440 --> 00:55:34,160
Good to know what you were hoping to see because that makes a lot more sense for like the last
941
00:55:34,160 --> 00:55:39,760
boulder that you would want it to be hard and show separation.
942
00:55:39,760 --> 00:55:42,360
So that that makes a lot of sense.
943
00:55:42,360 --> 00:55:43,480
Okay.
944
00:55:43,480 --> 00:55:49,200
Let's do prognosis for that photo.
945
00:55:49,200 --> 00:55:54,720
Are they bad at calibrating the difficulty of static climbing to the climbers when they
946
00:55:54,720 --> 00:55:57,640
don't have a million dinos?
947
00:55:57,640 --> 00:56:02,320
It's nice to see some more strong and static climbing again, at least hope that keeps up
948
00:56:02,320 --> 00:56:05,960
and they figure out the difficulty.
949
00:56:05,960 --> 00:56:09,960
Also really felt like there should have been one or two more moves on M4.
950
00:56:09,960 --> 00:56:14,120
I think this one they're talking about M3.
951
00:56:14,120 --> 00:56:15,120
Yeah.
952
00:56:15,120 --> 00:56:23,080
If they're talking about M3, I'd say, I think we kind of nailed that one.
953
00:56:23,080 --> 00:56:25,040
If I remember that was the slab.
954
00:56:25,040 --> 00:56:28,400
Yeah, I think they liked that one.
955
00:56:28,400 --> 00:56:30,920
But then it says they're bad at calibrating the static.
956
00:56:30,920 --> 00:56:33,800
I'm not really sure what this this comment.
957
00:56:33,800 --> 00:56:35,560
Yeah.
958
00:56:35,560 --> 00:56:37,600
Because I think maybe it was a different moment.
959
00:56:37,600 --> 00:56:43,120
Maybe it was, but it's kind of like a reference.
960
00:56:43,120 --> 00:56:46,240
I mean, we're trying to create a really diverse field of play.
961
00:56:46,240 --> 00:56:52,140
You know, like if Cody and Ginny are our field and Ginny is really, really good at cordo
962
00:56:52,140 --> 00:56:57,760
dinos and Cody's really, really good at slab and the route setters put even accidentally,
963
00:56:57,760 --> 00:57:03,000
they put like two of the four boulders are more slow and static and slabby and maybe
964
00:57:03,000 --> 00:57:10,080
only start to zone is a cordo move, then the likelihood is that if all other things are
965
00:57:10,080 --> 00:57:14,520
remaining equal, Cody has a massive advantage at this competition and Ginny has a hard time.
966
00:57:14,520 --> 00:57:20,720
So we try to create a fair field of play throughout start to zone, zone to top, you know, at different
967
00:57:20,720 --> 00:57:23,960
points throughout the wall.
968
00:57:23,960 --> 00:57:28,280
I would like to think we're not bad at calibrating difficulty, but maybe some folks think that
969
00:57:28,280 --> 00:57:31,800
in certain instances.
970
00:57:31,800 --> 00:57:33,440
And we can always be better if nothing else.
971
00:57:33,440 --> 00:57:34,440
That's for sure.
972
00:57:34,440 --> 00:57:35,960
We can always get better.
973
00:57:35,960 --> 00:57:44,160
And for the record, that's not the reason why I would do worse on the comp folder in
974
00:57:44,160 --> 00:57:48,080
case anyone was wondering.
975
00:57:48,080 --> 00:57:53,920
And then for Prague women's, there wasn't much in the comments except for congrats for
976
00:57:53,920 --> 00:57:58,320
Oriane, who I think won that one instead of Yanya.
977
00:57:58,320 --> 00:58:04,800
And I think you wanted to talk about this a bit, which was why you think she managed
978
00:58:04,800 --> 00:58:07,600
to win that comp over Yanya.
979
00:58:07,600 --> 00:58:09,720
Oh, yeah.
980
00:58:09,720 --> 00:58:16,120
So I think that this is kind of like a testament to I think we had a quite nice round actually
981
00:58:16,120 --> 00:58:20,840
in terms of diversity of style.
982
00:58:20,840 --> 00:58:23,680
And it allowed Orion to shine through.
983
00:58:23,680 --> 00:58:25,160
I mean, it wasn't a perfect round.
984
00:58:25,160 --> 00:58:27,640
There were again, there were some things that I think if we looked back, we would have liked
985
00:58:27,640 --> 00:58:29,600
to see maybe a little bit differently.
986
00:58:29,600 --> 00:58:32,040
But the way that the round played out, again, all the athletes are climbing on the same
987
00:58:32,040 --> 00:58:35,160
boulders and the best climber won that day.
988
00:58:35,160 --> 00:58:37,120
And the best climber was Orion.
989
00:58:37,120 --> 00:58:43,600
And Orion topped the slab in the most graceful, beautiful style.
990
00:58:43,600 --> 00:58:46,040
But I've seen someone climb a slab in a really long time.
991
00:58:46,040 --> 00:58:48,120
It was really, really impressive.
992
00:58:48,120 --> 00:58:50,160
She smashed it.
993
00:58:50,160 --> 00:58:54,520
And it was kind of a moment I was like, I think she came out, don't quote me on this,
994
00:58:54,520 --> 00:58:55,520
I think she came out last.
995
00:58:55,520 --> 00:58:58,600
I think she came out, like she was in sixth place.
996
00:58:58,600 --> 00:59:02,160
So I mean, she came out first, actually, is what I'm trying to say.
997
00:59:02,160 --> 00:59:06,520
And I watched it and I was like, shit, this boulder is way too easy.
998
00:59:06,520 --> 00:59:10,440
We're going to have like people just go through this thing.
999
00:59:10,440 --> 00:59:11,840
And it was not the case, Orion.
1000
00:59:11,840 --> 00:59:18,800
It just like really showcased how exceptional she is at the style of climbing.
1001
00:59:18,800 --> 00:59:19,800
And then you get to Yanya.
1002
00:59:19,800 --> 00:59:25,760
And if I remember correctly, Yanya did not do the boulder.
1003
00:59:25,760 --> 00:59:31,320
There was conversation during the comp that might have had to do with her foot injury.
1004
00:59:31,320 --> 00:59:37,640
Yanya dealt with a foot injury, which is also why she wasn't in Hachioji or in Salt Lake.
1005
00:59:37,640 --> 00:59:42,040
She had like, I think she broke her toe or something like that.
1006
00:59:42,040 --> 00:59:43,040
And you could see it.
1007
00:59:43,040 --> 00:59:46,600
I think even though I was watching the shoes that she was putting on and she had like hyper
1008
00:59:46,600 --> 00:59:50,240
stiff shoes for the slab.
1009
00:59:50,240 --> 00:59:54,320
And I think it was to protect her foot, protect her toe.
1010
00:59:54,320 --> 00:59:59,520
But that combined with maybe sensitivity or maybe even hesitancy on if she was ready for
1011
00:59:59,520 --> 01:00:00,520
that.
1012
01:00:00,520 --> 01:00:02,060
I don't know.
1013
01:00:02,060 --> 01:00:03,920
She just didn't do the boulder.
1014
01:00:03,920 --> 01:00:08,800
She always wears like the 5'10 high angles though, right?
1015
01:00:08,800 --> 01:00:11,000
And that is a stitch shoe.
1016
01:00:11,000 --> 01:00:13,000
Maybe that actually has nothing to do with it then.
1017
01:00:13,000 --> 01:00:18,160
But watching her on it, it seemed like she had like an ice skate on comparatively to
1018
01:00:18,160 --> 01:00:20,800
Orion.
1019
01:00:20,800 --> 01:00:21,800
So that was really cool to see.
1020
01:00:21,800 --> 01:00:27,120
And then they both did boulder four, which is like that like Kordo campus thing.
1021
01:00:27,120 --> 01:00:28,520
The top was maybe a little bit too easy.
1022
01:00:28,520 --> 01:00:32,520
I think, or wait, that was maybe that was boulder two.
1023
01:00:32,520 --> 01:00:34,520
Either way, there was a black and yellow Kordo boulder.
1024
01:00:34,520 --> 01:00:37,660
That was, I think, the other determining factor that they both topped.
1025
01:00:37,660 --> 01:00:41,880
And I think had that boulder been a little bit harder, you would have seen Yanya maybe
1026
01:00:41,880 --> 01:00:47,400
win because then Yanya topped the most physically demanding boulder.
1027
01:00:47,400 --> 01:00:51,520
And she did that in like just incredible style.
1028
01:00:51,520 --> 01:00:54,800
She like really set herself apart in terms of the raw power.
1029
01:00:54,800 --> 01:00:58,440
But I think that was kind of cool because like the determining factor for me in that
1030
01:00:58,440 --> 01:01:05,680
round was like, it's showing that climbing is not unilateral, right?
1031
01:01:05,680 --> 01:01:06,680
It's multifaceted.
1032
01:01:06,680 --> 01:01:10,600
And Orion won this comp, in my opinion.
1033
01:01:10,600 --> 01:01:12,840
She showcased a lot of her skills really, really, really well.
1034
01:01:12,840 --> 01:01:16,720
But then she really stood out with her like technical expertise.
1035
01:01:16,720 --> 01:01:19,480
And yeah, we represented that in a way and she had her win.
1036
01:01:19,480 --> 01:01:21,800
So that was cool.
1037
01:01:21,800 --> 01:01:24,240
Yeah, really cool to see.
1038
01:01:24,240 --> 01:01:28,400
Okay, so now on to Innsbruck.
1039
01:01:28,400 --> 01:01:30,420
Women's won.
1040
01:01:30,420 --> 01:01:37,480
This was a really long comment, so I'm just going to read through certain parts of it.
1041
01:01:37,480 --> 01:01:41,520
Feel free to read through it on your own if you want later.
1042
01:01:41,520 --> 01:01:45,520
And then I'll also put the whole photo in the video.
1043
01:01:45,520 --> 01:01:51,560
But yeah, let me just go through some of the points that they made.
1044
01:01:51,560 --> 01:01:56,200
So the route centers created the worst routes I've ever seen to ruin what could have been
1045
01:01:56,200 --> 01:01:59,320
so thrilling.
1046
01:01:59,320 --> 01:02:03,000
Jump on W1 literally being a height contest.
1047
01:02:03,000 --> 01:02:08,440
W2, which was the only technical slab being the most straightforward flashable slab that
1048
01:02:08,440 --> 01:02:11,560
created absolutely no separation in skill.
1049
01:02:11,560 --> 01:02:17,480
W3 has a jump that's literally impossible for Innsbruck, regardless of if they skipped
1050
01:02:17,480 --> 01:02:20,800
leg day or not.
1051
01:02:20,800 --> 01:02:24,600
Also has a slab on there, which probably belongs in a modern art museum because it's served
1052
01:02:24,600 --> 01:02:25,960
no purpose.
1053
01:02:25,960 --> 01:02:31,000
W4, again, being impossible for Innsbruck because of their height.
1054
01:02:31,000 --> 01:02:36,040
And asking them to be fully stretched, holding on with their fingertips and swaying 90 degrees
1055
01:02:36,040 --> 01:02:42,200
into a fully stretched toe hook while still holding onto your fingertips, et cetera, et
1056
01:02:42,200 --> 01:02:43,200
cetera.
1057
01:02:43,200 --> 01:02:49,240
So yeah, a lot of height dependent comments in this one.
1058
01:02:49,240 --> 01:02:52,240
Yeah.
1059
01:02:52,240 --> 01:02:53,240
So much more.
1060
01:02:53,240 --> 01:02:54,240
I'm like still reading.
1061
01:02:54,240 --> 01:02:55,640
Yeah, go for it.
1062
01:02:55,640 --> 01:03:00,600
No, it's like so, I mean, I think I'll say this much.
1063
01:03:00,600 --> 01:03:05,800
If someone has, this person has a lot of very strong feelings on the competition in general.
1064
01:03:05,800 --> 01:03:09,920
So I don't think that even if I could sit down with them and have a conversation, they
1065
01:03:09,920 --> 01:03:14,800
may or may not change their views.
1066
01:03:14,800 --> 01:03:21,720
But I will say that there are a few things on here that objectively, not objectively,
1067
01:03:21,720 --> 01:03:28,080
that I just kind of from a, I just disagree with.
1068
01:03:28,080 --> 01:03:32,760
Number one, jump on number one being a height contest.
1069
01:03:32,760 --> 01:03:41,920
That situation, if you like look back at the video, like the replay, you have to jump.
1070
01:03:41,920 --> 01:03:43,520
Yes.
1071
01:03:43,520 --> 01:03:48,080
You have to leave the ground to achieve the hold.
1072
01:03:48,080 --> 01:03:52,760
And okay, if you're a little taller, yes, it is a little easier.
1073
01:03:52,760 --> 01:04:04,040
That jump, it couldn't have been a more straightforward, simplistic demand of leg power.
1074
01:04:04,040 --> 01:04:08,000
Like out of all the things that we ask of the athletes and coordination and jumping
1075
01:04:08,000 --> 01:04:15,520
and springiness and hot feet and toe catches and all, like it is purely, like can you,
1076
01:04:15,520 --> 01:04:21,760
can you just, and I just doesn't have leg power and she'd be the first to tell you.
1077
01:04:21,760 --> 01:04:24,400
She'll be the first to tell you like Brooke did it.
1078
01:04:24,400 --> 01:04:25,400
No problem.
1079
01:04:25,400 --> 01:04:30,400
Brooke is yes, a little bit taller than I, maybe by what an inch or something.
1080
01:04:30,400 --> 01:04:31,400
Brooke's five two.
1081
01:04:31,400 --> 01:04:32,400
I don't know what I is.
1082
01:04:32,400 --> 01:04:33,400
Maybe I's five one.
1083
01:04:33,400 --> 01:04:37,080
We could probably look and see, but like you watch Brooke and she like does it and she
1084
01:04:37,080 --> 01:04:38,960
does it and she does it.
1085
01:04:38,960 --> 01:04:43,520
To me, I actually use that as an example sometimes for folks as like, yeah, we do the best that
1086
01:04:43,520 --> 01:04:50,640
we can do, but optics go way farther than what our interpretation of the round might
1087
01:04:50,640 --> 01:04:51,640
be.
1088
01:04:51,640 --> 01:04:53,320
Like, we could have a conversation about this round.
1089
01:04:53,320 --> 01:04:54,320
The roots that are going to have a conversation.
1090
01:04:54,320 --> 01:04:57,680
Hell, anyone can have a conversation, the coaches and they could all say, everyone could
1091
01:04:57,680 --> 01:05:02,760
say the same thing that yeah, that was like a leg power issue there, which I would to
1092
01:05:02,760 --> 01:05:06,280
my dying day say that's a leg power issue.
1093
01:05:06,280 --> 01:05:11,440
But optically there's millions of other people who are watching this competition and interpreting
1094
01:05:11,440 --> 01:05:14,080
their own feelings based on what they're seeing.
1095
01:05:14,080 --> 01:05:17,040
And optically it looked fucking terrible.
1096
01:05:17,040 --> 01:05:18,040
It looked real bad.
1097
01:05:18,040 --> 01:05:23,040
We have the smallest athlete unable to do this jump move over and over and over and
1098
01:05:23,040 --> 01:05:24,920
over and eventually though she did it.
1099
01:05:24,920 --> 01:05:25,920
And why did she do it?
1100
01:05:25,920 --> 01:05:30,040
She jumped a little bit more and climbing is not perfect.
1101
01:05:30,040 --> 01:05:32,720
It's far from fair.
1102
01:05:32,720 --> 01:05:39,640
Vertical jumps without any shadow of a doubt are the least fair move I would say for a
1103
01:05:39,640 --> 01:05:41,080
shorter climber.
1104
01:05:41,080 --> 01:05:44,360
Basically the taller you are, the easier those moves will be.
1105
01:05:44,360 --> 01:05:50,200
That being said though, there are quantifiably more difficult moves for folks who are taller.
1106
01:05:50,200 --> 01:05:58,360
For example, bicycles in increasingly horizontal roof that are tight.
1107
01:05:58,360 --> 01:06:02,920
So like, I mean, I can't really show it here, but like I can only get my foot so close to
1108
01:06:02,920 --> 01:06:07,160
my face and the closer I pull my foot to my face, the more I have to engage in more like
1109
01:06:07,160 --> 01:06:11,840
my back sags and the more my core has to compensate for that as well as my lower back.
1110
01:06:11,840 --> 01:06:15,560
Whereas I don't know how tall you are, but if you're under six feet, then you're going
1111
01:06:15,560 --> 01:06:20,040
to be in increasingly a little bit more comfortable position, right?
1112
01:06:20,040 --> 01:06:24,240
And that box gets more comfortable as you get smaller, which means that you're actually
1113
01:06:24,240 --> 01:06:25,960
going to have a greater likelihood of success.
1114
01:06:25,960 --> 01:06:27,700
Again, all things remaining equal.
1115
01:06:27,700 --> 01:06:30,200
So it's our job to sometimes play off of this.
1116
01:06:30,200 --> 01:06:35,660
Whereas like you can't just say, okay, well, I was in the comp, so no jumps just as much
1117
01:06:35,660 --> 01:06:39,800
as you can't say, Kai Lightner is in the comp, so no jumps, right?
1118
01:06:39,800 --> 01:06:42,240
Because he's just on the opposite end of the spectrum.
1119
01:06:42,240 --> 01:06:45,080
We just have to find ways to do our best.
1120
01:06:45,080 --> 01:06:46,080
Again, we're humans.
1121
01:06:46,080 --> 01:06:51,000
We're definitely, there is no science in terms of like, we don't have a rubric or something
1122
01:06:51,000 --> 01:06:54,840
that we can follow to tell us how to do our job.
1123
01:06:54,840 --> 01:06:59,920
So we have to do our best to gauge this level and dictate what's appropriate.
1124
01:06:59,920 --> 01:07:04,800
For what it's worth, and maybe it's not much, but we had a couple of folks on the team who
1125
01:07:04,800 --> 01:07:11,600
actually work and have worked with I quite a lot who are on the root setting team.
1126
01:07:11,600 --> 01:07:15,920
And they made the final calls on whether this height was appropriate.
1127
01:07:15,920 --> 01:07:19,720
And they were like, we had that thing up probably another eight inches.
1128
01:07:19,720 --> 01:07:24,280
And maybe 20 minutes before the comp, we were like, is this too high?
1129
01:07:24,280 --> 01:07:26,560
Like me and the chief actually were like, is this too high?
1130
01:07:26,560 --> 01:07:27,560
Is this too high?
1131
01:07:27,560 --> 01:07:30,280
And then we called over some of these Japanese guys and we're like, hey, is it too high?
1132
01:07:30,280 --> 01:07:31,680
And they're like, no, no, no, it's fine.
1133
01:07:31,680 --> 01:07:33,720
But like, if you're really worried about it, bring it down.
1134
01:07:33,720 --> 01:07:35,040
And we're like, I think we should bring it down.
1135
01:07:35,040 --> 01:07:36,760
And they're like, I mean, she's going to do it.
1136
01:07:36,760 --> 01:07:38,260
She's so good.
1137
01:07:38,260 --> 01:07:45,320
Imagine if we left it up like eight inches, like the world would have burned.
1138
01:07:45,320 --> 01:07:47,700
So we use the information to the best of our ability.
1139
01:07:47,700 --> 01:07:49,160
They weren't trying to hose us.
1140
01:07:49,160 --> 01:07:50,800
They were trying to give us valid information.
1141
01:07:50,800 --> 01:07:55,160
They're like, oh yeah, based on our experiences when we've trained or workshopped with I in
1142
01:07:55,160 --> 01:07:59,800
the past, she is capable of doing X, Y, or Z.
1143
01:07:59,800 --> 01:08:04,680
And we have like reference points to kind of like go along with that.
1144
01:08:04,680 --> 01:08:10,640
And this kind of like meets or exceeds our expectations of her on this style of move.
1145
01:08:10,640 --> 01:08:11,640
So what do we do?
1146
01:08:11,640 --> 01:08:18,000
We say, all right, well, let's lower it to be safe and move on.
1147
01:08:18,000 --> 01:08:22,880
Other things, women's too, which is only the quote technical slab.
1148
01:08:22,880 --> 01:08:27,920
I mean, it's kind of like I said earlier, you really, we have four boulders.
1149
01:08:27,920 --> 01:08:32,200
So we need to represent different styles in different ways.
1150
01:08:32,200 --> 01:08:36,680
Having 25% of the competition made technical slab to me is good.
1151
01:08:36,680 --> 01:08:39,040
Like that's if we have more than that, it's a problem.
1152
01:08:39,040 --> 01:08:41,040
If we have less than that, it's a problem.
1153
01:08:41,040 --> 01:08:42,280
So I don't know.
1154
01:08:42,280 --> 01:08:46,620
Maybe their comment there is about the separation and that too many of the women did it.
1155
01:08:46,620 --> 01:08:55,320
Maybe we could have made that technical slab a little bit more complex or technically demanding.
1156
01:08:55,320 --> 01:08:56,480
I wouldn't disagree with that.
1157
01:08:56,480 --> 01:08:58,280
I think that's a fair thing.
1158
01:08:58,280 --> 01:09:04,920
But yeah, let's see what else.
1159
01:09:04,920 --> 01:09:08,520
When four being impossible, most of this was about, yeah, I'm trying to like, I'm trying
1160
01:09:08,520 --> 01:09:09,840
to at least like address each point.
1161
01:09:09,840 --> 01:09:14,040
I don't know if these folks like follow you or, or listen in because it'd be cool to like
1162
01:09:14,040 --> 01:09:18,720
at least try to address some of the, I guess I won't touch any more of the height thing.
1163
01:09:18,720 --> 01:09:21,520
I mean, they talked about women's four being impossible fire, Brooke.
1164
01:09:21,520 --> 01:09:24,640
I don't think that's the case.
1165
01:09:24,640 --> 01:09:28,200
Maybe it's a bit harder, but then I also find strange ways of getting through things.
1166
01:09:28,200 --> 01:09:34,600
Like we saw that in the semi finals round as well on that yellow and orange folder.
1167
01:09:34,600 --> 01:09:39,640
But I will, I will kind of clap back here and say when they said it's, it's pretty
1168
01:09:39,640 --> 01:09:43,000
clear that the roots that is completely tunnel visioned on Yanya and created big leaps, leaps
1169
01:09:43,000 --> 01:09:47,100
and dynamic power moves that would really thought we'd slow her down a little bit.
1170
01:09:47,100 --> 01:09:50,820
And I'm glad that Yanya flashed every boulder embarrassed the roots setters really consider
1171
01:09:50,820 --> 01:09:53,760
an ignorant root design to not consider the whole field.
1172
01:09:53,760 --> 01:09:58,280
We that couldn't be like that could not be farther from the truth.
1173
01:09:58,280 --> 01:09:59,280
I'll just say that.
1174
01:09:59,280 --> 01:10:06,520
Like I usually like to be like pretty, I don't know, open.
1175
01:10:06,520 --> 01:10:07,520
That's not the case.
1176
01:10:07,520 --> 01:10:11,880
Like we do not focus on one single climber.
1177
01:10:11,880 --> 01:10:13,960
We do not favor climbers.
1178
01:10:13,960 --> 01:10:18,760
We do not like it's our job to create the best field of play that we possibly can.
1179
01:10:18,760 --> 01:10:23,360
And it's not our fault that Yanya is fucking incredible.
1180
01:10:23,360 --> 01:10:25,800
She is really, really, really, really, really good.
1181
01:10:25,800 --> 01:10:31,640
And if we were actually trying to do that, like make this, this game only for Yanya,
1182
01:10:31,640 --> 01:10:35,760
then literally, I don't know if anyone else would do any zones, much less top boulders.
1183
01:10:35,760 --> 01:10:41,640
She is that far above and beyond, at least when I saw her last and burn, she is exceptional.
1184
01:10:41,640 --> 01:10:42,860
So that's just not the case.
1185
01:10:42,860 --> 01:10:46,720
That's never, I don't ever want anyone to even read a comment on YouTube and think that
1186
01:10:46,720 --> 01:10:52,480
there's any sort of bias towards any individual athlete or nation or team.
1187
01:10:52,480 --> 01:10:54,240
Like it's just not the thing.
1188
01:10:54,240 --> 01:10:55,760
That's why the teams are also diverse.
1189
01:10:55,760 --> 01:11:00,520
They come from, there's men and women from all different nations.
1190
01:11:00,520 --> 01:11:01,920
That's why the chiefs switch.
1191
01:11:01,920 --> 01:11:06,280
It's not just a chief from this country, right?
1192
01:11:06,280 --> 01:11:13,440
It's constantly and typically maybe there's some continuity between comps and maybe a team
1193
01:11:13,440 --> 01:11:18,600
will have a couple of members that were on, let's say Innsbruck this year and maybe next
1194
01:11:18,600 --> 01:11:19,600
year.
1195
01:11:19,600 --> 01:11:29,240
So again, it's in favor of creating opportunity and new styles and new representation to make
1196
01:11:29,240 --> 01:11:36,440
it as open and have no favoritism, have the least amount of favoritism as possible.
1197
01:11:36,440 --> 01:11:38,880
So maybe there was some misses.
1198
01:11:38,880 --> 01:11:41,560
Again, it's not an easy job.
1199
01:11:41,560 --> 01:11:46,200
And I wish it sometimes when I see someone say things like that, I'm like, man, I just
1200
01:11:46,200 --> 01:11:51,760
wish you could come climb in our shoes for a day and just to really understand some of
1201
01:11:51,760 --> 01:11:56,800
the decisions that were made because we're truly, from the bottom of my heart, speaking
1202
01:11:56,800 --> 01:12:00,960
for the other setters who are on these careers, truly trying to do our best to create the
1203
01:12:00,960 --> 01:12:07,120
best field of play and an exciting round and separation and represent diversity of body
1204
01:12:07,120 --> 01:12:09,960
styles and represent the sponsors.
1205
01:12:09,960 --> 01:12:10,960
And you know what I mean?
1206
01:12:10,960 --> 01:12:13,200
There's a lot of things that we're trying to do.
1207
01:12:13,200 --> 01:12:17,760
And yes, at this level, it's our job to meet or exceed all of those things.
1208
01:12:17,760 --> 01:12:22,600
But we're not perfect and we do miss things.
1209
01:12:22,600 --> 01:12:24,880
So it's a bummer that person feels this way.
1210
01:12:24,880 --> 01:12:27,720
But I love you.
1211
01:12:27,720 --> 01:12:34,040
It'd be interesting if the IFSC could put out some extra, maybe just short video that
1212
01:12:34,040 --> 01:12:38,000
shows a little bit of the behind the scenes during the setting process that they could
1213
01:12:38,000 --> 01:12:46,040
put out with the comp and just get some thoughts on what the setters think they were hoping
1214
01:12:46,040 --> 01:12:51,560
to accomplish there, any reservations that they may have had during the setting process.
1215
01:12:51,560 --> 01:12:54,680
I think maybe that could help clear up a lot of things.
1216
01:12:54,680 --> 01:12:55,840
I think you're right.
1217
01:12:55,840 --> 01:13:01,800
They were doing a little bit of that last year through Matt.
1218
01:13:01,800 --> 01:13:02,800
There's a couple of moments.
1219
01:13:02,800 --> 01:13:07,480
A lot of times too, Matt would do it through other channels as well.
1220
01:13:07,480 --> 01:13:10,400
It wasn't necessarily an IFSC thing.
1221
01:13:10,400 --> 01:13:14,120
So depending on where you got your information from, you may or may not have seen some of
1222
01:13:14,120 --> 01:13:15,120
that information.
1223
01:13:15,120 --> 01:13:21,000
But yeah, it'd be cool almost if it was during the feed, during the comp, if there were moments
1224
01:13:21,000 --> 01:13:26,920
almost like commercial breaks that were like, hey, and then here's Ginny with 30 seconds
1225
01:13:26,920 --> 01:13:30,440
behind the scene of what her experience was like setting this World Cup or whatever.
1226
01:13:30,440 --> 01:13:31,440
Yeah, I think you're right.
1227
01:13:31,440 --> 01:13:35,840
I think if nothing else, both competitively and commercially, the thing that I always
1228
01:13:35,840 --> 01:13:46,880
find or I have historically found is a huge factor in people's, I won't just say happiness,
1229
01:13:46,880 --> 01:13:56,160
but just the overall caliber of their experience wherever that lands is personifying the experience.
1230
01:13:56,160 --> 01:14:01,960
There aren't little leprechauns and fairies who wave wands and make these things happen.
1231
01:14:01,960 --> 01:14:02,960
They're people.
1232
01:14:02,960 --> 01:14:03,960
It's me.
1233
01:14:03,960 --> 01:14:04,960
It's you.
1234
01:14:04,960 --> 01:14:05,960
It's it's my lease.
1235
01:14:05,960 --> 01:14:06,960
It's Remy.
1236
01:14:06,960 --> 01:14:07,960
It's Pierre.
1237
01:14:07,960 --> 01:14:12,000
It's people who have come together to create this thing.
1238
01:14:12,000 --> 01:14:17,900
And I think that, again, that could be the 5'10 in your home gym.
1239
01:14:17,900 --> 01:14:20,120
That could be the V4 at your home gym.
1240
01:14:20,120 --> 01:14:25,300
And if you kind of put some eyes to that person and those people, what they're trying to do
1241
01:14:25,300 --> 01:14:29,480
and understand a little bit about where they're coming from and their intentionality behind
1242
01:14:29,480 --> 01:14:33,800
it, I think that usually goes quite a long way in understanding and having a little bit
1243
01:14:33,800 --> 01:14:39,880
more empathy towards the situation and if nothing else, athletic empathy towards the
1244
01:14:39,880 --> 01:14:42,840
event or the climate itself.
1245
01:14:42,840 --> 01:14:46,960
So yeah, that's precisely why I wanted to do that.
1246
01:14:46,960 --> 01:14:49,960
Ten points to you.
1247
01:14:49,960 --> 01:14:50,960
Okay.
1248
01:14:50,960 --> 01:14:54,040
Burn men's won that photo.
1249
01:14:54,040 --> 01:14:58,700
This was one of the positive comments that I took.
1250
01:14:58,700 --> 01:15:01,920
Best comp of the season on both sides in terms of setting in competition.
1251
01:15:01,920 --> 01:15:02,920
Thanks.
1252
01:15:02,920 --> 01:15:04,840
Well, thank you.
1253
01:15:04,840 --> 01:15:12,080
And then burn women's, again, just like the first photo I'd taken, the only one I had
1254
01:15:12,080 --> 01:15:13,080
taken.
1255
01:15:13,080 --> 01:15:18,720
This one I just wanted to talk a bit about since people are always asking for this.
1256
01:15:18,720 --> 01:15:24,320
I would love to see Yanya take on the men's course, realizing that not every woman would
1257
01:15:24,320 --> 01:15:27,320
be able to or want to take on a men's course.
1258
01:15:27,320 --> 01:15:29,880
I think she would love to test herself.
1259
01:15:29,880 --> 01:15:35,880
She has the drive to push the women's competition further and show just how strong women are.
1260
01:15:35,880 --> 01:15:38,040
She's in a class by herself.
1261
01:15:38,040 --> 01:15:40,260
Go Yanya.
1262
01:15:40,260 --> 01:15:45,340
So I think with this one, I just kind of wanted to ask how you think she would fare on a men's
1263
01:15:45,340 --> 01:15:56,680
route because as a viewer, I can't quite pinpoint why, but the boulders do look very different
1264
01:15:56,680 --> 01:16:00,040
and so yeah, I wonder how you think she would perform on them.
1265
01:16:00,040 --> 01:16:03,040
I think she would do well, to be completely honest.
1266
01:16:03,040 --> 01:16:05,680
I think she would do really well.
1267
01:16:05,680 --> 01:16:10,920
Exactly what really well looks like, I don't know.
1268
01:16:10,920 --> 01:16:14,000
I think if she had a good day, there's no reason.
1269
01:16:14,000 --> 01:16:20,240
I'm trying to think back critically here before I go put my foot in my mouth on a podcast.
1270
01:16:20,240 --> 01:16:22,240
And in terms of reach and stuff as well.
1271
01:16:22,240 --> 01:16:27,160
Well, she's not shorter than Serato, you know what I mean?
1272
01:16:27,160 --> 01:16:31,120
So that would be a non-issue there.
1273
01:16:31,120 --> 01:16:38,960
There are shorter like Nimrod, Marcus is not the tallest climber either, and Mechi is the
1274
01:16:38,960 --> 01:16:39,960
tallest.
1275
01:16:39,960 --> 01:16:46,800
Yeah, she would fall within the range of average athlete size.
1276
01:16:46,800 --> 01:16:47,800
I think she would do well.
1277
01:16:47,800 --> 01:16:54,760
I'm not going to put predictions on what she would do when and where, but I think she definitely
1278
01:16:54,760 --> 01:16:58,520
I feel like stands a chance, maybe more than stands a chance.
1279
01:16:58,520 --> 01:17:01,840
I think she could do well.
1280
01:17:01,840 --> 01:17:04,840
But yeah, I don't know what that would look like.
1281
01:17:04,840 --> 01:17:06,360
I don't know how that could work.
1282
01:17:06,360 --> 01:17:10,080
I don't know if that's ever her desire.
1283
01:17:10,080 --> 01:17:17,760
I was hanging out with one of her teammates and countryman, Gregor Vizonic, a couple of
1284
01:17:17,760 --> 01:17:19,920
months ago.
1285
01:17:19,920 --> 01:17:22,200
And he was kind of saying, I was like, oh yeah, how's she doing?
1286
01:17:22,200 --> 01:17:27,080
Because like, I won't say Yanya and I are like friends, but like we chat every now and
1287
01:17:27,080 --> 01:17:31,080
again, see how you're doing, check in, if we're at a comp, hang out, whatever, go get
1288
01:17:31,080 --> 01:17:32,960
a drink, catch up.
1289
01:17:32,960 --> 01:17:35,400
But I was asking, I was asking, how's she doing?
1290
01:17:35,400 --> 01:17:36,400
How you doing?
1291
01:17:36,400 --> 01:17:37,400
How's the team doing?
1292
01:17:37,400 --> 01:17:40,480
You know, whatever, like guys getting ready for the upcoming season, you know, whatever,
1293
01:17:40,480 --> 01:17:41,480
just standard.
1294
01:17:41,480 --> 01:17:44,720
And he's like, dude, Yanya is in like unreal form.
1295
01:17:44,720 --> 01:17:48,840
Like normally she apparently they have like this spray wall that they'll like do like
1296
01:17:48,840 --> 01:17:50,640
trainer boulders on and stuff like that.
1297
01:17:50,640 --> 01:17:56,440
And normally she's like, kind of right there, one and one, two with men, the men's field,
1298
01:17:56,440 --> 01:17:58,880
like she'll do the boulder, they'll do the boulder, they'll do the boulder, she'll do
1299
01:17:58,880 --> 01:18:00,760
the boulder in no particular order.
1300
01:18:00,760 --> 01:18:01,760
It's there.
1301
01:18:01,760 --> 01:18:06,100
And he said this year she's just like, like they won't touch the boulders and she does
1302
01:18:06,100 --> 01:18:07,320
the boulders.
1303
01:18:07,320 --> 01:18:12,280
And this isn't like random civilians, like this is their team.
1304
01:18:12,280 --> 01:18:13,280
You know what I mean?
1305
01:18:13,280 --> 01:18:18,240
So I think that she, yeah, she would smash.
1306
01:18:18,240 --> 01:18:22,040
So I'll see her in two weeks or three weeks.
1307
01:18:22,040 --> 01:18:23,500
So we'll see.
1308
01:18:23,500 --> 01:18:27,520
But yeah, she'd smash.
1309
01:18:27,520 --> 01:18:28,520
Really cool here.
1310
01:18:28,520 --> 01:18:29,520
Yeah, awesome.
1311
01:18:29,520 --> 01:18:30,520
Okay.
1312
01:18:30,520 --> 01:18:36,120
And then one thing, one last thing about Innsbruck, I think you had mentioned that you guys had
1313
01:18:36,120 --> 01:18:40,000
reset a whole boulder after it was signed off.
1314
01:18:40,000 --> 01:18:42,160
What happened there?
1315
01:18:42,160 --> 01:18:43,160
Great question.
1316
01:18:43,160 --> 01:18:50,040
So basically the way that the competition work week typically flows is that the beginning
1317
01:18:50,040 --> 01:18:54,280
of the week is like finals boulders go up and then like midweek is semis and then end
1318
01:18:54,280 --> 01:18:55,680
of the week is qualies.
1319
01:18:55,680 --> 01:19:00,880
And the reason for that is like, qualies are then left up on the wall and roll right into
1320
01:19:00,880 --> 01:19:07,720
the first day of qualifying for the competition.
1321
01:19:07,720 --> 01:19:11,480
And then also like finals happen first because you have the most amount of resources to pull
1322
01:19:11,480 --> 01:19:14,760
from and just kind of all the things.
1323
01:19:14,760 --> 01:19:20,720
So the way that we broke it down is the Innsbruck wall is pretty big and it had enough space
1324
01:19:20,720 --> 01:19:22,920
to put up all the finals boulders at once.
1325
01:19:22,920 --> 01:19:26,600
And so what we did was we kind of went like, all right, men's bay, women's bay, men's bay,
1326
01:19:26,600 --> 01:19:28,480
women's bay, men's bay, women's bay, all the way down.
1327
01:19:28,480 --> 01:19:31,420
So we didn't pick like this is men's one or this is women's three.
1328
01:19:31,420 --> 01:19:33,240
We just kind of said like, okay, this is the women's team.
1329
01:19:33,240 --> 01:19:34,240
This is the men's team.
1330
01:19:34,240 --> 01:19:35,240
Here's your bays.
1331
01:19:35,240 --> 01:19:36,240
We'll talk about style.
1332
01:19:36,240 --> 01:19:39,040
We'll talk about hold selection, the hold selection and style or the hold selections
1333
01:19:39,040 --> 01:19:40,040
in general.
1334
01:19:40,040 --> 01:19:41,040
That was a whole other conversation.
1335
01:19:41,040 --> 01:19:47,720
We had to be like very particular about which holds went on the wall during certain rounds
1336
01:19:47,720 --> 01:19:52,760
per the event organizer sponsorship agreements.
1337
01:19:52,760 --> 01:19:57,920
So that was a limiting factor on a number of occasions.
1338
01:19:57,920 --> 01:20:00,480
So it got to the point where we set this boulder and it was actually a boulder that I kind
1339
01:20:00,480 --> 01:20:03,480
of was pioneering.
1340
01:20:03,480 --> 01:20:08,220
And the concept for me was that like, if you were facing the Innsbruck wall, whatever,
1341
01:20:08,220 --> 01:20:10,500
you saw the Innsbruck wall, you're climbing, you're a rock climber.
1342
01:20:10,500 --> 01:20:18,680
But if you turned around, the audience and the wall and the mountains were just like
1343
01:20:18,680 --> 01:20:19,680
bananas.
1344
01:20:19,680 --> 01:20:22,400
It was so beautiful.
1345
01:20:22,400 --> 01:20:28,680
And like, I was like, I think we need to set some sort of like face out experience here,
1346
01:20:28,680 --> 01:20:31,160
both for the athletes and for the spectators.
1347
01:20:31,160 --> 01:20:35,040
Like the athletes get to look at the spectators and the wall and the, you know, like take
1348
01:20:35,040 --> 01:20:41,520
this in and then the spectators get to see the emotion of the climber as they're trying
1349
01:20:41,520 --> 01:20:44,200
really hard in a World Cup final.
1350
01:20:44,200 --> 01:20:46,640
So that was the concept.
1351
01:20:46,640 --> 01:20:52,840
Long story short, the concept got on the wall and I won't say it failed, but it definitely
1352
01:20:52,840 --> 01:21:00,520
did not meet my personal standard of what I would have liked to have seen be on the
1353
01:21:00,520 --> 01:21:03,080
wall for any round really.
1354
01:21:03,080 --> 01:21:05,240
It just, there were too many question marks remaining.
1355
01:21:05,240 --> 01:21:08,320
There were a number of like possibilities for cheating.
1356
01:21:08,320 --> 01:21:11,800
This was for a men's boulder, which ended up being men's one.
1357
01:21:11,800 --> 01:21:18,520
So if anyone remembers that boulder and I'll talk more about that, but it just like the
1358
01:21:18,520 --> 01:21:23,440
Bay, the zone was wrong and the holds that kind of were like picked out.
1359
01:21:23,440 --> 01:21:26,600
I just, I just didn't do a great job to be completely frank.
1360
01:21:26,600 --> 01:21:27,600
And we worked on it.
1361
01:21:27,600 --> 01:21:28,720
We spent a lot of time as a team.
1362
01:21:28,720 --> 01:21:32,880
The team invested a lot into this boulder and it just like didn't do it, you know?
1363
01:21:32,880 --> 01:21:36,640
So we ticked it, we picked it, the online observation came and the whole time I'm like,
1364
01:21:36,640 --> 01:21:40,520
damn it, like not your best Cody, you know?
1365
01:21:40,520 --> 01:21:46,440
And it kind of sat with me for a little bit and was, it wasn't like weighing on my week.
1366
01:21:46,440 --> 01:21:48,080
Like I was like, okay, it's done.
1367
01:21:48,080 --> 01:21:51,000
Now it's, now it's semi's day or now it's whatever day.
1368
01:21:51,000 --> 01:21:54,800
But after a little while I looked at the team and we had a really, really good team.
1369
01:21:54,800 --> 01:21:59,480
We always have a good team, but this, this team was like really jelling and like getting
1370
01:21:59,480 --> 01:22:01,260
stuff done.
1371
01:22:01,260 --> 01:22:02,260
We weren't limited by time.
1372
01:22:02,260 --> 01:22:04,680
We had no time constraints or anything like that.
1373
01:22:04,680 --> 01:22:09,760
So I went up to the chief, you know, at dinner one night or maybe it was at launch, something
1374
01:22:09,760 --> 01:22:10,760
like that.
1375
01:22:10,760 --> 01:22:14,400
I was like, Hey, what do you think about like, if we reset this?
1376
01:22:14,400 --> 01:22:18,480
And he's like, no, no, no, no, no.
1377
01:22:18,480 --> 01:22:20,160
And I was like, just think about it.
1378
01:22:20,160 --> 01:22:22,820
Like, you know, we have opportunity here.
1379
01:22:22,820 --> 01:22:24,720
We have an opportunity here to like make something really special.
1380
01:22:24,720 --> 01:22:25,800
And I don't know if we did it.
1381
01:22:25,800 --> 01:22:28,480
Like remember we have this potential beta break.
1382
01:22:28,480 --> 01:22:29,800
We have this potential beta break.
1383
01:22:29,800 --> 01:22:30,800
Like it's too easy here.
1384
01:22:30,800 --> 01:22:31,800
It's too hard here.
1385
01:22:31,800 --> 01:22:32,800
Like, okay, right.
1386
01:22:32,800 --> 01:22:33,800
Like, let's think about it.
1387
01:22:33,800 --> 01:22:37,760
And I was like, look, just think about it and I'll take it on if need be, if we have
1388
01:22:37,760 --> 01:22:41,720
time or whatever, like, and he's like, yeah, but then you have to deal with online observation.
1389
01:22:41,720 --> 01:22:45,680
I was like, look, if we have the time and space, just like, just tell me Cody, you have
1390
01:22:45,680 --> 01:22:50,040
two hours or you have three hours and like, whatever it is and I'll make it, I'll make
1391
01:22:50,040 --> 01:22:51,040
it happen.
1392
01:22:51,040 --> 01:22:53,680
And if it doesn't happen, then we already know we have a boulder that's like in our
1393
01:22:53,680 --> 01:22:54,680
pocket.
1394
01:22:54,680 --> 01:22:55,680
You know what I mean?
1395
01:22:55,680 --> 01:22:58,520
Like this boulder, the show will still go on.
1396
01:22:58,520 --> 01:23:06,040
So I ended up getting the opportunity, reset this boulder, then brought the team over.
1397
01:23:06,040 --> 01:23:10,480
I was at that point able to move the boulder over a bay, over a lane.
1398
01:23:10,480 --> 01:23:16,840
So it was a much more compelling lane for the movement that we were chasing, which was
1399
01:23:16,840 --> 01:23:19,320
that pressing and all that.
1400
01:23:19,320 --> 01:23:22,840
And it like, it was like butter.
1401
01:23:22,840 --> 01:23:27,400
It just went, it just flowed because it was like the right area with the right tools for
1402
01:23:27,400 --> 01:23:28,800
the job.
1403
01:23:28,800 --> 01:23:32,400
And it was kind of a testament to like sometimes, you know, trying to put a square peg in a
1404
01:23:32,400 --> 01:23:36,680
round hole, just like, ain't it, you know, you just like, you can, you can have all the
1405
01:23:36,680 --> 01:23:42,080
time in the world and the best, the best workers working on the thing, but if it's just not
1406
01:23:42,080 --> 01:23:44,640
fitting, maybe it's just not fitting.
1407
01:23:44,640 --> 01:23:49,800
So we got lucky and maybe we set up ourselves with luck by being able to work.
1408
01:23:49,800 --> 01:23:51,480
We worked pretty hard prior.
1409
01:23:51,480 --> 01:23:52,480
The team came together.
1410
01:23:52,480 --> 01:23:57,840
We had a really nice session on this, on this climb, got it to where it wanted to be.
1411
01:23:57,840 --> 01:24:02,320
And honestly, I was like super, super happy with it by the end of like when the competition
1412
01:24:02,320 --> 01:24:07,840
was going on, it met exactly our quota for what we wanted to see in terms of performance
1413
01:24:07,840 --> 01:24:08,840
on the athletes.
1414
01:24:08,840 --> 01:24:11,480
And it was like a super exciting start to the show.
1415
01:24:11,480 --> 01:24:12,480
And that's what we wanted.
1416
01:24:12,480 --> 01:24:14,240
We wanted to like get the show off with a bang.
1417
01:24:14,240 --> 01:24:18,560
It's the last World Cup men's finals of the season, get the crowd in it, get the athletes
1418
01:24:18,560 --> 01:24:25,960
in it, be like a fun, uh, pressy, funky thing, huge jump, lots of tops.
1419
01:24:25,960 --> 01:24:28,840
Um, and yeah, so it was cool.
1420
01:24:28,840 --> 01:24:29,840
It was really, really cool.
1421
01:24:29,840 --> 01:24:33,760
I was like very, very happy to have that experience.
1422
01:24:33,760 --> 01:24:36,480
And did you still manage to have that face out moment?
1423
01:24:36,480 --> 01:24:41,920
Yeah, actually it was like way more pure in this way because the panel that was initially
1424
01:24:41,920 --> 01:24:48,360
allocated was maybe it was only like 20 degrees or 25 degrees overhanging.
1425
01:24:48,360 --> 01:24:51,800
And so we were having to like build out with a lot of volumes and larger holds.
1426
01:24:51,800 --> 01:24:54,920
But the problem is, is that the wall was completely flat.
1427
01:24:54,920 --> 01:25:00,940
And so we had to use vol- like these volumes, but kind of like I was mentioning earlier,
1428
01:25:00,940 --> 01:25:07,320
we were fixed as to which brands we were allowed to use in certain rounds based on like sponsorship
1429
01:25:07,320 --> 01:25:08,320
agreements.
1430
01:25:08,320 --> 01:25:16,480
And so due to the selection of other boulders that happened prior to this boulder, I was
1431
01:25:16,480 --> 01:25:22,720
left kind of with a certain pool of holds and certain brands to pick from.
1432
01:25:22,720 --> 01:25:27,200
And it just didn't quite fit the needs of that profile.
1433
01:25:27,200 --> 01:25:32,320
But then when we switched profiles, it turned into this more much steeper cave with like
1434
01:25:32,320 --> 01:25:37,400
a kind of dihedral-ish situation.
1435
01:25:37,400 --> 01:25:42,040
Then those holds actually worked perfectly for what we were trying to create because
1436
01:25:42,040 --> 01:25:43,200
they were lower profile.
1437
01:25:43,200 --> 01:25:48,760
They did have a lot of surface area, but it wasn't the right tool for the job in the previous
1438
01:25:48,760 --> 01:25:49,760
version.
1439
01:25:49,760 --> 01:25:52,920
It was exactly the right tool for the job when we move things around.
1440
01:25:52,920 --> 01:25:53,920
So yeah.
1441
01:25:53,920 --> 01:25:54,920
Wow.
1442
01:25:54,920 --> 01:25:55,920
Yeah.
1443
01:25:55,920 --> 01:26:01,360
I feel like it's really cool hearing the concept behind the boulders.
1444
01:26:01,360 --> 01:26:06,880
It makes me feel like I should go back and rewatch them now knowing this and then seeing
1445
01:26:06,880 --> 01:26:12,880
how it, I guess, translates over the video screen and like seeing how the climbers climb
1446
01:26:12,880 --> 01:26:13,880
so.
1447
01:26:13,880 --> 01:26:14,880
Yeah.
1448
01:26:14,880 --> 01:26:16,920
It's really interesting to hear behind the scenes.
1449
01:26:16,920 --> 01:26:20,800
Please excuse this brief intermission, but I would just like to remind you that if you
1450
01:26:20,800 --> 01:26:25,560
are enjoying this podcast, please follow and rate it on your preferred listening platform.
1451
01:26:25,560 --> 01:26:29,240
If you're watching on YouTube, I would love to hear your discussion and thoughts in the
1452
01:26:29,240 --> 01:26:30,920
comments below.
1453
01:26:30,920 --> 01:26:35,680
Anything helps to push this podcast out to more people and get even more amazing guests
1454
01:26:35,680 --> 01:26:36,680
on.
1455
01:26:36,680 --> 01:26:38,120
Back to the show.
1456
01:26:38,120 --> 01:26:41,360
One last question about IFSC related setting.
1457
01:26:41,360 --> 01:26:46,400
I think this was also one of the discord questions that someone had asked.
1458
01:26:46,400 --> 01:26:52,560
Where do you see IFSC setting top level comp setting evolving to?
1459
01:26:52,560 --> 01:26:57,440
I think what will happen.
1460
01:26:57,440 --> 01:27:03,880
I think the most likely course of action, again, broad strokes on the whole, is that
1461
01:27:03,880 --> 01:27:12,280
the setting will be more dictated by the parameters of the given event.
1462
01:27:12,280 --> 01:27:18,800
For example, when we have Olympic qualifying events this year or we have, let's say, the
1463
01:27:18,800 --> 01:27:24,560
Olympics themselves, there's multi-zone scoring.
1464
01:27:24,560 --> 01:27:32,360
We saw this at a few different comps so far, like if it was continental events.
1465
01:27:32,360 --> 01:27:33,360
We've seen this.
1466
01:27:33,360 --> 01:27:37,800
You're going to have a low zone effectively, a zone, and a top.
1467
01:27:37,800 --> 01:27:40,880
I don't remember exactly, but you get a minimum amount of points for the first zone.
1468
01:27:40,880 --> 01:27:44,560
I think it was like 5, 10, 25, maybe, if that's what it is.
1469
01:27:44,560 --> 01:27:45,560
I'd be lying to you.
1470
01:27:45,560 --> 01:27:48,160
I don't remember off the top of my head.
1471
01:27:48,160 --> 01:27:55,120
What you end up seeing is you need moments in between the zones.
1472
01:27:55,120 --> 01:27:57,980
At least a lot of times that's what it's interpreted as.
1473
01:27:57,980 --> 01:27:59,880
Why do you get a zone?
1474
01:27:59,880 --> 01:28:00,880
Why?
1475
01:28:00,880 --> 01:28:04,440
Because you've done something to demarcate success.
1476
01:28:04,440 --> 01:28:08,640
Someone is thinking that that is successful.
1477
01:28:08,640 --> 01:28:15,400
I think, at least for this season, you might notice maybe a little more choppiness, especially
1478
01:28:15,400 --> 01:28:19,040
when we're trying to represent all the styles still.
1479
01:28:19,040 --> 01:28:26,560
You might be able to represent a few more styles or at least a little bit of extra in-between
1480
01:28:26,560 --> 01:28:29,200
because now we kind of have this extra zone to play with.
1481
01:28:29,200 --> 01:28:35,120
Numerically, it does create some problems where the difference between start and low
1482
01:28:35,120 --> 01:28:36,120
zone is 5 points.
1483
01:28:36,120 --> 01:28:37,440
Okay, so it's 5 points.
1484
01:28:37,440 --> 01:28:39,600
The next is, again, 5 more points.
1485
01:28:39,600 --> 01:28:41,600
It's 5 to 10.
1486
01:28:41,600 --> 01:28:47,000
But then that zone to top is a 15-point differential.
1487
01:28:47,000 --> 01:28:54,080
Now you're at 25, so you have to showcase some sort of exceptional moment, I would say,
1488
01:28:54,080 --> 01:28:59,840
to demarcate the difference in athlete performance from zone to top.
1489
01:28:59,840 --> 01:29:08,080
So I think you might end up seeing maybe more similar styles to what we saw in burn, both
1490
01:29:08,080 --> 01:29:13,400
in the world championship and the combined.
1491
01:29:13,400 --> 01:29:19,880
Just more action up high and more success down low, which I think does actually answer
1492
01:29:19,880 --> 01:29:25,800
some of the folks' questions or feedback from what we read on the YouTube videos.
1493
01:29:25,800 --> 01:29:28,640
It's not that fun to watch people just try and fail off the ground.
1494
01:29:28,640 --> 01:29:30,240
And that's true.
1495
01:29:30,240 --> 01:29:34,220
So you're going to see more of building moments, I think, as people learn moves.
1496
01:29:34,220 --> 01:29:36,240
But I think you'll also see more learned moves.
1497
01:29:36,240 --> 01:29:41,520
So I don't think we're going to get away from more coordination style.
1498
01:29:41,520 --> 01:29:48,400
I think we might see more lower body coordination, more things having to do with hips and core
1499
01:29:48,400 --> 01:29:57,440
and legs and feet, because they require just a different ask of the athlete.
1500
01:29:57,440 --> 01:30:04,240
A lot of times if we have coordination up high, hand cordo, it's limited or determined,
1501
01:30:04,240 --> 01:30:06,840
success or failure is a lot of times, it's determined by a lot of things.
1502
01:30:06,840 --> 01:30:12,840
But if I can pull more or hold longer, I'm more likely to succeed.
1503
01:30:12,840 --> 01:30:17,400
A lot of times, again, I'm like broad strokes, but if it's more lower body and core and
1504
01:30:17,400 --> 01:30:22,960
feet and stuff, then there's more learning involved and maybe more leg power involved
1505
01:30:22,960 --> 01:30:23,960
and more.
1506
01:30:23,960 --> 01:30:24,960
You know what I mean?
1507
01:30:24,960 --> 01:30:26,840
So you might see more of that.
1508
01:30:26,840 --> 01:30:31,660
But I would say you might see more of the stuff like we saw in that high flying fun
1509
01:30:31,660 --> 01:30:32,660
boulder in Hachioji.
1510
01:30:32,660 --> 01:30:39,780
If it's a coordination boulder, you're going to need to showcase coordination in some numerical
1511
01:30:39,780 --> 01:30:41,480
differential from zone to top.
1512
01:30:41,480 --> 01:30:44,120
So what's that going to look like?
1513
01:30:44,120 --> 01:30:46,800
I can guess as well as you, but that'd be my guess.
1514
01:30:46,800 --> 01:30:51,640
It'd suck if that like, to use our example earlier, where if Ginny's like the cordo
1515
01:30:51,640 --> 01:30:59,280
master and I'm just a power climber, I'm just going to pull on holds, that the thing
1516
01:30:59,280 --> 01:31:03,240
that's going to, like the boulder that's for your comp for cordo and you're like, you turn
1517
01:31:03,240 --> 01:31:05,720
around like, yes, it's cordobolder.
1518
01:31:05,720 --> 01:31:09,960
You only get to do that from zero to five or from five to 10, right?
1519
01:31:09,960 --> 01:31:14,480
But it's an easy enough version that I'm also able to play and fight on it.
1520
01:31:14,480 --> 01:31:19,360
So then I also can get those points and showcase my skills, even though my skills are much
1521
01:31:19,360 --> 01:31:22,400
less than you in this represented style.
1522
01:31:22,400 --> 01:31:27,360
But then the top of the cordobolder is just like grabbing on a four mil edge and just
1523
01:31:27,360 --> 01:31:30,440
yarding to another four mil edge, right?
1524
01:31:30,440 --> 01:31:31,440
But that's the cordobolder.
1525
01:31:31,440 --> 01:31:32,440
Do you know what I mean?
1526
01:31:32,440 --> 01:31:36,440
Like then it's like, well, we don't, we didn't represent the coordination style climber.
1527
01:31:36,440 --> 01:31:41,780
We represented the power climber, really, at the end of it.
1528
01:31:41,780 --> 01:31:47,480
So I guess in summary, there will probably be lots of changes and it will be dictated
1529
01:31:47,480 --> 01:31:51,960
by the field, the rules, the field of play will be dictated, I think a lot by the rules
1530
01:31:51,960 --> 01:31:53,360
and the scoring.
1531
01:31:53,360 --> 01:31:59,000
And we're, if nothing else, I know no matter who's on the teams, they're going to be, you
1532
01:31:59,000 --> 01:32:01,840
know, firing on all cylinders to create the best comp.
1533
01:32:01,840 --> 01:32:05,440
So if nothing else, know that.
1534
01:32:05,440 --> 01:32:09,240
And what does like lower body coordination look like to you?
1535
01:32:09,240 --> 01:32:11,360
Do you have like an example of that?
1536
01:32:11,360 --> 01:32:18,320
So it's not, this isn't the most pure version, but if we looked back on women's one Prague
1537
01:32:18,320 --> 01:32:21,520
finals, it was a green and black boulder.
1538
01:32:21,520 --> 01:32:26,360
It was like green rock city fiberglass with black volumes.
1539
01:32:26,360 --> 01:32:31,280
And it was this Lachey or Lombada or swing set or whatever you want to call it.
1540
01:32:31,280 --> 01:32:35,620
You like jump to these two holds and you like did this swing, then you time it right.
1541
01:32:35,620 --> 01:32:40,400
And then as you're swinging, you match this hold and generate off this, you hate him or
1542
01:32:40,400 --> 01:32:41,400
you love him.
1543
01:32:41,400 --> 01:32:42,400
Oh, I love them.
1544
01:32:42,400 --> 01:32:43,400
Oh, you love them.
1545
01:32:43,400 --> 01:32:44,400
Okay.
1546
01:32:44,400 --> 01:32:47,320
And then, but like, so you need upper body, like, okay.
1547
01:32:47,320 --> 01:32:49,880
So someone who's listening is like, well, Cody, that's all upper body, there's no
1548
01:32:49,880 --> 01:32:51,480
upper body left or no lower body.
1549
01:32:51,480 --> 01:32:53,240
That just like to get the generation started.
1550
01:32:53,240 --> 01:32:55,920
That's like, that's integral to the move.
1551
01:32:55,920 --> 01:32:56,920
Yes.
1552
01:32:56,920 --> 01:32:58,720
But it's not like there's so much more to come.
1553
01:32:58,720 --> 01:33:03,240
So then you like do this thing and then you have to time your hips with the trajectory
1554
01:33:03,240 --> 01:33:05,160
of your body into the wall.
1555
01:33:05,160 --> 01:33:06,160
Right.
1556
01:33:06,160 --> 01:33:07,920
And where do you release that point?
1557
01:33:07,920 --> 01:33:08,920
Right.
1558
01:33:08,920 --> 01:33:12,240
So that's on how you're releasing this hold, how you timed this.
1559
01:33:12,240 --> 01:33:13,240
Right.
1560
01:33:13,240 --> 01:33:15,080
And then where do you land on this volume?
1561
01:33:15,080 --> 01:33:16,560
Do you, do you cheat inside?
1562
01:33:16,560 --> 01:33:17,560
Do you cheat outside?
1563
01:33:17,560 --> 01:33:19,560
Do you cheat forward or back?
1564
01:33:19,560 --> 01:33:21,480
Where's your ankle landing?
1565
01:33:21,480 --> 01:33:23,120
How flat's your foot?
1566
01:33:23,120 --> 01:33:24,640
And then we're not even there yet.
1567
01:33:24,640 --> 01:33:25,640
Right.
1568
01:33:25,640 --> 01:33:26,640
That's just like the interaction point.
1569
01:33:26,640 --> 01:33:30,120
That's like, then you still have the whole reception of what happens after.
1570
01:33:30,120 --> 01:33:31,120
What are you doing with your hand?
1571
01:33:31,120 --> 01:33:32,120
Right.
1572
01:33:32,120 --> 01:33:33,520
What are you doing with your, with your foot?
1573
01:33:33,520 --> 01:33:34,560
Are you stutter stepping?
1574
01:33:34,560 --> 01:33:35,560
Are you toe catching?
1575
01:33:35,560 --> 01:33:36,560
Right.
1576
01:33:36,560 --> 01:33:42,440
So you're putting in these levels of complexity that are asking questions in time and space
1577
01:33:42,440 --> 01:33:47,000
to the climber that they have to, they can only get the opportunity to learn or answer
1578
01:33:47,000 --> 01:33:48,760
as it's occurring.
1579
01:33:48,760 --> 01:33:53,700
You can't like just be like, I'll pull harder and I'll do the move.
1580
01:33:53,700 --> 01:33:57,240
You have to be like, I need to be better to do the move.
1581
01:33:57,240 --> 01:33:58,560
And so what is being better?
1582
01:33:58,560 --> 01:33:59,560
Okay.
1583
01:33:59,560 --> 01:34:05,040
Let me critically evaluate what I just did here and I failed because, and then work backwards,
1584
01:34:05,040 --> 01:34:06,040
right.
1585
01:34:06,040 --> 01:34:10,280
And then maybe to move forwards, then I must fill in the blank.
1586
01:34:10,280 --> 01:34:18,160
So maybe it may be full body rather than just lower body, but those two things I think we'll
1587
01:34:18,160 --> 01:34:19,800
see, you'll probably see some more of.
1588
01:34:19,800 --> 01:34:20,800
Yeah.
1589
01:34:20,800 --> 01:34:25,240
I mean, we've definitely already started seeing a ton of those and I love like the shame moves
1590
01:34:25,240 --> 01:34:26,240
as well.
1591
01:34:26,240 --> 01:34:28,240
I'm still personally trying to figure them out.
1592
01:34:28,240 --> 01:34:30,720
I just can't get it working.
1593
01:34:30,720 --> 01:34:33,960
I don't know why, but there's a lot of steps to it.
1594
01:34:33,960 --> 01:34:34,960
So maybe that's why.
1595
01:34:34,960 --> 01:34:40,440
It's a lot of learning, but then I'll say that like, once you figure out functionally
1596
01:34:40,440 --> 01:34:45,520
why it works for you, even like if you just figure out the 101 or 102 version or wherever
1597
01:34:45,520 --> 01:34:49,240
you're at in your experience, it doesn't matter which you figure out kind of the meat and
1598
01:34:49,240 --> 01:34:51,400
potatoes and what makes that work.
1599
01:34:51,400 --> 01:34:54,920
And you then have the building blocks for all the moves afterwards.
1600
01:34:54,920 --> 01:34:58,440
And that's why they're, I think a lot, they're really popular right now is that like, you
1601
01:34:58,440 --> 01:35:00,420
can just like get better at them.
1602
01:35:00,420 --> 01:35:02,400
You can learn how to get better at them.
1603
01:35:02,400 --> 01:35:07,720
You don't have to go to the hangboard or like the tension board or the moon board and like,
1604
01:35:07,720 --> 01:35:08,720
that's still valued.
1605
01:35:08,720 --> 01:35:09,720
Like you still should do that.
1606
01:35:09,720 --> 01:35:14,020
Like to become a well-rounded climber, you need to have that like grit, right?
1607
01:35:14,020 --> 01:35:17,940
But then there's also this fun aspect of like, oh, I'm learning something new about my body
1608
01:35:17,940 --> 01:35:21,560
and myself and my, how I'm interacting on the wall.
1609
01:35:21,560 --> 01:35:27,720
That's like very, very appealing to, I think an increasingly large percentage of the population.
1610
01:35:27,720 --> 01:35:34,000
And it just so happens to also be awesome for competition separation on really low intensity
1611
01:35:34,000 --> 01:35:37,720
level moves, which is also quite nice.
1612
01:35:37,720 --> 01:35:38,720
Yeah.
1613
01:35:38,720 --> 01:35:42,720
There's something very satisfying about that point where you're working on it and then
1614
01:35:42,720 --> 01:35:47,480
you kind of unlock it for yourself or you finally understand how your body moves in
1615
01:35:47,480 --> 01:35:48,480
that way.
1616
01:35:48,480 --> 01:35:52,040
And then it gets like, all of those get a bit easier.
1617
01:35:52,040 --> 01:35:57,040
And then you just add on the other layers of like little tweaks that make it a bit more,
1618
01:35:57,040 --> 01:35:58,320
a bit more weird.
1619
01:35:58,320 --> 01:35:59,320
Yeah.
1620
01:35:59,320 --> 01:36:01,240
Climbers like checking boxes, right?
1621
01:36:01,240 --> 01:36:07,080
And like, if you can figure out, okay, I know how to start this style of move now and then,
1622
01:36:07,080 --> 01:36:11,160
okay, now I know how to add in a different style of this other move.
1623
01:36:11,160 --> 01:36:16,680
And then you can start almost like Lego blocking them together to create these chains of things.
1624
01:36:16,680 --> 01:36:21,120
You know, you can start checking these boxes and okay, I've unlocked that skill now and
1625
01:36:21,120 --> 01:36:24,920
now I can approach another skill that I can add into this, right?
1626
01:36:24,920 --> 01:36:29,560
Now I can check another box of my skills and just keep developing all at the same time.
1627
01:36:29,560 --> 01:36:31,760
You're still becoming a better, stronger climber.
1628
01:36:31,760 --> 01:36:35,040
You know, your fingers are getting stronger, your biceps are getting stronger, your back
1629
01:36:35,040 --> 01:36:36,040
is getting stronger, legs.
1630
01:36:36,040 --> 01:36:39,000
They can be excited to unlock that one.
1631
01:36:39,000 --> 01:36:40,000
Heck yeah.
1632
01:36:40,000 --> 01:36:45,400
Well, you can come visit or open it up a climbing gym up here just south of Boston.
1633
01:36:45,400 --> 01:36:47,760
So we're going to have all kinds of styles of climbing.
1634
01:36:47,760 --> 01:36:48,760
Don't get me wrong.
1635
01:36:48,760 --> 01:36:56,440
We'll have a lot of resources available to us to create those special style moves as
1636
01:36:56,440 --> 01:36:57,440
well.
1637
01:36:57,440 --> 01:36:58,440
Oh yeah.
1638
01:36:58,440 --> 01:36:59,440
I'll visit for sure.
1639
01:36:59,440 --> 01:37:00,440
I'll let you know.
1640
01:37:00,440 --> 01:37:02,480
And yeah, we'll talk about that as well.
1641
01:37:02,480 --> 01:37:08,720
But yeah, let's get back into like the general route setting kind of stuff.
1642
01:37:08,720 --> 01:37:14,280
So how hard do you climb versus the climbers that you're setting for?
1643
01:37:14,280 --> 01:37:22,760
And do you ever kind of feel intimidated setting for these like elite worldwide level climbers?
1644
01:37:22,760 --> 01:37:25,920
Those are two really, really good questions.
1645
01:37:25,920 --> 01:37:32,320
And maybe I'll flip them in answering them.
1646
01:37:32,320 --> 01:37:34,440
Sure.
1647
01:37:34,440 --> 01:37:40,960
I'll say that like, I think now that I've had a number of opportunities to work alongside
1648
01:37:40,960 --> 01:37:49,600
these athletes, both in competition setting or workshop setting or whatever it is, you
1649
01:37:49,600 --> 01:37:52,080
realize, I know it's like the funny thing.
1650
01:37:52,080 --> 01:37:53,160
It's like they're just people too.
1651
01:37:53,160 --> 01:37:54,160
And it's like they are.
1652
01:37:54,160 --> 01:37:55,160
You know what I mean?
1653
01:37:55,160 --> 01:37:59,840
They just like happen to, for whatever reason, to fall into this life.
1654
01:37:59,840 --> 01:38:04,860
And they're really, really good climbers and they're exceptional people and their methodologies
1655
01:38:04,860 --> 01:38:06,640
and their trainings and all that stuff.
1656
01:38:06,640 --> 01:38:10,120
And I remember the first, like I remember when I went to Poland that first time to set
1657
01:38:10,120 --> 01:38:18,600
for this international event, I was like worried, you know, I was like, am I good enough?
1658
01:38:18,600 --> 01:38:20,760
Is this imposter syndrome situation happening?
1659
01:38:20,760 --> 01:38:22,360
Am I supposed to be here?
1660
01:38:22,360 --> 01:38:24,560
Is like, and this is for a kids comp, you know what I mean?
1661
01:38:24,560 --> 01:38:28,560
These are just like, I mean, granted it was 26 nations, you know, 26 countries are all
1662
01:38:28,560 --> 01:38:33,600
coming to Poland to climb on shit that I'm being a part of help create.
1663
01:38:33,600 --> 01:38:39,320
So you feel the pressure, the coaches, the parents, the athletes.
1664
01:38:39,320 --> 01:38:42,360
But then you check that box and you're like, okay, like I did it.
1665
01:38:42,360 --> 01:38:45,640
Like, okay, like maybe I am supposed to be here.
1666
01:38:45,640 --> 01:38:46,640
Things could have been better.
1667
01:38:46,640 --> 01:38:49,200
I can, I can self analyze and self assess and be like, I could have done this better
1668
01:38:49,200 --> 01:38:51,880
and I should have done that better, but also give yourself some grace.
1669
01:38:51,880 --> 01:38:52,880
Like you did this.
1670
01:38:52,880 --> 01:38:53,880
Okay.
1671
01:38:53,880 --> 01:38:54,880
You did this.
1672
01:38:54,880 --> 01:38:55,880
Okay.
1673
01:38:55,880 --> 01:39:00,680
And then I think that just like develops, you know, so then, you know, I, um, for ran
1674
01:39:00,680 --> 01:39:08,280
for my first world cup and there was a lot of nervousness in a way because a root setter
1675
01:39:08,280 --> 01:39:11,800
has had this conversation a lot and I don't care if you've, this is your first QE that
1676
01:39:11,800 --> 01:39:17,400
you're ever setting or literally world championships.
1677
01:39:17,400 --> 01:39:20,400
You're you were always worried year over year of year.
1678
01:39:20,400 --> 01:39:21,720
Like is this it?
1679
01:39:21,720 --> 01:39:23,480
Is this my last chance?
1680
01:39:23,480 --> 01:39:28,360
Like I have to show my best because if I don't, what happens if I just don't get selected
1681
01:39:28,360 --> 01:39:29,360
again?
1682
01:39:29,360 --> 01:39:33,440
Is it, is it because of something that I could do right now or, or don't do right now?
1683
01:39:33,440 --> 01:39:38,280
So I'm feeling quite a bit of pressure for that, but I tried to just like, okay, no,
1684
01:39:38,280 --> 01:39:39,280
I'm good.
1685
01:39:39,280 --> 01:39:40,280
I've been training.
1686
01:39:40,280 --> 01:39:41,280
I feel in good shape.
1687
01:39:41,280 --> 01:39:47,520
I, I'm going to do my best to, I'm going to try my best to be the best person of what
1688
01:39:47,520 --> 01:39:49,880
they want to see, right?
1689
01:39:49,880 --> 01:39:51,640
What are they, what do they need from me?
1690
01:39:51,640 --> 01:39:53,440
I'm going to offer that to them.
1691
01:39:53,440 --> 01:39:57,480
I'm not going to do more, um, unless they would like to see it because I don't want
1692
01:39:57,480 --> 01:40:00,880
to be overbearing or anything like that.
1693
01:40:00,880 --> 01:40:05,640
Um, and just be the best asset to the team and to create the best competition that I
1694
01:40:05,640 --> 01:40:06,640
can.
1695
01:40:06,640 --> 01:40:07,640
That's what I always, I always go back to.
1696
01:40:07,640 --> 01:40:08,640
So it's about the competition.
1697
01:40:08,640 --> 01:40:11,920
Um, so I want to be a part of it.
1698
01:40:11,920 --> 01:40:16,480
And that's the part that could feel intimidating sometimes, but less so the athletes.
1699
01:40:16,480 --> 01:40:20,400
Like it's almost, it's like the environment beforehand and it's like the athletes, they're,
1700
01:40:20,400 --> 01:40:21,600
they're coming whether we like it or not.
1701
01:40:21,600 --> 01:40:22,600
You know what I mean?
1702
01:40:22,600 --> 01:40:26,720
Like Saturday morning comes or Friday morning comes, whatever the comp is, like those athletes
1703
01:40:26,720 --> 01:40:27,720
are coming.
1704
01:40:27,720 --> 01:40:32,560
Like, you know, you can sometimes like, you know, you'd be like, oh shit, like that's
1705
01:40:32,560 --> 01:40:33,560
Adam Andra.
1706
01:40:33,560 --> 01:40:39,160
Like he is, he's climbed some stuff, you know, or like, oh, there's a, you know, Brooke
1707
01:40:39,160 --> 01:40:40,160
Rabbit too.
1708
01:40:40,160 --> 01:40:42,480
And I've been, I've been setting for her for a very, very long time, all the way like through
1709
01:40:42,480 --> 01:40:43,480
her youth circuit.
1710
01:40:43,480 --> 01:40:47,320
But then you see her now and you're like, you know, wow, or Natalia, that's, that's
1711
01:40:47,320 --> 01:40:48,780
our Olympian, you know?
1712
01:40:48,780 --> 01:40:51,600
So sometimes, you know, you kind of step back and you're like, oh wow, that can be a little
1713
01:40:51,600 --> 01:40:55,760
bit, uh, you know, if nothing else, you're like, this is important.
1714
01:40:55,760 --> 01:40:57,840
I need to take my job seriously here.
1715
01:40:57,840 --> 01:41:00,400
Like, I think that's, that's that.
1716
01:41:00,400 --> 01:41:07,720
But as far as climbing level, uh, Ginny, that's like a trillion, trillion dollar question.
1717
01:41:07,720 --> 01:41:12,400
And like, like outdoor grades and indoor grades and whether you climb in the South versus
1718
01:41:12,400 --> 01:41:18,120
the North versus West Coast versus Columbia versus, you know, Iran, like sure there's
1719
01:41:18,120 --> 01:41:20,480
like relative levels.
1720
01:41:20,480 --> 01:41:28,600
Um, there's stylistic preferences based on area development for sure.
1721
01:41:28,600 --> 01:41:33,280
Like if there's any truism in climbing, I would say that's one of them.
1722
01:41:33,280 --> 01:41:38,800
Um, but as far as competition, route setting and climbing, the one thing that I'll, I
1723
01:41:38,800 --> 01:41:43,500
won't, I can't really answer your question so, so well, because we don't even use V grades
1724
01:41:43,500 --> 01:41:45,600
in comp setting at all.
1725
01:41:45,600 --> 01:41:46,600
We don't, we talk about levels.
1726
01:41:46,600 --> 01:41:53,600
We talk about athlete success or failure given, uh, certain, uh, parameters.
1727
01:41:53,600 --> 01:41:54,840
But one thing I'll never forget.
1728
01:41:54,840 --> 01:41:57,400
So I was working with Josh a lot, uh, Josh Larson.
1729
01:41:57,400 --> 01:42:01,440
He's like, like I was mentioning, like our national team coach, Olympic team coach, and
1730
01:42:01,440 --> 01:42:04,840
he's been a friend of mine for like years just due to the nature that we like kind of
1731
01:42:04,840 --> 01:42:07,560
lived close and we ended up sitting at the same gym and he was the head setter and like
1732
01:42:07,560 --> 01:42:08,560
whatever.
1733
01:42:08,560 --> 01:42:13,200
Um, and I remember like years and years and years and years ago, he was, he's such a good
1734
01:42:13,200 --> 01:42:14,200
climber.
1735
01:42:14,200 --> 01:42:17,920
He's an outdoor climber, indoor climber, just like he's fucking amazing.
1736
01:42:17,920 --> 01:42:19,240
There's no other, no other way to go around.
1737
01:42:19,240 --> 01:42:20,240
He's only gotten better over the years.
1738
01:42:20,240 --> 01:42:21,520
I don't understand it.
1739
01:42:21,520 --> 01:42:24,440
Uh, it's just, it's impressive.
1740
01:42:24,440 --> 01:42:30,820
And I remember we went, we went up to Montreal for a comp one time, me, him, his brother
1741
01:42:30,820 --> 01:42:36,280
and this woman, Isabel Faus, who's like the most low key crusher in American rock climbing.
1742
01:42:36,280 --> 01:42:37,840
If you don't know who she is, look her up.
1743
01:42:37,840 --> 01:42:40,480
She's like bananas.
1744
01:42:40,480 --> 01:42:42,680
Like she's climbed more V 14, V 15.
1745
01:42:42,680 --> 01:42:44,160
I think she's gone V 15.
1746
01:42:44,160 --> 01:42:47,040
I was like, she's so good.
1747
01:42:47,040 --> 01:42:51,600
We went up and like, I wanted to make finals and I didn't make finals and I was bummed
1748
01:42:51,600 --> 01:42:54,580
out and Josh made finals and I was like, dude, how do you do it?
1749
01:42:54,580 --> 01:42:59,720
Like how do you balance, you know, like commercial route setting, competition route setting and
1750
01:42:59,720 --> 01:43:00,720
outdoor climbing?
1751
01:43:00,720 --> 01:43:03,360
Cause he also climbed outdoors way stronger than me.
1752
01:43:03,360 --> 01:43:07,480
And I was like, I want to reach whatever this level or this level.
1753
01:43:07,480 --> 01:43:12,040
And I was like struggling and he's like, dude, like at some point you got to pick one, you
1754
01:43:12,040 --> 01:43:13,040
know?
1755
01:43:13,040 --> 01:43:14,520
And no matter what you're going to get better.
1756
01:43:14,520 --> 01:43:19,520
And if you get better at one, the other one will trail and you will also, it will elevate,
1757
01:43:19,520 --> 01:43:20,520
but like you got to pick one.
1758
01:43:20,520 --> 01:43:22,320
And I was like, I don't want to pick one.
1759
01:43:22,320 --> 01:43:25,520
And he's like, he's like the best athletes do, you know what I mean?
1760
01:43:25,520 --> 01:43:31,680
Like a lot of times like you look at traditional sports, the best pitchers aren't batting
1761
01:43:31,680 --> 01:43:34,520
cleanup and hitting grand slams, right?
1762
01:43:34,520 --> 01:43:40,060
You look at, you know, hockey, the best scorers aren't always the best defenseman.
1763
01:43:40,060 --> 01:43:46,800
You know, there's like, maybe these aren't the best examples of comparison, but like
1764
01:43:46,800 --> 01:43:50,720
sometimes you have to like pick a lane and try to focus on it and get really, really
1765
01:43:50,720 --> 01:43:54,180
more experience or experience as you can.
1766
01:43:54,180 --> 01:43:58,920
And so for me, I, for what this is worth, this is a super fucking long winded way to
1767
01:43:58,920 --> 01:44:04,440
say that like I've noticed personally that as I reduced my amount of day to day commercial
1768
01:44:04,440 --> 01:44:12,360
route setting and involvement in traditional climbing gyms and upped my competition environment,
1769
01:44:12,360 --> 01:44:17,720
I won't even just say like comps, but like if I, if I teach 12 to 15 clinics a year about
1770
01:44:17,720 --> 01:44:20,060
competition route setting, I'm in a competition environment.
1771
01:44:20,060 --> 01:44:24,280
If I'm going on phone calls with people about like, how do we up our youth team engagement?
1772
01:44:24,280 --> 01:44:25,960
I'm in a competition environment.
1773
01:44:25,960 --> 01:44:29,800
If I go to a world cup, okay, I'm in a competition environment.
1774
01:44:29,800 --> 01:44:34,320
All of a sudden now my brain is like almost rewiring to only think about like comp style
1775
01:44:34,320 --> 01:44:39,760
and so my competition style due to all these reasons is just like elevating.
1776
01:44:39,760 --> 01:44:46,560
So in some, in some instances I can perform quite well on competition style boulders regardless
1777
01:44:46,560 --> 01:44:47,560
of the level.
1778
01:44:47,560 --> 01:44:51,640
And in other instances, like it's not even, it's not even funny.
1779
01:44:51,640 --> 01:44:55,560
Like I'll just get like, I can't touch them, you know?
1780
01:44:55,560 --> 01:45:02,480
And I think it's just a matter of like knowing where you best fit as a member of a team.
1781
01:45:02,480 --> 01:45:08,360
And sometimes, I mean, I think if nothing else, you just like keep pushing and keep
1782
01:45:08,360 --> 01:45:12,240
trying to get better, but it's really hard for me to tell you like where do I stand to
1783
01:45:12,240 --> 01:45:18,840
like a whatever, like a Zach Galla or I don't know, like Zach Galla is a way, way, way,
1784
01:45:18,840 --> 01:45:21,160
way, way, way infinitely better climber than I am.
1785
01:45:21,160 --> 01:45:22,160
You know what I mean?
1786
01:45:22,160 --> 01:45:26,860
Like there's no competition there, but that's not his job and that's not my job.
1787
01:45:26,860 --> 01:45:29,000
My job is not a professional athlete.
1788
01:45:29,000 --> 01:45:31,200
His job is not a professional route setter.
1789
01:45:31,200 --> 01:45:37,360
The demand of each is different and rigorous and trying and in its own ways.
1790
01:45:37,360 --> 01:45:38,960
And neither of them are right or wrong.
1791
01:45:38,960 --> 01:45:41,240
They're just different, you know?
1792
01:45:41,240 --> 01:45:46,780
And like if he wanted, I will say this, if he wanted to be a professional route setter,
1793
01:45:46,780 --> 01:45:49,000
you know, granted he gained, I don't, I don't know him.
1794
01:45:49,000 --> 01:45:50,000
Like I know him well enough.
1795
01:45:50,000 --> 01:45:56,240
I don't know all of his ins and outs, but like granted he achieves the soft skills necessary.
1796
01:45:56,240 --> 01:46:00,320
He has the hard skills and the technical ability and the climbing ability to achieve whatever
1797
01:46:00,320 --> 01:46:04,640
he would want in the competition route setting world.
1798
01:46:04,640 --> 01:46:07,880
I would not have the same opportunity.
1799
01:46:07,880 --> 01:46:11,400
Like I, there's no way I could, you could give me all the days and the weeks in the
1800
01:46:11,400 --> 01:46:15,800
world and he is just a much more gifted athlete than I am, than I'll ever be.
1801
01:46:15,800 --> 01:46:19,200
So you don't think you could like make a US national team?
1802
01:46:19,200 --> 01:46:21,000
No, I don't think so.
1803
01:46:21,000 --> 01:46:25,760
I, those athletes, I know maybe like, I mean, there's certain, there's certain styles maybe
1804
01:46:25,760 --> 01:46:30,280
that I would, that I have a preference or an affinity towards that I have found that
1805
01:46:30,280 --> 01:46:33,120
over the years that I'm more predisposed to.
1806
01:46:33,120 --> 01:46:39,000
And like, maybe I can do quicker than someone else or have like, I might be like, oh, that
1807
01:46:39,000 --> 01:46:41,480
didn't, you know, in my brain, I might think like, oh, that didn't feel so bad for me.
1808
01:46:41,480 --> 01:46:44,260
And then I watch other athletes perform or the route setters perform and they might be
1809
01:46:44,260 --> 01:46:46,040
struggling a little bit more.
1810
01:46:46,040 --> 01:46:47,860
And I'll be like, huh, interesting.
1811
01:46:47,860 --> 01:46:49,400
So yeah, there's situations like that.
1812
01:46:49,400 --> 01:46:54,720
But if it came like down to brass tacks, like no, like I don't think so at all.
1813
01:46:54,720 --> 01:46:55,720
I have competed though.
1814
01:46:55,720 --> 01:47:01,440
I mean, I've competed, I competed at Vail a couple of years ago.
1815
01:47:01,440 --> 01:47:02,440
Didn't do so great.
1816
01:47:02,440 --> 01:47:06,320
You know, like I just, I did it more for like learning, you know, like what is it like to
1817
01:47:06,320 --> 01:47:07,320
be on the other side of the curtain?
1818
01:47:07,320 --> 01:47:10,720
Because I think that helps, helped me be a little bit more well-rounded.
1819
01:47:10,720 --> 01:47:16,080
Yeah, a bit of a detour, but you're setting for Vail this year, right?
1820
01:47:16,080 --> 01:47:17,080
I am.
1821
01:47:17,080 --> 01:47:18,080
Yeah.
1822
01:47:18,080 --> 01:47:19,080
Yeah, I am super excited.
1823
01:47:19,080 --> 01:47:20,080
I'll be in June.
1824
01:47:20,080 --> 01:47:21,720
Probably try to get there a little bit early.
1825
01:47:21,720 --> 01:47:27,520
The altitude is wild or the altitude elevation is wild.
1826
01:47:27,520 --> 01:47:29,320
Oh crap.
1827
01:47:29,320 --> 01:47:30,320
Okay.
1828
01:47:30,320 --> 01:47:34,440
It can make performance difficult at that, at that level.
1829
01:47:34,440 --> 01:47:36,560
Oh no, that's not good.
1830
01:47:36,560 --> 01:47:37,560
But that's good to know.
1831
01:47:37,560 --> 01:47:38,560
Why is that?
1832
01:47:38,560 --> 01:47:39,560
Are you going to go compete?
1833
01:47:39,560 --> 01:47:49,000
I was convinced to sign up to compete by a previous podcast guest, Albert Oak.
1834
01:47:49,000 --> 01:47:55,040
And it's coming up and I'm not ready.
1835
01:47:55,040 --> 01:48:03,560
So just going to hope to, I don't think trying to not get last is a good goal because then
1836
01:48:03,560 --> 01:48:07,520
I'm like, my goal is dependent on how other people are doing.
1837
01:48:07,520 --> 01:48:13,520
So maybe I'll just like try to get a zone or something.
1838
01:48:13,520 --> 01:48:15,680
Yeah, that's an awesome way to look at it.
1839
01:48:15,680 --> 01:48:20,560
I think that's very astute, like don't compare your performance on others.
1840
01:48:20,560 --> 01:48:21,560
But like that's what I did.
1841
01:48:21,560 --> 01:48:25,080
I was like, I just want to get like a zone.
1842
01:48:25,080 --> 01:48:26,120
That was my goal.
1843
01:48:26,120 --> 01:48:27,960
And I got a couple zones, got a few zones.
1844
01:48:27,960 --> 01:48:33,880
I dropped a couple tops and I was like, damn, hell yeah, this is great.
1845
01:48:33,880 --> 01:48:38,400
And I had a fun time and just I went into it with like more fun, like let's just enjoy.
1846
01:48:38,400 --> 01:48:43,920
And if I think if I could unsolicitedly offer anything would just be like, if you go into
1847
01:48:43,920 --> 01:48:46,360
it like a fun aspect, don't be like, oh my God, it's coming.
1848
01:48:46,360 --> 01:48:48,200
I have to blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.
1849
01:48:48,200 --> 01:48:49,200
Like nobody cares.
1850
01:48:49,200 --> 01:48:54,460
There was like this article years ago that was like, nobody cares that you rock climb.
1851
01:48:54,460 --> 01:48:57,240
You only care that you rock climb, but you think the other people care that you rock
1852
01:48:57,240 --> 01:48:58,240
climb.
1853
01:48:58,240 --> 01:48:59,240
You know what I mean?
1854
01:48:59,240 --> 01:49:03,760
And it was meant to be like a conversation to yourself of like, it's only about you.
1855
01:49:03,760 --> 01:49:09,080
Like really your performance is about you and you should be like, be kind to yourself,
1856
01:49:09,080 --> 01:49:10,600
be kind to others kind of thing.
1857
01:49:10,600 --> 01:49:12,520
But like just worry about yourself.
1858
01:49:12,520 --> 01:49:16,080
And like if you're having fun, then that's all that matters.
1859
01:49:16,080 --> 01:49:18,240
But I will give you this bit of advice.
1860
01:49:18,240 --> 01:49:22,880
Get there early because that elevation is fucking bananas.
1861
01:49:22,880 --> 01:49:28,960
Like you will be sucking wind more than you care to know, literally.
1862
01:49:28,960 --> 01:49:35,920
So yeah, a couple days, flying a couple days early, go on a couple hikes, go up to even
1863
01:49:35,920 --> 01:49:41,200
higher, do that once or twice a day, eat a bunch of extra food, bunch of extra water,
1864
01:49:41,200 --> 01:49:42,880
drink too much alcohol.
1865
01:49:42,880 --> 01:49:44,360
That will help you a lot.
1866
01:49:44,360 --> 01:49:45,360
Oh gosh.
1867
01:49:45,360 --> 01:49:46,360
Okay.
1868
01:49:46,360 --> 01:49:47,360
I don't know why Vale was suggested.
1869
01:49:47,360 --> 01:49:48,800
I should have chosen a different one.
1870
01:49:48,800 --> 01:49:49,800
I like...
1871
01:49:49,800 --> 01:49:51,840
There's only, only Salt Lake is the other one.
1872
01:49:51,840 --> 01:49:52,840
Yeah.
1873
01:49:52,840 --> 01:49:55,120
I should have done this.
1874
01:49:55,120 --> 01:49:56,120
Vale's cool though.
1875
01:49:56,120 --> 01:49:58,040
Vale's like, you're going to get there.
1876
01:49:58,040 --> 01:50:00,040
Have you been there?
1877
01:50:00,040 --> 01:50:01,040
No.
1878
01:50:01,040 --> 01:50:05,000
You're going to get there and you're going to be like, okay, this is why I chose this
1879
01:50:05,000 --> 01:50:06,000
one.
1880
01:50:06,000 --> 01:50:11,000
Because the vent, like the environment, the venue, the spectacle, the like feel of it
1881
01:50:11,000 --> 01:50:18,920
is just like, it's very, it's pretty powerful.
1882
01:50:18,920 --> 01:50:24,520
Like this is, this is climbing to me when you just like see all these people come together,
1883
01:50:24,520 --> 01:50:26,500
there's mountains behind you.
1884
01:50:26,500 --> 01:50:30,120
There's people who don't know really about climbing at all, who are there like supporting
1885
01:50:30,120 --> 01:50:31,120
climbers.
1886
01:50:31,120 --> 01:50:36,160
The amount of spectators is for sure bigger than any other event that we have.
1887
01:50:36,160 --> 01:50:40,560
Like it, I don't mean that to scare you, but it's like, there's a lot of people there
1888
01:50:40,560 --> 01:50:44,120
who are like fucking psyched that there's climbing going on.
1889
01:50:44,120 --> 01:50:45,360
And to me that gets me psyched.
1890
01:50:45,360 --> 01:50:47,200
Well, that'll be cool to see.
1891
01:50:47,200 --> 01:50:48,200
I mean, yeah.
1892
01:50:48,200 --> 01:50:51,880
I'm mostly just signing up to get the experience, see what it's about.
1893
01:50:51,880 --> 01:50:55,560
I, yeah, I don't even know how it goes.
1894
01:50:55,560 --> 01:50:58,080
Like I don't think, I don't, do people watch qualifiers?
1895
01:50:58,080 --> 01:50:59,080
Yeah.
1896
01:50:59,080 --> 01:51:00,080
Oh yeah.
1897
01:51:00,080 --> 01:51:01,760
It's like a fair venue.
1898
01:51:01,760 --> 01:51:07,840
So like anyone who's in like that Vale village, they'll just like walk up, you know, and hang
1899
01:51:07,840 --> 01:51:08,840
out.
1900
01:51:08,840 --> 01:51:09,840
And it's also like a whole weekend.
1901
01:51:09,840 --> 01:51:11,520
So it, it's like the GoPro games.
1902
01:51:11,520 --> 01:51:15,500
So they have like a youth component and they have a citizens component.
1903
01:51:15,500 --> 01:51:22,240
It's like, there are a lot of people who just come to experience climbing in the mountains,
1904
01:51:22,240 --> 01:51:25,880
you know, and come hang out in Vale even.
1905
01:51:25,880 --> 01:51:26,880
Cause it's just like a cool place.
1906
01:51:26,880 --> 01:51:31,440
I mean, yeah, there'll be people there watching qualifiers and if nothing else too, there's
1907
01:51:31,440 --> 01:51:36,560
like depending on number of participants will have like multiple waves.
1908
01:51:36,560 --> 01:51:41,500
So like, let's say you're in wave two, like all the wave one folks are going to watch
1909
01:51:41,500 --> 01:51:43,280
wave two and see how they perform.
1910
01:51:43,280 --> 01:51:48,320
And you know what I mean?
1911
01:51:48,320 --> 01:51:49,720
No matter what that's going to happen though.
1912
01:51:49,720 --> 01:51:50,720
That's going to happen in Salt Lake.
1913
01:51:50,720 --> 01:51:52,360
That's going to happen in, you know, in Vale.
1914
01:51:52,360 --> 01:51:53,360
So that just happens.
1915
01:51:53,360 --> 01:51:57,000
I'm starting to regret this decision a bit.
1916
01:51:57,000 --> 01:51:59,880
You're going to do just fine.
1917
01:51:59,880 --> 01:52:00,880
Yeah.
1918
01:52:00,880 --> 01:52:01,880
We'll see how that goes.
1919
01:52:01,880 --> 01:52:02,880
Maybe I'll, I'll message you.
1920
01:52:02,880 --> 01:52:05,040
You can let me know what the boulders are.
1921
01:52:05,040 --> 01:52:06,040
I can prepare.
1922
01:52:06,040 --> 01:52:07,040
Yeah.
1923
01:52:07,040 --> 01:52:14,680
Uh, you know, this has been awesome, but I definitely respectfully won't do that, but
1924
01:52:14,680 --> 01:52:19,240
I'll tell you how much fun that you're going to have and that you should definitely come.
1925
01:52:19,240 --> 01:52:20,240
Yeah.
1926
01:52:20,240 --> 01:52:21,240
Okay.
1927
01:52:21,240 --> 01:52:22,240
Maybe see you there.
1928
01:52:22,240 --> 01:52:23,240
Okay.
1929
01:52:23,240 --> 01:52:24,240
Yeah.
1930
01:52:24,240 --> 01:52:29,400
But yeah, to distract myself from thinking about that anymore, let's get back into the
1931
01:52:29,400 --> 01:52:32,240
route setting.
1932
01:52:32,240 --> 01:52:39,200
How long are your days for route setting comparatively between sitting for IFSC versus maybe like
1933
01:52:39,200 --> 01:52:42,920
a national comp versus a local competition?
1934
01:52:42,920 --> 01:52:50,720
I'd say that like if it's a upper level, like national comp, you know, like let's say an
1935
01:52:50,720 --> 01:52:56,280
NACS or, um, I mean, honestly, any, honestly, any of the national comps, they're all, they
1936
01:52:56,280 --> 01:53:04,440
all have a different amount of, there's different things about them that make them have more
1937
01:53:04,440 --> 01:53:07,120
effort here versus more effort there.
1938
01:53:07,120 --> 01:53:13,560
And the example might be like, look at youth boulders, like the level of boulder problem
1939
01:53:13,560 --> 01:53:20,600
on any individual youth climb is like vastly lower than let's say your elite level nationals,
1940
01:53:20,600 --> 01:53:22,080
like your open nationals.
1941
01:53:22,080 --> 01:53:26,480
And then even more so comparatively to like, you know, a world cup, right?
1942
01:53:26,480 --> 01:53:30,640
But you have like a trillion boulders to set, you know?
1943
01:53:30,640 --> 01:53:34,480
So it's like this, there's just so many rounds of climbing.
1944
01:53:34,480 --> 01:53:37,960
So you know, but then you look at, you know, a world cup bouldering, you might say, okay,
1945
01:53:37,960 --> 01:53:42,480
I have very few boulders to set relatively speaking, but the level and attention to detail
1946
01:53:42,480 --> 01:53:43,640
and the viewership, right?
1947
01:53:43,640 --> 01:53:50,560
The optics that we talked about earlier, there's just so much going on that you have to see
1948
01:53:50,560 --> 01:53:54,400
to spend this time to make sure that it is as right or as close to right as you think
1949
01:53:54,400 --> 01:53:57,480
as possible.
1950
01:53:57,480 --> 01:54:04,880
So nationals and like a world cup, you know, they're pretty similar in terms of time investment,
1951
01:54:04,880 --> 01:54:05,880
I'd say.
1952
01:54:05,880 --> 01:54:09,840
The days look differently, what you're doing with your body and your time on those days
1953
01:54:09,840 --> 01:54:13,640
might be a little bit different.
1954
01:54:13,640 --> 01:54:19,040
Definitely you have to have, and depending on the level of competition, like let's say
1955
01:54:19,040 --> 01:54:23,360
I said, okay, we'll have Vail Citizens, right?
1956
01:54:23,360 --> 01:54:29,480
Which is like a red point round in Vail versus an NACS versus a Youth Boulders Nationals
1957
01:54:29,480 --> 01:54:31,600
versus an Adult Boulders Nationals and a World Cup.
1958
01:54:31,600 --> 01:54:38,000
You have this kind of like gradient almost of maybe they all roughly have a similar time
1959
01:54:38,000 --> 01:54:41,140
or something like that, like of investment that you have to set.
1960
01:54:41,140 --> 01:54:48,940
But what is asked of you as a rootsetter in terms of creativity and then as well as like
1961
01:54:48,940 --> 01:54:54,880
physical demand in terms of performance on boulder problems to be like the most valuable
1962
01:54:54,880 --> 01:54:58,600
member possible on the team increases.
1963
01:54:58,600 --> 01:54:59,600
You know what I mean?
1964
01:54:59,600 --> 01:55:04,200
So you just have to have the experience to back that a lot of times.
1965
01:55:04,200 --> 01:55:08,120
It doesn't mean that you have to, oh, everyone on the team has to climb AB if you're putting
1966
01:55:08,120 --> 01:55:09,120
a World Cup.
1967
01:55:09,120 --> 01:55:10,120
That's not the case.
1968
01:55:10,120 --> 01:55:13,640
But you have to, if you're not that person, you have to have then other skill sets to
1969
01:55:13,640 --> 01:55:18,560
help offset maybe that differential in some way, or at least add to it, maybe not offset,
1970
01:55:18,560 --> 01:55:21,320
but like add to it.
1971
01:55:21,320 --> 01:55:25,720
That's definitely not to say that the strongest rootsetters in terms of physical capability
1972
01:55:25,720 --> 01:55:27,640
are the best rootsetters.
1973
01:55:27,640 --> 01:55:31,280
There's many, many instances where that's actually not the case and that sometimes that
1974
01:55:31,280 --> 01:55:32,760
can be a hindrance.
1975
01:55:32,760 --> 01:55:36,160
So a lot of them people think like, oh, it's just these boulder bros who just like grunt
1976
01:55:36,160 --> 01:55:37,640
and take their shirts off and bro down.
1977
01:55:37,640 --> 01:55:42,240
Like no, maybe in the past, I don't know, maybe in the past that was a thing.
1978
01:55:42,240 --> 01:55:47,760
I personally do not enjoy that on my teams, whether I'm the chief or I'm an assistant
1979
01:55:47,760 --> 01:55:51,440
or whatever.
1980
01:55:51,440 --> 01:55:56,920
Definitely something that is more like low key and communal and like together goes quite
1981
01:55:56,920 --> 01:55:57,920
a long way for me.
1982
01:55:57,920 --> 01:56:02,280
But we do have a job to do and you do have to be able to, sometimes, sometimes you just
1983
01:56:02,280 --> 01:56:03,980
someone has to do the move.
1984
01:56:03,980 --> 01:56:08,160
Sometimes someone has to do the sequence and, you know, support that person in that moment
1985
01:56:08,160 --> 01:56:10,520
or support that team in that moment.
1986
01:56:10,520 --> 01:56:11,520
That's what's critical.
1987
01:56:11,520 --> 01:56:12,520
And it's nice.
1988
01:56:12,520 --> 01:56:17,380
It feels really, really, really, really nice if you can be that person sometimes, you know,
1989
01:56:17,380 --> 01:56:20,040
if you're like, oh, the team needs me right now.
1990
01:56:20,040 --> 01:56:25,280
Like, all right, like I can do this, you know, and that's those are my favorite, like personally
1991
01:56:25,280 --> 01:56:26,560
my favorite, favorite moments.
1992
01:56:26,560 --> 01:56:28,560
Like if there's, you know, it's 3 a.m.
1993
01:56:28,560 --> 01:56:33,800
This thing isn't going, you feel like you're spinning wheels and you're like, okay, the
1994
01:56:33,800 --> 01:56:34,800
team needs something right now.
1995
01:56:34,800 --> 01:56:40,560
We're gonna put on some good music, you know, like drink a coffee and we're gonna like start
1996
01:56:40,560 --> 01:56:42,040
firing things here.
1997
01:56:42,040 --> 01:56:44,960
And that's I love that.
1998
01:56:44,960 --> 01:56:45,960
That's great.
1999
01:56:45,960 --> 01:56:48,320
And that balance is key.
2000
01:56:48,320 --> 01:56:51,920
What makes a route setting team work for you?
2001
01:56:51,920 --> 01:56:56,560
So we talk about this a lot in different like workshop and clinics that I do.
2002
01:56:56,560 --> 01:57:03,440
It's like what makes a great route setter or better even to go further, like what makes
2003
01:57:03,440 --> 01:57:07,880
a great route setter that you know, like someone that you know, what makes them, what sets
2004
01:57:07,880 --> 01:57:08,880
them apart.
2005
01:57:08,880 --> 01:57:13,880
So maybe this is a similar question.
2006
01:57:13,880 --> 01:57:19,280
So from like an individual level, someone who's a good communicator, someone who's able
2007
01:57:19,280 --> 01:57:25,120
to like both give and receive feedback well and in different ways at different times,
2008
01:57:25,120 --> 01:57:29,880
someone who's able to manage stress well, someone who's able to manage themselves and
2009
01:57:29,880 --> 01:57:31,920
their own personal life well.
2010
01:57:31,920 --> 01:57:37,120
I know that sounds silly, but like, are you someone that like needs to like have their
2011
01:57:37,120 --> 01:57:42,360
handheld to like go get food, go get coffee, go get water, go like whatever, or are you
2012
01:57:42,360 --> 01:57:46,920
someone who's like a self-starter and can like knows when they need to turn it on and
2013
01:57:46,920 --> 01:57:51,000
turn it back and like manage their own performance throughout the week?
2014
01:57:51,000 --> 01:57:54,040
Do you have a good attitude?
2015
01:57:54,040 --> 01:57:56,400
Are you fun to be around?
2016
01:57:56,400 --> 01:58:00,800
Do I want to spend the next nine days with you?
2017
01:58:00,800 --> 01:58:03,040
You know, because I make this joke sometimes.
2018
01:58:03,040 --> 01:58:07,960
It's like a lot of times, you know, we'll be in hotel rooms together or like, you know,
2019
01:58:07,960 --> 01:58:10,240
rooms that have bunk beds or something like that.
2020
01:58:10,240 --> 01:58:17,880
And it's like, if you and I are on a team, do I want to be with dealing with Ginny every
2021
01:58:17,880 --> 01:58:18,880
day?
2022
01:58:18,880 --> 01:58:21,440
And I mean that in every sense of the word, like respectfully, like I wake up and I open
2023
01:58:21,440 --> 01:58:23,880
my eyes and there she is across the room staring at me.
2024
01:58:23,880 --> 01:58:27,960
And then I go downstairs and she's brushing her teeth and then like she's making coffee
2025
01:58:27,960 --> 01:58:31,600
and then we go to the wall and then we're conversing during the day and then we eat
2026
01:58:31,600 --> 01:58:34,520
lunch and it just goes and then you and then you go to bed.
2027
01:58:34,520 --> 01:58:35,520
Good night.
2028
01:58:35,520 --> 01:58:36,520
And you close your eyes.
2029
01:58:36,520 --> 01:58:37,520
Right.
2030
01:58:37,520 --> 01:58:41,720
And then I see last thing I see, like you want this person to be somebody that you like
2031
01:58:41,720 --> 01:58:47,040
care to be around, you know, and if things get tough, what is their response to things
2032
01:58:47,040 --> 01:58:48,640
that are tough?
2033
01:58:48,640 --> 01:58:49,800
How do they deal with that?
2034
01:58:49,800 --> 01:58:53,720
And that can be a quite an important thing as a team member as well.
2035
01:58:53,720 --> 01:59:01,800
Like what's your penchant for dealing with adversity in difficult times?
2036
01:59:01,800 --> 01:59:06,280
So those are just, I mean, then there's all the hard skills, you know, climbing ability
2037
01:59:06,280 --> 01:59:11,680
level, mastery of movement, you know, are they able to use their resources creatively?
2038
01:59:11,680 --> 01:59:12,680
Do they know the field?
2039
01:59:12,680 --> 01:59:17,280
Do they know how to calibrate if this, then this, right?
2040
01:59:17,280 --> 01:59:20,400
What do those skill sets look like on the fly or do they need to be told?
2041
01:59:20,400 --> 01:59:21,400
You know what I mean?
2042
01:59:21,400 --> 01:59:24,480
Like there's quite a lot of things, but those are some of them.
2043
01:59:24,480 --> 01:59:25,480
Oh yeah.
2044
01:59:25,480 --> 01:59:26,480
It's like a whole relationship.
2045
01:59:26,480 --> 01:59:27,480
Yeah, no, literally.
2046
01:59:27,480 --> 01:59:28,480
Yeah.
2047
01:59:28,480 --> 01:59:34,000
It's like such a relationship with eight other people, you know, or seven other people, you
2048
01:59:34,000 --> 01:59:35,000
know?
2049
01:59:35,000 --> 01:59:36,000
Yeah.
2050
01:59:36,000 --> 01:59:37,400
And I think a diverse team too.
2051
01:59:37,400 --> 01:59:44,040
Like I definitely do not love when it doesn't happen so often anymore, but like when all
2052
01:59:44,040 --> 01:59:48,400
the climbers look the same, feel the same, climb the same.
2053
01:59:48,400 --> 01:59:50,400
That's not great.
2054
01:59:50,400 --> 01:59:58,240
Jack of all trades, master a none is I think increasingly a thing of the past for a high
2055
01:59:58,240 --> 02:00:00,520
performance route setting.
2056
02:00:00,520 --> 02:00:08,040
I think naturally you have to have an exceptional level of all these things that I mentioned,
2057
02:00:08,040 --> 02:00:10,200
including climbing styles and whatever.
2058
02:00:10,200 --> 02:00:15,160
But if you have a few things that you're like exceptional at that really set you apart,
2059
02:00:15,160 --> 02:00:20,040
that are like the ace up your sleeve, that's fucking awesome.
2060
02:00:20,040 --> 02:00:25,440
Because like if I'm like, oh yeah, Ginny, like I really need this like men's quarter
2061
02:00:25,440 --> 02:00:30,720
boulder to be like really hard, like really only want like to see three zones and like
2062
02:00:30,720 --> 02:00:32,320
one to two tops.
2063
02:00:32,320 --> 02:00:33,920
And you're like, got it.
2064
02:00:33,920 --> 02:00:35,320
I know exactly what you're looking for.
2065
02:00:35,320 --> 02:00:36,320
I've done this a million times.
2066
02:00:36,320 --> 02:00:41,080
And that's not to say that you're like the end all be all, but like your knowledge of
2067
02:00:41,080 --> 02:00:46,320
what that level looks like and how that's going to present itself on the wall.
2068
02:00:46,320 --> 02:00:50,520
And ultimately, yeah, okay, there's different ways we can do it, but you have a good feeling
2069
02:00:50,520 --> 02:00:55,120
and then you can get that feeling really close so that with the team or the small group can
2070
02:00:55,120 --> 02:01:02,320
come together and the team can come together and make adjustments or adaptions as needed
2071
02:01:02,320 --> 02:01:03,320
and have the conversation.
2072
02:01:03,320 --> 02:01:07,640
And ultimately, you know, we make the calls as the team, but you can get us there a lot
2073
02:01:07,640 --> 02:01:13,840
closer as opposed to like if you were or I was like, I don't know, I'm not really good
2074
02:01:13,840 --> 02:01:17,400
at Cordo or I'm not really great at that style or I'm not, you know, like I don't really
2075
02:01:17,400 --> 02:01:18,520
know what that looks like.
2076
02:01:18,520 --> 02:01:24,000
Then your first draft or second draft might actually be quite far off, right?
2077
02:01:24,000 --> 02:01:26,360
And then there's more effort that needs to be put in.
2078
02:01:26,360 --> 02:01:30,360
So you just multiply that out over the work week.
2079
02:01:30,360 --> 02:01:34,360
And before you know it, you're like, ah, it's pretty sweet to have different people who
2080
02:01:34,360 --> 02:01:38,560
are good at different things and different sizes and different, you know, knowledge bases
2081
02:01:38,560 --> 02:01:39,920
all coming together.
2082
02:01:39,920 --> 02:01:40,920
What's your expertise?
2083
02:01:40,920 --> 02:01:41,920
My expertise?
2084
02:01:41,920 --> 02:01:42,920
I don't know.
2085
02:01:42,920 --> 02:01:44,520
I like to be fun to be around.
2086
02:01:44,520 --> 02:01:50,960
I like to like make people be happy and have a good comp week and motivate people.
2087
02:01:50,960 --> 02:01:54,400
And those things are quite important to me.
2088
02:01:54,400 --> 02:02:03,120
I'd say if it was like a climbing style, I try really hard to work on my weaknesses.
2089
02:02:03,120 --> 02:02:08,240
My weaknesses are like I'm really not great at like small holds overhanging.
2090
02:02:08,240 --> 02:02:18,100
For example, I'm a bigger guy, probably the heaviest international like person who sets
2091
02:02:18,100 --> 02:02:25,360
internationally for competitions by quite a bit, like 200 pounds if I'm feeling fit as
2092
02:02:25,360 --> 02:02:26,840
a fiddle.
2093
02:02:26,840 --> 02:02:33,920
Usually sit around like 215, 220, 225, sometimes more.
2094
02:02:33,920 --> 02:02:36,920
But then with that, right, that's not just all negative.
2095
02:02:36,920 --> 02:02:41,600
You know, I typically retain muscle a little bit differently than your average climber.
2096
02:02:41,600 --> 02:02:48,440
So things that are more pushing oriented, those like jump press moves, you know, even
2097
02:02:48,440 --> 02:02:49,680
on more difficult versions.
2098
02:02:49,680 --> 02:02:57,640
I actually for me personally, they feel like once they're finalized, I'm like, oh, okay,
2099
02:02:57,640 --> 02:02:59,520
that doesn't feel so bad.
2100
02:02:59,520 --> 02:03:02,200
Like you're talking like upper body triceps and biceps.
2101
02:03:02,200 --> 02:03:03,880
And I'm like, oh, I have that.
2102
02:03:03,880 --> 02:03:05,440
Like that's cool, you know, maybe.
2103
02:03:05,440 --> 02:03:10,520
But if I'm grabbing small edges in a roof and doing all kinds of crazy moves, like that's
2104
02:03:10,520 --> 02:03:13,480
much harder for me.
2105
02:03:13,480 --> 02:03:18,040
Lower body cordial, upper body, lower body and like, you know, I was kind of discussing
2106
02:03:18,040 --> 02:03:23,680
earlier like those I found higher success with and then even like certain types of slab
2107
02:03:23,680 --> 02:03:28,840
as well, maybe not the most technical and precise on like very small edges.
2108
02:03:28,840 --> 02:03:30,240
Again, I have like a bigger chest.
2109
02:03:30,240 --> 02:03:35,880
So a lot of times it like pushes me back a little bit and the center of gravity isn't
2110
02:03:35,880 --> 02:03:42,040
as ideal for my pinnacle of performance as I would love it.
2111
02:03:42,040 --> 02:03:46,520
But if it's like I have really weirdly like flexible ankles, probably from like playing
2112
02:03:46,520 --> 02:03:54,400
hockey and that lower body lower leg power is pretty good.
2113
02:03:54,400 --> 02:04:00,520
So I think like in those types of situations where I can accentuate that and then maybe
2114
02:04:00,520 --> 02:04:05,800
like strong lower back and stuff again, like for pushing and pressing and compressing too.
2115
02:04:05,800 --> 02:04:07,280
I mean, that's fine.
2116
02:04:07,280 --> 02:04:12,920
But if I were to pick a few things that maybe those would be more standouty.
2117
02:04:12,920 --> 02:04:18,400
So that's kind of what you bring to your setting as well.
2118
02:04:18,400 --> 02:04:19,400
It depends.
2119
02:04:19,400 --> 02:04:26,360
Like if it's like a local comp or a regional or divisional, something like that, like then
2120
02:04:26,360 --> 02:04:31,400
relatively speaking, everything for me, I feel comfortable.
2121
02:04:31,400 --> 02:04:34,640
I feel comfortable at providing any, any whatever the team needs.
2122
02:04:34,640 --> 02:04:37,360
I'm comfortable providing that in any situation.
2123
02:04:37,360 --> 02:04:43,520
I feel like I have the experience now and the knowledge to like draw from actual moments
2124
02:04:43,520 --> 02:04:48,800
in time and be like, and apply them to the setting.
2125
02:04:48,800 --> 02:04:53,520
So for, yeah, especially for the lower level, lower level events, like, yeah, okay, whatever,
2126
02:04:53,520 --> 02:04:54,520
whatever you need.
2127
02:04:54,520 --> 02:04:58,360
But then if it's like, if someone's like, all right, Cody, we need you to set like the
2128
02:04:58,360 --> 02:05:03,880
hardest thing and we really need it to be like unique and special and funky or whatever,
2129
02:05:03,880 --> 02:05:08,000
what do you got for me that you only, and you only got an hour, you know, like you,
2130
02:05:08,000 --> 02:05:10,560
there's like some time constraint or something like that.
2131
02:05:10,560 --> 02:05:15,520
I'm going to, anybody I think would naturally default to the thing that you feel the most
2132
02:05:15,520 --> 02:05:18,040
comfortable with because you're like, okay, there's constraints here.
2133
02:05:18,040 --> 02:05:19,040
There's eyes on me.
2134
02:05:19,040 --> 02:05:21,840
I have to achieve this goal.
2135
02:05:21,840 --> 02:05:28,160
I'm probably going to default to one of those things that I previously mentioned unless
2136
02:05:28,160 --> 02:05:31,440
explicitly as otherwise, in which case, hey, all right, like I'm up for a challenge.
2137
02:05:31,440 --> 02:05:32,800
Let's go.
2138
02:05:32,800 --> 02:05:36,560
And then one last question about routes setting in general.
2139
02:05:36,560 --> 02:05:38,520
I think I feel this way.
2140
02:05:38,520 --> 02:05:45,360
I think a few other people have felt this as well.
2141
02:05:45,360 --> 02:05:52,840
I feel like when I watch USA, like national comps, the setting feels and looks pretty
2142
02:05:52,840 --> 02:05:58,040
different from what I see on like an international circuit.
2143
02:05:58,040 --> 02:06:01,420
And I just, I don't really know why.
2144
02:06:01,420 --> 02:06:07,240
Is this something that you feel like is the case or are we just like, are we just seeing
2145
02:06:07,240 --> 02:06:08,240
things?
2146
02:06:08,240 --> 02:06:09,560
I don't think that you're just seeing things.
2147
02:06:09,560 --> 02:06:13,720
Cause if you're feel like your feelings are valid, right?
2148
02:06:13,720 --> 02:06:15,840
You're picking up on something.
2149
02:06:15,840 --> 02:06:21,680
What that is to you, I don't, I don't know, but I would, I mean, maybe I'd ask some questions
2150
02:06:21,680 --> 02:06:29,720
as to like, do you think that it's, it's probably pattern driven, but what type of pattern?
2151
02:06:29,720 --> 02:06:30,720
I don't know.
2152
02:06:30,720 --> 02:06:34,360
Are there movement patterns that maybe you feel that are different?
2153
02:06:34,360 --> 02:06:38,400
Is it like hold shapes as patterns?
2154
02:06:38,400 --> 02:06:41,560
Is it like the placement of holds or volumes?
2155
02:06:41,560 --> 02:06:44,580
It could be stylistically.
2156
02:06:44,580 --> 02:06:47,520
Are we representing different things?
2157
02:06:47,520 --> 02:06:54,720
And I'd say any number of these could be the case.
2158
02:06:54,720 --> 02:07:01,920
If nothing else, I would say that if you've, depending on how long anyone has been following
2159
02:07:01,920 --> 02:07:05,840
competition climbing for, this will help inform this like next part, but like, let's say you've
2160
02:07:05,840 --> 02:07:15,960
only been really following competition climbing since like 2019 or 2020 in the U S then unfortunately
2161
02:07:15,960 --> 02:07:23,800
you've only got to really see our high level events in climbing gyms.
2162
02:07:23,800 --> 02:07:30,120
Prior to that, you were seeing our events being held at very large scale convention
2163
02:07:30,120 --> 02:07:31,120
centers.
2164
02:07:31,120 --> 02:07:36,040
So like for both youth and adult nationals.
2165
02:07:36,040 --> 02:07:41,280
So that alone with like having like this big wall that is shipped in with holds that are
2166
02:07:41,280 --> 02:07:45,720
shipped in with like even the camera angle, like you're not like when you see a camera
2167
02:07:45,720 --> 02:07:50,120
angle, it's like the wall and then the backlighting and the judges and the audience, right?
2168
02:07:50,120 --> 02:07:55,760
Like if you look back at, I don't know, Madison, Wisconsin, 2016 adult bouldering nationals,
2169
02:07:55,760 --> 02:07:59,240
you know, okay, you'll see like dated holds maybe, and maybe the movement styles are a
2170
02:07:59,240 --> 02:08:05,680
little bit more like OG, but the feel you'll be like, oh, this is like a presentation.
2171
02:08:05,680 --> 02:08:09,400
Like they're, they've created an environment here.
2172
02:08:09,400 --> 02:08:14,400
Whereas for like a trillion reasons that take a whole other three hour conversation to get
2173
02:08:14,400 --> 02:08:19,240
through, you said climbing has shifted things quite a bit.
2174
02:08:19,240 --> 02:08:24,040
And now you see our nationals, like I think last, you know, the last couple of years,
2175
02:08:24,040 --> 02:08:28,040
they're being held at, at a commercial climbing gyms.
2176
02:08:28,040 --> 02:08:36,320
And so I think that does, if, if all other things are held equal, that feel is a little
2177
02:08:36,320 --> 02:08:41,960
bit lost, you know, that like presentation is a little bit lost because, you know, you're
2178
02:08:41,960 --> 02:08:47,620
seeing like these like super high end climbs being put on commercial climbing walls.
2179
02:08:47,620 --> 02:08:51,580
And I don't know what it is, but like maybe, maybe if you look back or like anyone who's
2180
02:08:51,580 --> 02:08:55,280
listening like looks back, you might be able to identify what that looks like for yourself.
2181
02:08:55,280 --> 02:08:59,920
Because I know, I know I see it and I feel it, but maybe that's just like me as like
2182
02:08:59,920 --> 02:09:04,760
a roots header who's been kind of on both sides of the coin there.
2183
02:09:04,760 --> 02:09:09,400
And I, with the IFSC, you see like a very, like if it's a world cup, you see a very,
2184
02:09:09,400 --> 02:09:18,960
very pointed and concerted effort by the event organizers and the IFSC to create this like
2185
02:09:18,960 --> 02:09:25,800
exceptionally high quality competition environment.
2186
02:09:25,800 --> 02:09:30,960
So if nothing else, I think you notice that, that'd be my guess, but you're probably
2187
02:09:30,960 --> 02:09:32,720
noticing other things as well.
2188
02:09:32,720 --> 02:09:34,680
Hold sponsors are different, right?
2189
02:09:34,680 --> 02:09:39,200
Volume sponsors are sitting in different flavor of climbing is maybe, maybe favored
2190
02:09:39,200 --> 02:09:40,720
here or there a little bit more.
2191
02:09:40,720 --> 02:09:46,440
So, so you don't like explicitly go into a comp thinking that you'll set maybe like
2192
02:09:46,440 --> 02:09:52,800
something more powerful for a national competition versus like something more flashy for a world
2193
02:09:52,800 --> 02:09:53,800
cup.
2194
02:09:53,800 --> 02:09:55,400
No, but I think, I think that's a good point.
2195
02:09:55,400 --> 02:10:01,600
I think it that happens naturally, because like there's certain styles of moves and
2196
02:10:01,600 --> 02:10:08,320
certain certain aspects of climbing that like, whether we like it or not, they're just gonna
2197
02:10:08,320 --> 02:10:13,920
it's, it's gonna be really hard to represent at a lower level.
2198
02:10:13,920 --> 02:10:17,840
I'll give you an example.
2199
02:10:17,840 --> 02:10:24,320
I've referenced this comp earlier, like Marengin, I think it was 2021 or 2022.
2200
02:10:24,320 --> 02:10:30,280
There was, it was like one of the first years where they released these, like the cheetah
2201
02:10:30,280 --> 02:10:31,280
ball volumes.
2202
02:10:31,280 --> 02:10:33,240
They're like these orange slices, basically.
2203
02:10:33,240 --> 02:10:38,320
And they're like, as you build them out, or as you like stack them, they build out the
2204
02:10:38,320 --> 02:10:39,320
wall.
2205
02:10:39,320 --> 02:10:44,000
Anyways, they, they kind of unveiled them there, if my memory serves, and they set this
2206
02:10:44,000 --> 02:10:50,680
like, I don't know, penta paddle across the wall with like black volumes and blue holds
2207
02:10:50,680 --> 02:10:54,240
and all these athletes are maybe it was even like six paddles.
2208
02:10:54,240 --> 02:10:55,240
I don't know.
2209
02:10:55,240 --> 02:10:59,240
I just remember seeing just like flying with these athletes.
2210
02:10:59,240 --> 02:11:04,440
It just, it just looked like, like a, like a gif that was just like perfectly edited,
2211
02:11:04,440 --> 02:11:08,720
you know, or they just like constantly hand moves like going like this and seemingly like
2212
02:11:08,720 --> 02:11:09,720
never stopped.
2213
02:11:09,720 --> 02:11:14,740
Like, I don't, I just don't know if there's a world where you can represent that really
2214
02:11:14,740 --> 02:11:23,200
well in a youth nationals or an ACS and still meet the needs of the event.
2215
02:11:23,200 --> 02:11:26,080
You know, maybe there's an athlete who could do that.
2216
02:11:26,080 --> 02:11:27,080
Cool.
2217
02:11:27,080 --> 02:11:30,640
But that athlete's going to perform on every other style as well.
2218
02:11:30,640 --> 02:11:34,760
If they're that far above and beyond, they're going to perform well at other things as well.
2219
02:11:34,760 --> 02:11:39,480
So maybe then as Root Setters, we could do a better job at like allowing the rest of
2220
02:11:39,480 --> 02:11:44,400
the field to perform, to compete, to show their skills and not just smash them and then
2221
02:11:44,400 --> 02:11:51,400
make this the, you know, little Timmy show or whatever it is, you know, like, so I think
2222
02:11:51,400 --> 02:11:56,240
at the highest level, you can really, really push those things because those athletes are
2223
02:11:56,240 --> 02:11:57,720
the highest level athlete.
2224
02:11:57,720 --> 02:11:58,720
Okay.
2225
02:11:58,720 --> 02:11:59,720
That makes sense.
2226
02:11:59,720 --> 02:12:00,720
Good explanation.
2227
02:12:00,720 --> 02:12:01,720
Okay.
2228
02:12:01,720 --> 02:12:07,960
Let's move on to your personal gym pursuit that's coming up.
2229
02:12:07,960 --> 02:12:10,640
You are starting up your own gym.
2230
02:12:10,640 --> 02:12:12,320
Where are you in the process of that?
2231
02:12:12,320 --> 02:12:13,640
And also how long has it been?
2232
02:12:13,640 --> 02:12:17,880
Because I, you made it sound earlier, like it's, it's been a really long time.
2233
02:12:17,880 --> 02:12:20,800
In my mind, it's been a really long time.
2234
02:12:20,800 --> 02:12:24,800
Basically when I, when I'm up here, like where we're at, it's a, it's like, I don't know,
2235
02:12:24,800 --> 02:12:27,760
it's like an hour south of Boston and an hour east of Providence.
2236
02:12:27,760 --> 02:12:31,600
That's kind of how I'm describing it to folks who aren't from around here.
2237
02:12:31,600 --> 02:12:38,400
It's like southeastern Massachusetts, not quite Cape Cod, but it's like a climbing dead zone.
2238
02:12:38,400 --> 02:12:41,560
There's just like not climbing around here, both outdoor.
2239
02:12:41,560 --> 02:12:47,240
There's some outdoor if you, if you drive a bit indoor, it's, there's nothing, there's
2240
02:12:47,240 --> 02:12:48,880
nothing down the Cape.
2241
02:12:48,880 --> 02:12:53,040
As you approach Boston, there's increasingly some climbing and as you approach Providence,
2242
02:12:53,040 --> 02:13:00,000
there's increasingly some, but you know, if I'm being as objective as I can, not as a
2243
02:13:00,000 --> 02:13:11,840
gym owner or soon to be gym owner, the quality of the gym experience is lacking tremendously,
2244
02:13:11,840 --> 02:13:15,840
even at the gyms that exist that are up to, you know, an hour plus away.
2245
02:13:15,840 --> 02:13:19,720
So I would, you know, drive to these places and I'm like, God damn it.
2246
02:13:19,720 --> 02:13:26,000
I'm like spending all day getting stuck in traffic, fighting, spending, you know, $30
2247
02:13:26,000 --> 02:13:29,480
on a day pass and like climbing on these, these environments.
2248
02:13:29,480 --> 02:13:33,400
And I'm just like not inspired by at all.
2249
02:13:33,400 --> 02:13:40,160
And but why is it that I go to, I go to Southern California, I go to Miami, I go to, I go to
2250
02:13:40,160 --> 02:13:42,280
Houston, you know, wherever I go to anywhere.
2251
02:13:42,280 --> 02:13:46,320
And like they, they're pushing and there's a lot of reasons for that, I think.
2252
02:13:46,320 --> 02:13:51,600
But I was like, all right, I'm tired of, I'm tired of coming home and not climbing, you
2253
02:13:51,600 --> 02:13:54,200
know, because I just, I got to a point where I just refused.
2254
02:13:54,200 --> 02:13:55,200
I was just like, you know, I'm done.
2255
02:13:55,200 --> 02:14:01,880
I'm not driving an hour, an hour and a half each way to, to do this.
2256
02:14:01,880 --> 02:14:05,920
So yeah, we opened, we, I created this like concept and then I, you know, was talking
2257
02:14:05,920 --> 02:14:10,120
to my wife about it and I was talking to my partners, now partners about it.
2258
02:14:10,120 --> 02:14:13,920
And so, you know, we've, we were kind of flirting with the idea for a while, like, ah, this
2259
02:14:13,920 --> 02:14:14,920
could be cool.
2260
02:14:14,920 --> 02:14:18,800
Maybe we'll do a co-op, maybe we'll do even just like something small.
2261
02:14:18,800 --> 02:14:23,240
And then, you know, all things kind of came together and we were like, okay, let's like
2262
02:14:23,240 --> 02:14:25,880
make an actual bouldering gym.
2263
02:14:25,880 --> 02:14:31,280
And so, and depending on what your timeline you're actually looking at, I mean, we didn't
2264
02:14:31,280 --> 02:14:36,000
sign the lease on our space until November of last year.
2265
02:14:36,000 --> 02:14:39,920
So it's only been a couple months and we've been building out since.
2266
02:14:39,920 --> 02:14:44,560
We finalized the design process.
2267
02:14:44,560 --> 02:14:53,560
So all the angles are fixed and the walls are looking sharp and even the interior, like
2268
02:14:53,560 --> 02:14:58,480
just moving right along, painting and repairs and all that kind of stuff because it's in
2269
02:14:58,480 --> 02:14:59,480
an old bank.
2270
02:14:59,480 --> 02:15:00,920
It's in a bank from the 1800s.
2271
02:15:00,920 --> 02:15:01,920
Whoa.
2272
02:15:01,920 --> 02:15:04,240
Yeah, yeah, it's pretty, pretty wild.
2273
02:15:04,240 --> 02:15:05,880
It's a really unique looking space.
2274
02:15:05,880 --> 02:15:08,840
Like if you look at it from the outside, you're like, there's no way it's climbing.
2275
02:15:08,840 --> 02:15:12,520
It's like a huge cut quarried granite that was shipped in.
2276
02:15:12,520 --> 02:15:18,960
And like the interior is all like this yellow cream marble that was shipped in from Italy
2277
02:15:18,960 --> 02:15:19,960
in the 1800s.
2278
02:15:19,960 --> 02:15:24,480
It's like brass fixtures and like mahogany.
2279
02:15:24,480 --> 02:15:27,960
Yeah, in the climbing gym.
2280
02:15:27,960 --> 02:15:29,840
There's like fireplaces in every room.
2281
02:15:29,840 --> 02:15:30,840
Super cool.
2282
02:15:30,840 --> 02:15:31,840
What?
2283
02:15:31,840 --> 02:15:32,840
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
2284
02:15:32,840 --> 02:15:34,080
Yeah, it's wild.
2285
02:15:34,080 --> 02:15:36,400
So we're cruising.
2286
02:15:36,400 --> 02:15:38,720
We're chugging right along.
2287
02:15:38,720 --> 02:15:41,240
We're hoping to be open by May, June.
2288
02:15:41,240 --> 02:15:43,520
Maybe that's a bit...
2289
02:15:43,520 --> 02:15:51,240
Yeah, maybe it's a bit ambitious, but it really just depends on the city signing off on our
2290
02:15:51,240 --> 02:15:52,240
plans basically.
2291
02:15:52,240 --> 02:15:56,600
And the city in particular, this one is a little, can be difficult sometimes for weird
2292
02:15:56,600 --> 02:15:57,600
reasons.
2293
02:15:57,600 --> 02:16:03,200
And then engineering, because it is such an old space, just making sure that the floors
2294
02:16:03,200 --> 02:16:08,040
are going to support the uplift loads for the angles and stuff.
2295
02:16:08,040 --> 02:16:13,280
But we have strategies if certain things don't go the way we want, it just, they could take
2296
02:16:13,280 --> 02:16:15,400
longer is all.
2297
02:16:15,400 --> 02:16:19,440
So if nothing else, I mean, yeah, summertime, be open.
2298
02:16:19,440 --> 02:16:25,840
Be like a little over 3,000 square feet of space, 3,200.
2299
02:16:25,840 --> 02:16:33,120
I designed the walls and picked out the holds myself and kind of have a combo basically
2300
02:16:33,120 --> 02:16:38,640
of kind of like your old school New England climbing, because there's a huge amount of
2301
02:16:38,640 --> 02:16:45,600
people who are very attached to that, but also provide opportunities for this newer
2302
02:16:45,600 --> 02:16:51,960
age of climbing and route setting experience for folks and offering that in our commercial
2303
02:16:51,960 --> 02:16:58,760
day-to-day setting, but also bringing in athletes and teams from around.
2304
02:16:58,760 --> 02:17:04,600
So like I was talking with Natalia the other day, and we're going to be working together
2305
02:17:04,600 --> 02:17:09,840
for a couple of things and kind of in her preparation to Paris.
2306
02:17:09,840 --> 02:17:13,740
And depending on timeline and a trillion other things, who knows, like I'll try to get her
2307
02:17:13,740 --> 02:17:22,280
in and run like right when we open, run like her and maybe Jesse through a workshop or
2308
02:17:22,280 --> 02:17:23,800
a simulation or something like that.
2309
02:17:23,800 --> 02:17:31,180
So providing the resources to kind of do all the things because I want people to be able
2310
02:17:31,180 --> 02:17:35,000
to like a lot of times, especially around here, you know, if they have a cool set of
2311
02:17:35,000 --> 02:17:39,960
holds, cool set of fiberglass or volumes, they get like earmarks for like V8 and up
2312
02:17:39,960 --> 02:17:41,040
or something.
2313
02:17:41,040 --> 02:17:44,940
But the general climbing community might be climbing V4 or V5.
2314
02:17:44,940 --> 02:17:49,500
And so my concept was like, I want people who climb V2 to have like the coolest holds
2315
02:17:49,500 --> 02:17:56,040
and volumes to like play on and explore and learn and like because look at the repeatability
2316
02:17:56,040 --> 02:17:57,040
for that.
2317
02:17:57,040 --> 02:18:01,200
Like no matter what you climb, you always need to warm up or you should be warming up.
2318
02:18:01,200 --> 02:18:02,940
So you're going to climb that V2 again.
2319
02:18:02,940 --> 02:18:04,720
But then the people who are projecting that can climb it.
2320
02:18:04,720 --> 02:18:06,200
People who climb V3 are going to climb.
2321
02:18:06,200 --> 02:18:07,200
You know what I mean?
2322
02:18:07,200 --> 02:18:12,080
Like so investing really in like all levels of the community and not just like cutting
2323
02:18:12,080 --> 02:18:16,320
corners because like traditionally that's what we've done.
2324
02:18:16,320 --> 02:18:17,320
I don't know.
2325
02:18:17,320 --> 02:18:18,800
Trying to like push it, push it a little bit.
2326
02:18:18,800 --> 02:18:26,120
Yeah, I mean, it's always good to keep like beginners in mind and setting attractive boulders
2327
02:18:26,120 --> 02:18:29,240
for beginners as well.
2328
02:18:29,240 --> 02:18:33,620
What are your favorite parts of the gym that kind of set it apart for you?
2329
02:18:33,620 --> 02:18:39,080
Or like sometimes when I walk into like a friend's new house or something, I just want
2330
02:18:39,080 --> 02:18:43,900
to know like what quirks of their house or apartment they really like.
2331
02:18:43,900 --> 02:18:46,140
So what is that for you in this gym?
2332
02:18:46,140 --> 02:18:53,080
I think it's all the strangeness of the old build.
2333
02:18:53,080 --> 02:18:55,120
So it was an old Federal Reserve Bank.
2334
02:18:55,120 --> 02:19:01,160
Like I was saying, I think it was built in like 1896.
2335
02:19:01,160 --> 02:19:07,600
You know, like huge granite blocks, wrought iron, steel, there's stained glass windows
2336
02:19:07,600 --> 02:19:08,600
inside.
2337
02:19:08,600 --> 02:19:10,840
I was mentioning the marble.
2338
02:19:10,840 --> 02:19:13,040
Like all the fixtures are like kind of grand.
2339
02:19:13,040 --> 02:19:15,920
It was like a lot of it was renovated in the 20s.
2340
02:19:15,920 --> 02:19:20,280
So it was art deco feel, 39 foot clear height ceilings.
2341
02:19:20,280 --> 02:19:23,640
There's mosaic work on the floor.
2342
02:19:23,640 --> 02:19:25,200
There's like white marble tile on the floor.
2343
02:19:25,200 --> 02:19:26,200
Like, you know what I mean?
2344
02:19:26,200 --> 02:19:27,200
It's just like crazy.
2345
02:19:27,200 --> 02:19:31,720
It almost feels like a museum, you know?
2346
02:19:31,720 --> 02:19:33,800
But like we're going to put new age climbing in there.
2347
02:19:33,800 --> 02:19:36,460
And so I don't know, I just want, I want it to be a place and I think it'll be a place
2348
02:19:36,460 --> 02:19:40,760
where people like generally can just like go and like hang out, you know, and like,
2349
02:19:40,760 --> 02:19:44,680
yeah, you want to climb a little bit cool, but you can just like hang out with your buddies,
2350
02:19:44,680 --> 02:19:48,960
get a coffee and like see what's up and kind of be that like communal watering hole.
2351
02:19:48,960 --> 02:19:53,880
But then also have all the amenities of people who want to like train and get stronger too.
2352
02:19:53,880 --> 02:19:57,640
Like we're going to have a board room, which funny enough is in like a previous conference
2353
02:19:57,640 --> 02:20:04,120
board room that has like these, you know, chandeliers and you know, like I said, like
2354
02:20:04,120 --> 02:20:10,640
multiple stained glass windows and huge fireplaces and stuff and like put, you know, a kilter
2355
02:20:10,640 --> 02:20:11,640
board in there.
2356
02:20:11,640 --> 02:20:14,880
Like we're building our kilter board, like I was just building it two days ago.
2357
02:20:14,880 --> 02:20:20,560
And then, you know, put all of your like training tools, like there will never be a lack of
2358
02:20:20,560 --> 02:20:25,680
training tools, you know, like whatever hang boards that we want or certain types of edges
2359
02:20:25,680 --> 02:20:30,740
or like tension blocks or weight vests, you know, provide all the things for whatever
2360
02:20:30,740 --> 02:20:35,720
type of climber that you want to be or that you are here, but create an environment that
2361
02:20:35,720 --> 02:20:38,440
you like genuinely want to be around.
2362
02:20:38,440 --> 02:20:42,720
It's not like, well, I got to go to the gym to get strong to go send the project outside.
2363
02:20:42,720 --> 02:20:45,200
It's like, no, actually, like, I kind of like hanging out here.
2364
02:20:45,200 --> 02:20:46,800
Like that's what I want.
2365
02:20:46,800 --> 02:20:52,440
I want people to like have that authentic climbing community and experience.
2366
02:20:52,440 --> 02:20:55,080
So that part's cool.
2367
02:20:55,080 --> 02:20:57,280
And the location is like pretty special too.
2368
02:20:57,280 --> 02:21:05,720
So like in this historic district of this city that, so the city is New Bedford, Massachusetts.
2369
02:21:05,720 --> 02:21:11,120
And at one time was the wealthiest city in the world.
2370
02:21:11,120 --> 02:21:12,680
It was the Golden City.
2371
02:21:12,680 --> 02:21:17,280
They called it, it was the whaling capital, whaling capital of the world.
2372
02:21:17,280 --> 02:21:22,600
So back in the whaling days, it's got all this like super cool history from like whaling
2373
02:21:22,600 --> 02:21:30,320
and like those kind of old times, all still accentuated throughout the downtown area with
2374
02:21:30,320 --> 02:21:34,520
cobblestone streets and like huge old lamp posts and stuff like that.
2375
02:21:34,520 --> 02:21:40,000
So even if you like had a morning session or something like that or an afternoon session,
2376
02:21:40,000 --> 02:21:44,060
you could like go down, go down the street and like walk down to the wharf and like catch
2377
02:21:44,060 --> 02:21:49,400
a ferry to Martha's Vineyard or something like that, or like go get some like food from
2378
02:21:49,400 --> 02:21:53,840
these like really cool, unique restaurants that are nearby and like all these like old
2379
02:21:53,840 --> 02:21:58,040
bars and I don't know, it just like has like a cool vibe that you could like go explore
2380
02:21:58,040 --> 02:22:00,720
and learn a lot too also.
2381
02:22:00,720 --> 02:22:02,760
So those are the quirks, I guess.
2382
02:22:02,760 --> 02:22:04,520
Sounds like a super cool space.
2383
02:22:04,520 --> 02:22:06,840
I'll have to check it out.
2384
02:22:06,840 --> 02:22:13,760
Do you like care about cafes in the gym or like yoga or I don't know what else do people
2385
02:22:13,760 --> 02:22:14,760
look for?
2386
02:22:14,760 --> 02:22:15,960
Yeah, I love all that stuff.
2387
02:22:15,960 --> 02:22:22,040
I'm super into like cafes and bars and stuff in gyms like the more Euro style.
2388
02:22:22,040 --> 02:22:28,840
For better or for worse, I think for better, we do not have that in our gym because literally
2389
02:22:28,840 --> 02:22:34,300
across the street, like right across the street, we have this like long standing cafe that's
2390
02:22:34,300 --> 02:22:35,300
very popular.
2391
02:22:35,300 --> 02:22:41,460
So like, yeah, you like walk across two lanes and you're at the cafe.
2392
02:22:41,460 --> 02:22:45,880
And then for bars and drinks and stuff, like doesn't matter which direction you go in.
2393
02:22:45,880 --> 02:22:51,000
There's like restaurants, foods, bars, depending if you want like a low key kind of divey experience
2394
02:22:51,000 --> 02:22:56,400
or you want to like get bougie and like, you know, whatever, like dress up afterwards,
2395
02:22:56,400 --> 02:22:59,040
like any in the whole range, like truly.
2396
02:22:59,040 --> 02:23:05,400
You want live music, you want DJ, you want quiet, you want like outdoor patio, you want
2397
02:23:05,400 --> 02:23:06,600
upstairs, downstairs, you know what I mean?
2398
02:23:06,600 --> 02:23:10,040
Like there's just so many places you could go.
2399
02:23:10,040 --> 02:23:15,080
So we didn't feel like a need to really force that in our own space and we'd rather use
2400
02:23:15,080 --> 02:23:17,480
that space for more climbing and all that.
2401
02:23:17,480 --> 02:23:19,560
And then as far as like yoga and stuff, same thing.
2402
02:23:19,560 --> 02:23:22,680
There's yoga and bar studio one block away.
2403
02:23:22,680 --> 02:23:24,320
That's like pretty prominent in the area.
2404
02:23:24,320 --> 02:23:29,440
So again, like we don't need to rather like bolster the community and not feel like we
2405
02:23:29,440 --> 02:23:32,400
need to like try to pull and take from those folks.
2406
02:23:32,400 --> 02:23:33,920
Like they've been here for a long time.
2407
02:23:33,920 --> 02:23:34,920
They're doing a good thing.
2408
02:23:34,920 --> 02:23:38,640
I'm not going to step on your toes, you know, like just do your thing.
2409
02:23:38,640 --> 02:23:43,360
And hopefully we could have some like cross pollination, you know, maybe some yogis want
2410
02:23:43,360 --> 02:23:46,200
to start climbing, maybe some climbers want to start some yoga.
2411
02:23:46,200 --> 02:23:48,400
It's all good for me.
2412
02:23:48,400 --> 02:23:49,400
That makes sense.
2413
02:23:49,400 --> 02:23:56,280
I think a lot of times climbing gyms are in locations where it's like an old business
2414
02:23:56,280 --> 02:23:58,640
park or like warehouses.
2415
02:23:58,640 --> 02:24:00,800
So it's nice to have those built in.
2416
02:24:00,800 --> 02:24:03,520
But it sounds like you're in a really prime location.
2417
02:24:03,520 --> 02:24:05,360
Yeah, it's kind of bananas.
2418
02:24:05,360 --> 02:24:12,040
There's for the past like 45 years, the city has been trying to get this train station.
2419
02:24:12,040 --> 02:24:21,840
It's like it would be like the termination for this north to south Boston regional transit.
2420
02:24:21,840 --> 02:24:24,920
So in the Boston area, it's called the T, the MBTA.
2421
02:24:24,920 --> 02:24:29,680
And that does like, you know, if you're in Boston proper or just outside, it'll do all
2422
02:24:29,680 --> 02:24:31,480
the normal train things.
2423
02:24:31,480 --> 02:24:35,360
But there's a regional train that will run like to a point.
2424
02:24:35,360 --> 02:24:38,980
It'll run just so far north and just so far south.
2425
02:24:38,980 --> 02:24:42,500
But then there's like these communities that are just outside of that, that are like for
2426
02:24:42,500 --> 02:24:48,000
years have been like, guys, give us the train because we have the people we have.
2427
02:24:48,000 --> 02:24:51,300
All these people are commuting every day to work anyways to Boston.
2428
02:24:51,300 --> 02:24:55,360
So finally, I don't know what gave but they're expanding, I think the north and the south
2429
02:24:55,360 --> 02:24:56,360
terminus points.
2430
02:24:56,360 --> 02:25:00,520
And so New Bedford, about one mile or maybe not even a mile, quarter of a mile from where
2431
02:25:00,520 --> 02:25:03,560
we're at, will have this stop.
2432
02:25:03,560 --> 02:25:09,200
So now I'm feel very certain that like the whole economic growth for the area is going
2433
02:25:09,200 --> 02:25:12,760
to increase because people will be like, oh, I can live here now and just like hop in the
2434
02:25:12,760 --> 02:25:15,960
train and go work in Boston, or people in Boston and be like, oh, cool, I'm going to
2435
02:25:15,960 --> 02:25:19,840
go hang out down in New Bedford for the weekend and go climbing, you know, like it just opens
2436
02:25:19,840 --> 02:25:22,040
up the possibilities for everybody.
2437
02:25:22,040 --> 02:25:29,000
And just kind of allow folks to more easily access, you know, different parts of the state.
2438
02:25:29,000 --> 02:25:30,000
Sounds cool.
2439
02:25:30,000 --> 02:25:31,000
I can't wait for it to open.
2440
02:25:31,000 --> 02:25:32,000
I'll let people know.
2441
02:25:32,000 --> 02:25:36,160
I don't know anyone who lives in Massachusetts, I think, but if I do, I'll let them know.
2442
02:25:36,160 --> 02:25:37,160
Thanks.
2443
02:25:37,160 --> 02:25:39,840
Yeah, we'll be doing lots of projects and stuff too, like workshops, training camps,
2444
02:25:39,840 --> 02:25:40,840
all that kind of thing.
2445
02:25:40,840 --> 02:25:46,720
So it might even be an opportunity for folks who don't live like super close by to like
2446
02:25:46,720 --> 02:25:51,400
maybe make an investment to come visit for whatever project that we're working on.
2447
02:25:51,400 --> 02:25:52,400
Oh, definitely.
2448
02:25:52,400 --> 02:25:53,400
Yeah.
2449
02:25:53,400 --> 02:25:54,400
Okay.
2450
02:25:54,400 --> 02:25:59,140
Well, we can start moving into Discord questions from the community.
2451
02:25:59,140 --> 02:26:04,320
I had one that was about the gym, so we'll just get into that one right now.
2452
02:26:04,320 --> 02:26:08,240
What's the difference between setting for World Cups compared to setting comp style
2453
02:26:08,240 --> 02:26:10,160
boulders in a gym?
2454
02:26:10,160 --> 02:26:11,160
Definitely the...
2455
02:26:11,160 --> 02:26:14,960
I mean, other than difficulty, obviously.
2456
02:26:14,960 --> 02:26:15,960
Yeah.
2457
02:26:15,960 --> 02:26:19,560
The field, like the field of play, or not the field of play, but the field, like who
2458
02:26:19,560 --> 02:26:21,360
are we setting for?
2459
02:26:21,360 --> 02:26:25,840
So like it's a broad field versus a narrow field.
2460
02:26:25,840 --> 02:26:31,000
So broad field is like your commercial, even if it's for like a World Cup style climb,
2461
02:26:31,000 --> 02:26:35,520
it needs to be accessible for a greater range of people, for a greater range of body sizes,
2462
02:26:35,520 --> 02:26:38,600
greater range of experience.
2463
02:26:38,600 --> 02:26:42,560
Whereas a World Cup, I'm like, cool, who's in finals?
2464
02:26:42,560 --> 02:26:43,600
All right.
2465
02:26:43,600 --> 02:26:45,600
That's our minimum in terms of height.
2466
02:26:45,600 --> 02:26:48,320
That's our maximum in terms of height and reach.
2467
02:26:48,320 --> 02:26:50,960
Here's where they're like, here's where they excel.
2468
02:26:50,960 --> 02:26:51,960
Here's where they have difficulty.
2469
02:26:51,960 --> 02:26:53,760
Here's previous rounds of performance.
2470
02:26:53,760 --> 02:26:54,760
Oh, they're tired.
2471
02:26:54,760 --> 02:26:56,600
Oh, they're feeling great.
2472
02:26:56,600 --> 02:27:00,760
It's like hyper-calibrated typically at higher levels of climbing, just because we have more
2473
02:27:00,760 --> 02:27:01,760
information.
2474
02:27:01,760 --> 02:27:05,920
There's more quantitative information that we can pull from.
2475
02:27:05,920 --> 02:27:08,440
And it's for this moment in time, right now.
2476
02:27:08,440 --> 02:27:11,280
This is occurring at this moment.
2477
02:27:11,280 --> 02:27:15,520
Whereas you set a World Cup style climb at the gym, you have more things you need to
2478
02:27:15,520 --> 02:27:24,280
just caretake for and typically provide more opportunities for play and experience and
2479
02:27:24,280 --> 02:27:28,280
success within those things.
2480
02:27:28,280 --> 02:27:32,160
So that'd probably be the biggest differential.
2481
02:27:32,160 --> 02:27:36,720
But it's cool because you can still play with those things and represent climbing movements
2482
02:27:36,720 --> 02:27:39,440
and styles that you've seen at high level events as well.
2483
02:27:39,440 --> 02:27:43,240
Do you have to think about safety a bit more, maybe?
2484
02:27:43,240 --> 02:27:44,240
I would say.
2485
02:27:44,240 --> 02:27:45,440
I'd say that's a fair point.
2486
02:27:45,440 --> 02:27:50,080
I mean, I never personally, this is just small potatoes, but I never say safety.
2487
02:27:50,080 --> 02:27:54,520
I always say risk management, just to be like...
2488
02:27:54,520 --> 02:27:59,720
Because no matter what, even if you have a really experienced climber, shit happens.
2489
02:27:59,720 --> 02:28:12,800
But yeah, I think people's own ability to self-manage their risk, I feel like there's
2490
02:28:12,800 --> 02:28:14,360
probably a phrase for it.
2491
02:28:14,360 --> 02:28:17,520
And I think there is, and I just can't think of it.
2492
02:28:17,520 --> 02:28:23,360
But if you're a high-performing athlete, we can ask a lot of you and you can self-assess
2493
02:28:23,360 --> 02:28:24,360
your risk.
2494
02:28:24,360 --> 02:28:29,800
And then if something goes wrong, you're likely to know how to deal with it in time and space.
2495
02:28:29,800 --> 02:28:33,440
So it's actually less risky, quote, quote.
2496
02:28:33,440 --> 02:28:35,040
You know what I mean?
2497
02:28:35,040 --> 02:28:43,960
But if you put a similar version of a thing on the wall for a less experienced climber,
2498
02:28:43,960 --> 02:28:50,440
they're almost like, depending on where they're at and who they are, they might self-assess
2499
02:28:50,440 --> 02:28:55,160
themselves to be greater at the thing than they actually are, but not have the requisite
2500
02:28:55,160 --> 02:29:01,160
skills to get themselves out of jail, so to speak, if they fuck up.
2501
02:29:01,160 --> 02:29:04,280
And so they're actually way more prone to risk because they're like, oh, this isn't
2502
02:29:04,280 --> 02:29:05,280
so bad.
2503
02:29:05,280 --> 02:29:06,280
Hold my beer, watch this.
2504
02:29:06,280 --> 02:29:11,360
And then they're going way over their head, unknowingly so, and then are more likely to
2505
02:29:11,360 --> 02:29:13,760
get injured and have the severity be higher.
2506
02:29:13,760 --> 02:29:16,080
That's just my feeling on it.
2507
02:29:16,080 --> 02:29:20,120
So yeah, you have to calibrate that quite a bit to make sure that you're doing your
2508
02:29:20,120 --> 02:29:25,840
best to not, I don't know, you don't want to see people get hurt no matter the instance,
2509
02:29:25,840 --> 02:29:27,720
but you have to be more careful in the commercial environment.
2510
02:29:27,720 --> 02:29:28,720
For nothing else, there's more people.
2511
02:29:28,720 --> 02:29:30,280
There's more people climbing on it.
2512
02:29:30,280 --> 02:29:31,280
True.
2513
02:29:31,280 --> 02:29:32,280
Yeah.
2514
02:29:32,280 --> 02:29:33,280
Yeah, that makes it hard as well.
2515
02:29:33,280 --> 02:29:37,240
But yeah, I guess that's more of a body awareness kind of thing, maybe.
2516
02:29:37,240 --> 02:29:38,240
Yeah.
2517
02:29:38,240 --> 02:29:39,240
Yeah, I think so.
2518
02:29:39,240 --> 02:29:40,240
Next one.
2519
02:29:40,240 --> 02:29:46,760
What's your favorite round, I guess probably in World Cups, gender and qualities versus
2520
02:29:46,760 --> 02:29:49,160
semis versus finals?
2521
02:29:49,160 --> 02:29:53,200
What's your favorite round of those to set for and why?
2522
02:29:53,200 --> 02:30:05,680
I think, I mean, maybe this is expected, but I think finals for any gender though.
2523
02:30:05,680 --> 02:30:09,880
I don't have a preference on setting for male or female.
2524
02:30:09,880 --> 02:30:11,840
They're both super fun.
2525
02:30:11,840 --> 02:30:14,980
I don't know.
2526
02:30:14,980 --> 02:30:22,160
Each group can do an incredible amount of fantastic moves and crazy things.
2527
02:30:22,160 --> 02:30:26,680
Some of the boulders this year that I had a highest affinity for might have been for
2528
02:30:26,680 --> 02:30:30,400
women's semis, but then others might be men's finals.
2529
02:30:30,400 --> 02:30:36,960
But I think on the whole, I really like finals because it's this moment.
2530
02:30:36,960 --> 02:30:42,480
Everyone's together and everyone's watching and the drinks are flowing, the music's going.
2531
02:30:42,480 --> 02:30:45,920
It's this crazy feeling and the atmosphere.
2532
02:30:45,920 --> 02:30:51,920
It's like, all right, it all comes down to this, to these four boulders and the announcer
2533
02:30:51,920 --> 02:30:52,920
and the DJ.
2534
02:30:52,920 --> 02:30:53,920
I don't know.
2535
02:30:53,920 --> 02:30:57,200
It just feels very exciting.
2536
02:30:57,200 --> 02:31:01,400
When you're setting, you're kind of like, it's always hard.
2537
02:31:01,400 --> 02:31:04,040
You forget during the setting week, you're like, oh wait, this is going to happen in
2538
02:31:04,040 --> 02:31:05,040
this way.
2539
02:31:05,040 --> 02:31:07,440
You go through it and you're like, holy shit.
2540
02:31:07,440 --> 02:31:08,960
Yeah, that's right.
2541
02:31:08,960 --> 02:31:11,320
That's what this was for.
2542
02:31:11,320 --> 02:31:13,160
I think maybe something like that.
2543
02:31:13,160 --> 02:31:16,960
That's not too obvious of an answer.
2544
02:31:16,960 --> 02:31:23,040
Obviously while you're setting, not all of that is going on.
2545
02:31:23,040 --> 02:31:28,600
I don't know if you feel that energy while you're setting finals boulders versus if it
2546
02:31:28,600 --> 02:31:30,600
all feels the same to you.
2547
02:31:30,600 --> 02:31:33,960
I think that's totally fine.
2548
02:31:33,960 --> 02:31:38,880
What are the top mistakes setters make in commercial setting and how do you avoid these?
2549
02:31:38,880 --> 02:31:46,600
Probably a lot of them are soft skill driven.
2550
02:31:46,600 --> 02:31:52,000
Communication or lack thereof, feedback or lack thereof, understanding how to work with
2551
02:31:52,000 --> 02:31:57,680
your team or lack thereof.
2552
02:31:57,680 --> 02:32:03,760
I think those are some of the biggest because I don't know, regardless of your setting ability,
2553
02:32:03,760 --> 02:32:05,800
I don't know if you've ever set before.
2554
02:32:05,800 --> 02:32:11,360
No, that's not for me.
2555
02:32:11,360 --> 02:32:17,400
Conceptually, I could fly to Southern California or wherever you're at and be like, all right,
2556
02:32:17,400 --> 02:32:19,840
Jenny, here's what we're going to do.
2557
02:32:19,840 --> 02:32:26,960
Here's some bolts, here's how they attach and here's just some pointers so that way
2558
02:32:26,960 --> 02:32:30,080
you can just move forward and you could set a climb.
2559
02:32:30,080 --> 02:32:31,560
Anyone can do it.
2560
02:32:31,560 --> 02:32:34,320
In that regard, it's zero barrier to entry.
2561
02:32:34,320 --> 02:32:38,320
You just have to want to do it, whether or not it's going to be good or bad or whatever.
2562
02:32:38,320 --> 02:32:42,480
If I said, Jenny, set me a ladder to get from bottom to top, at the very least, you could
2563
02:32:42,480 --> 02:32:46,760
pick out the biggest jugs, put them in a horizontal line and those hands would then become feet
2564
02:32:46,760 --> 02:32:50,120
and then you'd get to the top of the wall.
2565
02:32:50,120 --> 02:32:52,860
When it comes to that, there's no mistakes.
2566
02:32:52,860 --> 02:32:57,080
It's just your choices of how to attach things to the wall.
2567
02:32:57,080 --> 02:33:01,720
inevitably there's such a diverse group of people who are climbing on your climbs that
2568
02:33:01,720 --> 02:33:06,520
inevitably there's going to be some people who like or dislike or love or hate or whatever
2569
02:33:06,520 --> 02:33:09,400
about your climbs.
2570
02:33:09,400 --> 02:33:13,040
What really matters is how are you working with your team?
2571
02:33:13,040 --> 02:33:14,600
How are you working with your company?
2572
02:33:14,600 --> 02:33:16,920
Are you showing up on time?
2573
02:33:16,920 --> 02:33:17,920
You know what I mean?
2574
02:33:17,920 --> 02:33:23,740
Are you being lazy or are you always the person who's rushing around to help others?
2575
02:33:23,740 --> 02:33:28,680
Those are massive wins or losses depending on what you're doing.
2576
02:33:28,680 --> 02:33:33,480
If you're always that person who's willing to lend a hand and provide good feedback,
2577
02:33:33,480 --> 02:33:40,300
even when the feedback isn't good and it's constructive, are you able to provide that
2578
02:33:40,300 --> 02:33:44,000
feedback constructively in a way that the other person receives it well?
2579
02:33:44,000 --> 02:33:46,840
Because different people receive feedback differently.
2580
02:33:46,840 --> 02:33:49,900
That's a fact of life.
2581
02:33:49,900 --> 02:33:53,240
Can you calibrate for that?
2582
02:33:53,240 --> 02:33:55,840
That's massive.
2583
02:33:55,840 --> 02:33:58,640
Then having the longevity.
2584
02:33:58,640 --> 02:34:02,520
Knowing when to turn it on, when to turn it off, knowing your own body, knowing your own
2585
02:34:02,520 --> 02:34:07,960
mind, being able to do it day in and day out.
2586
02:34:07,960 --> 02:34:11,560
It's not just setting for a day.
2587
02:34:11,560 --> 02:34:13,640
If it's commercially, it's setting for a life.
2588
02:34:13,640 --> 02:34:15,400
It's setting for a salary.
2589
02:34:15,400 --> 02:34:21,480
It's setting for your family because you're providing and you're getting compensated
2590
02:34:21,480 --> 02:34:22,480
in some way.
2591
02:34:22,480 --> 02:34:28,880
You need to make sure that you have this ability to continue if that is your goal.
2592
02:34:28,880 --> 02:34:30,600
I think managing that is quite important.
2593
02:34:30,600 --> 02:34:31,600
Yeah.
2594
02:34:31,600 --> 02:34:36,840
I did a setting clinic once, just like an intro, just to try it out.
2595
02:34:36,840 --> 02:34:37,840
Yeah.
2596
02:34:37,840 --> 02:34:39,600
Definitely it was not for me.
2597
02:34:39,600 --> 02:34:44,280
I put something up, hated it.
2598
02:34:44,280 --> 02:34:47,880
I think Flannery was leading that clinic.
2599
02:34:47,880 --> 02:34:48,880
Oh, nice.
2600
02:34:48,880 --> 02:34:49,880
I love Flann.
2601
02:34:49,880 --> 02:34:53,360
Flann and I get to talk quite a lot, we're both on the root setting committee.
2602
02:34:53,360 --> 02:34:58,080
We chat quite a bit on different projects and trying to get them to come up with me
2603
02:34:58,080 --> 02:35:03,760
to Montreal in the next couple of months and do a big clinic up there.
2604
02:35:03,760 --> 02:35:05,280
Flann's awesome, 10 out of 10.
2605
02:35:05,280 --> 02:35:08,840
Really good clinic, but yeah, I just couldn't do it.
2606
02:35:08,840 --> 02:35:15,040
I was talking to them about the climb and I was about to cry.
2607
02:35:15,040 --> 02:35:16,840
I was so bad.
2608
02:35:16,840 --> 02:35:18,640
I was so upset.
2609
02:35:18,640 --> 02:35:26,080
Then at the end, they were asking, does everyone want to try setting again or have interest
2610
02:35:26,080 --> 02:35:29,520
in it and everyone raised their hand except for me.
2611
02:35:29,520 --> 02:35:33,480
I was like, I can't, it's too much.
2612
02:35:33,480 --> 02:35:34,480
It's a lot.
2613
02:35:34,480 --> 02:35:35,480
It's a lot.
2614
02:35:35,480 --> 02:35:38,960
You're always putting your heart on your sleeve, but you're putting your heart on a sleeve
2615
02:35:38,960 --> 02:35:44,240
in a way that's kinesthetic that everyone is grabbing, whether or not you want them
2616
02:35:44,240 --> 02:35:45,240
to.
2617
02:35:45,240 --> 02:35:54,240
You have to show it and everyone gets to touch it and beat on it and love it and hate it.
2618
02:35:54,240 --> 02:35:58,200
If nothing else, it can be an emotionally demanding profession for sure.
2619
02:35:58,200 --> 02:36:00,880
Yeah, emotionally, physically, it was everything.
2620
02:36:00,880 --> 02:36:09,280
It was also just like, I'm still trying to get stronger and it was so physically exhausting
2621
02:36:09,280 --> 02:36:13,480
that it just wouldn't let me climb after.
2622
02:36:13,480 --> 02:36:16,320
Yeah, that's a super fair point.
2623
02:36:16,320 --> 02:36:18,480
A lot of people forget that aspect of it.
2624
02:36:18,480 --> 02:36:21,600
It's like, oh, why didn't this setter just do that?
2625
02:36:21,600 --> 02:36:26,520
That setter probably made that tweak at the seventh hour of the day out of eight and it's
2626
02:36:26,520 --> 02:36:29,880
a Thursday and they've been here since Monday.
2627
02:36:29,880 --> 02:36:34,840
Maybe they were just exhausted and they just didn't see it because they're so tired.
2628
02:36:34,840 --> 02:36:40,400
It's like that personification of the products that were...
2629
02:36:40,400 --> 02:36:44,960
It's a balance because on one hand, if you're a member of a climbing gym, you're like, I
2630
02:36:44,960 --> 02:36:48,920
don't care your excuse, give me the product that I pay for because that's fair because
2631
02:36:48,920 --> 02:36:52,000
you're paying a premium, especially where you're at.
2632
02:36:52,000 --> 02:36:57,040
If you're in California, there's a lot of gyms that you can vote for with your money.
2633
02:36:57,040 --> 02:37:00,640
You want the highest caliber of the thing, but then the other side of it is, well, it's
2634
02:37:00,640 --> 02:37:07,240
people creating this thing for you to experience.
2635
02:37:07,240 --> 02:37:12,080
Just having a little bit of a understanding of that can go quite a long way too.
2636
02:37:12,080 --> 02:37:14,040
It's just constant back and forth.
2637
02:37:14,040 --> 02:37:15,880
Yeah, there's a lot to it.
2638
02:37:15,880 --> 02:37:19,840
But yeah, back to the questions.
2639
02:37:19,840 --> 02:37:23,700
This was from a previous guest, a Paraclimber.
2640
02:37:23,700 --> 02:37:27,200
Will there be any facilities in your gym for the Paraclimbing community?
2641
02:37:27,200 --> 02:37:32,560
That's a great question and I'll be honest.
2642
02:37:32,560 --> 02:37:35,640
This is the minimum, of course.
2643
02:37:35,640 --> 02:37:39,560
It's going to be ADA compliant because it has to be.
2644
02:37:39,560 --> 02:37:42,320
So I'm not going to be like, oh yeah, look at us.
2645
02:37:42,320 --> 02:37:46,760
But I don't know really much about Paraclimbing.
2646
02:37:46,760 --> 02:37:48,600
I'll be the first to say that.
2647
02:37:48,600 --> 02:37:55,920
But thankfully, some of my closest friends either have been, are, or will be chiefs for
2648
02:37:55,920 --> 02:38:00,200
Paranationals and also run a lot of Para events.
2649
02:38:00,200 --> 02:38:06,440
So that's a great, really great question that frankly I haven't thought about throughout
2650
02:38:06,440 --> 02:38:07,440
this process.
2651
02:38:07,440 --> 02:38:12,840
Right now I've kind of been thinking about a lot of the wall design and stuff like that.
2652
02:38:12,840 --> 02:38:14,240
I haven't thought about the other stuff.
2653
02:38:14,240 --> 02:38:20,000
But that's a really, really good question that now I'm going to probably make some phone
2654
02:38:20,000 --> 02:38:25,280
calls after this or some text messages and be like, hey, what can we do to make this
2655
02:38:25,280 --> 02:38:27,400
more accessible?
2656
02:38:27,400 --> 02:38:31,280
Some cool things, we have elevators throughout all of the facility.
2657
02:38:31,280 --> 02:38:32,280
So that's cool.
2658
02:38:32,280 --> 02:38:37,000
No matter if you want to go train upstairs, you want to train downstairs.
2659
02:38:37,000 --> 02:38:42,960
But as far as specific setting for Para athletes, I honestly just frankly hadn't considered
2660
02:38:42,960 --> 02:38:45,320
that.
2661
02:38:45,320 --> 02:38:50,620
Especially up here, I haven't noticed any advocacy for it.
2662
02:38:50,620 --> 02:38:55,520
But now that's actually probably a, I mean it's got to be a massive community up here
2663
02:38:55,520 --> 02:38:56,520
that's underserved.
2664
02:38:56,520 --> 02:39:00,240
That would just extend to reason.
2665
02:39:00,240 --> 02:39:04,360
So whoever that climber is, thank you for that.
2666
02:39:04,360 --> 02:39:06,400
Now you got my wheels turning.
2667
02:39:06,400 --> 02:39:10,640
So I don't know what we don't know yet, but I do know that we will absolutely, like I
2668
02:39:10,640 --> 02:39:13,160
tell you we're going to put our best foot forward with that.
2669
02:39:13,160 --> 02:39:18,000
So it's like Aaron Davis and Noel Heckel and Miles West, Kenny Benson, like all these folks
2670
02:39:18,000 --> 02:39:27,200
are and woman Mia DePolis, like they're all nationals, para nationals setters and stuff
2671
02:39:27,200 --> 02:39:28,400
like that.
2672
02:39:28,400 --> 02:39:32,800
And then also have some typically some personal connection to the para world, whether that's
2673
02:39:32,800 --> 02:39:35,600
family members or friends or something like that.
2674
02:39:35,600 --> 02:39:39,280
So I'm going to get some advice on that.
2675
02:39:39,280 --> 02:39:41,400
Yeah, that was Anita Agarwal.
2676
02:39:41,400 --> 02:39:45,920
But yeah, maybe you'll see if there's a community up there or maybe you'll start the community
2677
02:39:45,920 --> 02:39:46,920
up there.
2678
02:39:46,920 --> 02:39:48,200
That's an awesome idea.
2679
02:39:48,200 --> 02:39:49,200
Awesome.
2680
02:39:49,200 --> 02:39:50,200
Okay.
2681
02:39:50,200 --> 02:39:51,200
Two more.
2682
02:39:51,200 --> 02:39:57,160
So which athlete is the hardest to set for or type of climbers hardest to set for?
2683
02:39:57,160 --> 02:40:01,360
They said I'm assuming Yanya is somewhere at the top of that list.
2684
02:40:01,360 --> 02:40:05,800
I feel like Yanya is easy to set for because she's just going to do it.
2685
02:40:05,800 --> 02:40:06,800
You know what I mean?
2686
02:40:06,800 --> 02:40:12,520
Like I'm not like easy to set for that's maybe like a misnomer, but like you never
2687
02:40:12,520 --> 02:40:17,880
like you never really like worried if whether or not like if we're like ever worried, like
2688
02:40:17,880 --> 02:40:20,640
I don't know if someone's going to do that boulder and if Yanya is competing, we're like,
2689
02:40:20,640 --> 02:40:23,480
well, yeah, and it's just going to do it.
2690
02:40:23,480 --> 02:40:27,000
I don't know hardest athlete to set for.
2691
02:40:27,000 --> 02:40:33,120
I think it's just probably mostly when you get some of the extremes in terms of body
2692
02:40:33,120 --> 02:40:41,080
size in like finals because there is and I mean, we talked about Innsbruck a little bit.
2693
02:40:41,080 --> 02:40:45,440
There isn't there wasn't any like super I don't think Stasha made finals like Stasha
2694
02:40:45,440 --> 02:40:48,560
is the tallest girl I think or Oceana.
2695
02:40:48,560 --> 02:40:54,480
So if you have like one of them and let's say I in finals, you're like, fuck, that's
2696
02:40:54,480 --> 02:40:59,720
hard because you just like you know, you want to represent all the styles and all the things
2697
02:40:59,720 --> 02:41:04,960
we talked about today and also like what is the experience differential for them on this
2698
02:41:04,960 --> 02:41:10,960
move versus this move versus this zone versus this top and then you again balance in the
2699
02:41:10,960 --> 02:41:11,960
optics of it.
2700
02:41:11,960 --> 02:41:16,000
You balance in their own personal performance.
2701
02:41:16,000 --> 02:41:17,000
It's quite difficult.
2702
02:41:17,000 --> 02:41:19,280
Same thing on the men's side.
2703
02:41:19,280 --> 02:41:24,040
If you have this one's a little bit maybe easier sometimes like if you have Seratu versus
2704
02:41:24,040 --> 02:41:27,400
like Mechi, I always say their names.
2705
02:41:27,400 --> 02:41:28,400
I don't pronounce their names right.
2706
02:41:28,400 --> 02:41:30,280
So I'm sorry, but I need to get better.
2707
02:41:30,280 --> 02:41:36,240
I know there's like some accent there, but the nice thing is, is that like Seratu is
2708
02:41:36,240 --> 02:41:43,160
so fucking strong that like just given any inkling of opportunity, he's going to like
2709
02:41:43,160 --> 02:41:44,400
find a way through it.
2710
02:41:44,400 --> 02:41:49,440
So it almost is like a little bit of a setter get out of jail free to some degree as long
2711
02:41:49,440 --> 02:41:55,840
as it's not like a completely statically static tension demanding position where you like
2712
02:41:55,840 --> 02:42:00,920
the only way to do this move is if you keep all these three points of contact on as long
2713
02:42:00,920 --> 02:42:05,560
as you avoid that then like or you avoid the situation where something like someone's super
2714
02:42:05,560 --> 02:42:09,400
tall like Adam or Mechi can just reach and get his own.
2715
02:42:09,400 --> 02:42:13,120
As long as you avoid those two things, like otherwise you kind of can play a little bit
2716
02:42:13,120 --> 02:42:19,760
more just because like I was saying like Seratu is good at every style.
2717
02:42:19,760 --> 02:42:20,760
He's good at the jumps.
2718
02:42:20,760 --> 02:42:21,760
He's good at the slab.
2719
02:42:21,760 --> 02:42:22,760
He's good at tech.
2720
02:42:22,760 --> 02:42:23,760
He's good at the swings.
2721
02:42:23,760 --> 02:42:24,760
He's like, he's just good.
2722
02:42:24,760 --> 02:42:33,900
Whereas like, you know, Ai is amazing athlete, but she definitely has more of a gradient
2723
02:42:33,900 --> 02:42:35,880
of like style preference.
2724
02:42:35,880 --> 02:42:40,760
Yeah, like her strengths are incredibly strong and her weaknesses are quite weak, but they
2725
02:42:40,760 --> 02:42:45,260
also fall in line a lot of times, I feel like with her size.
2726
02:42:45,260 --> 02:42:51,080
And so it can feel even more challenging at times.
2727
02:42:51,080 --> 02:42:56,240
So yeah, I'd say it has nothing to do with the tallest or the strongest or the weakest.
2728
02:42:56,240 --> 02:43:04,400
It's like when you get them in some sort of order for a finals, that can be where it's
2729
02:43:04,400 --> 02:43:10,120
tricky when there's a massive discrepancy in those things as when it gets, you just
2730
02:43:10,120 --> 02:43:12,560
have to have a much finer tooth comb.
2731
02:43:12,560 --> 02:43:16,060
And even with the finer tooth comb, you're more likely to make a mistake.
2732
02:43:16,060 --> 02:43:21,160
So sounds like someone who's overall good at everything is just the easiest person.
2733
02:43:21,160 --> 02:43:22,160
Don't even have to.
2734
02:43:22,160 --> 02:43:23,160
It's great.
2735
02:43:23,160 --> 02:43:27,400
Yeah, if you're there, the chances are high that the boulders all get done.
2736
02:43:27,400 --> 02:43:30,720
Even if you get if you're like, oh, this boulder felt really hard.
2737
02:43:30,720 --> 02:43:34,640
Like she's just really good, you know, so chances are she's going to do it.
2738
02:43:34,640 --> 02:43:39,780
I guess maybe the asker was wondering if it's hard to set for her because a lot of times
2739
02:43:39,780 --> 02:43:44,440
after when she gets interviewed, she's always like, oh, like, wasn't that interesting or
2740
02:43:44,440 --> 02:43:45,440
it wasn't.
2741
02:43:45,440 --> 02:43:51,080
Yeah, I think she has she handles herself really well in those situations because you
2742
02:43:51,080 --> 02:43:53,840
can see it that she wants to push more and try more.
2743
02:43:53,840 --> 02:43:56,280
You saw her after Burn.
2744
02:43:56,280 --> 02:43:59,880
She flashed every boulder in the World Championship finals.
2745
02:43:59,880 --> 02:44:01,120
Just did so well.
2746
02:44:01,120 --> 02:44:02,320
And everyone else struggled.
2747
02:44:02,320 --> 02:44:03,440
Everyone else was a performance.
2748
02:44:03,440 --> 02:44:04,880
Everyone else it was like a battle.
2749
02:44:04,880 --> 02:44:09,320
And she just all the way.
2750
02:44:09,320 --> 02:44:13,040
And in some ways, you're like, yeah, yeah, you're right.
2751
02:44:13,040 --> 02:44:15,040
I don't know what to do about you.
2752
02:44:15,040 --> 02:44:19,360
You're winning in casual style, time in and time out.
2753
02:44:19,360 --> 02:44:24,280
But it's like not just respectfully, it's not just about you.
2754
02:44:24,280 --> 02:44:28,960
There's five other women in your field just for finals or there's 19 other women in semis
2755
02:44:28,960 --> 02:44:35,040
who also would like a chance to perform and a chance to succeed and showcase their skills.
2756
02:44:35,040 --> 02:44:40,140
And then sometimes, sometimes as we know, there is still a chance for Rania to make
2757
02:44:40,140 --> 02:44:43,080
a mistake and that athlete to perform through.
2758
02:44:43,080 --> 02:44:47,480
So just as much as we're not always setting, you know, for any one specific style, we're
2759
02:44:47,480 --> 02:44:49,280
never setting for one specific climber.
2760
02:44:49,280 --> 02:44:53,160
We just have to like open the doors of possibility for everyone and allow them themselves to
2761
02:44:53,160 --> 02:44:54,160
shine through.
2762
02:44:54,160 --> 02:44:57,160
OK, making it to the last question.
2763
02:44:57,160 --> 02:45:02,020
You kind of touched on this a little, but how much do you think setters are able to
2764
02:45:02,020 --> 02:45:04,540
sway rounds for particular athletes?
2765
02:45:04,540 --> 02:45:10,520
And are there any current safeguards or are the current safeguards enough or is bias setting
2766
02:45:10,520 --> 02:45:14,040
going to be a problem in the next few years?
2767
02:45:14,040 --> 02:45:23,120
I'd say the safeguards are like every setter, like if you're talking about like IFC stuff,
2768
02:45:23,120 --> 02:45:25,400
every setter is coming from a different country or just about.
2769
02:45:25,400 --> 02:45:26,920
Like there's no way.
2770
02:45:26,920 --> 02:45:30,880
Like it's everything is so communal, like, OK, Janice, that's a boulder.
2771
02:45:30,880 --> 02:45:31,880
Great.
2772
02:45:31,880 --> 02:45:36,320
And if let's say Ginny was a terrible human being and just said, I really want so and
2773
02:45:36,320 --> 02:45:40,040
so to win, if she really knew so and so.
2774
02:45:40,040 --> 02:45:47,600
Yeah, like you knew their style and there was some way like I mean, I guess that you
2775
02:45:47,600 --> 02:45:49,120
could try to do that.
2776
02:45:49,120 --> 02:45:52,360
But then but then the small group would come over, because usually come over with like
2777
02:45:52,360 --> 02:45:54,720
another group of like two or three or four people.
2778
02:45:54,720 --> 02:45:57,000
And then we would make give you feedback.
2779
02:45:57,000 --> 02:46:00,160
And you can't just say no, it doesn't work that way.
2780
02:46:00,160 --> 02:46:01,600
You know, you can't just be like, no, fuck you.
2781
02:46:01,600 --> 02:46:04,200
We're not doing that.
2782
02:46:04,200 --> 02:46:05,760
It's so much more collaborative.
2783
02:46:05,760 --> 02:46:08,640
And then the chief has to check mark the boulder.
2784
02:46:08,640 --> 02:46:14,160
And then like it just be so excruciatingly obvious to anyone on the setting team that
2785
02:46:14,160 --> 02:46:19,640
that was the case that like we'd be like, no, like this isn't happening.
2786
02:46:19,640 --> 02:46:20,960
Like it's not I don't know.
2787
02:46:20,960 --> 02:46:25,640
Like to me, it's just like so far away from a possibility.
2788
02:46:25,640 --> 02:46:28,840
But the funny thing is, is that that person who's asking this question is right.
2789
02:46:28,840 --> 02:46:36,720
Like in in theory, there's like really no other world where like people can create this
2790
02:46:36,720 --> 02:46:41,520
field of play that performance is then kind of judged on.
2791
02:46:41,520 --> 02:46:46,080
I mean, maybe you have like skiing like or snowboarding in some instances.
2792
02:46:46,080 --> 02:46:52,880
I mean, if like golf might be the closest thing if golf courses changed.
2793
02:46:52,880 --> 02:46:54,160
But golf courses don't change.
2794
02:46:54,160 --> 02:46:55,160
You know what I mean?
2795
02:46:55,160 --> 02:46:57,200
But like in theory, like someone's creating them, right?
2796
02:46:57,200 --> 02:47:01,040
Like you have a golf course, I don't know what they call them, like a designer, creator.
2797
02:47:01,040 --> 02:47:04,400
And like they're the ones determining how long is the drive going to be?
2798
02:47:04,400 --> 02:47:05,400
How many?
2799
02:47:05,400 --> 02:47:06,520
What's the par supposed to be?
2800
02:47:06,520 --> 02:47:09,120
What is our tree situation looking like in terms of obstacles?
2801
02:47:09,120 --> 02:47:10,120
What about bunkers?
2802
02:47:10,120 --> 02:47:11,120
What about water features?
2803
02:47:11,120 --> 02:47:12,940
What about slope?
2804
02:47:12,940 --> 02:47:16,080
What's the grass depth and thickness?
2805
02:47:16,080 --> 02:47:17,080
You know what I mean?
2806
02:47:17,080 --> 02:47:20,080
Like all these things, like they have this play in a very similar way to that we have
2807
02:47:20,080 --> 02:47:21,080
play.
2808
02:47:21,080 --> 02:47:23,320
But like Pebble Beach is Pebble Beach every year.
2809
02:47:23,320 --> 02:47:25,760
Augusta is Augusta every year.
2810
02:47:25,760 --> 02:47:31,720
So in any case, I guess my point being is the safeguards are like built in due to the
2811
02:47:31,720 --> 02:47:32,720
diversity of the team.
2812
02:47:32,720 --> 02:47:37,600
I think you could run into the risk of like, let's say you had an entirely fill in the
2813
02:47:37,600 --> 02:47:40,160
blank country team, maybe.
2814
02:47:40,160 --> 02:47:45,460
But even then, I don't think anyone, like no one athlete is going to be worth someone's
2815
02:47:45,460 --> 02:47:47,620
entire career.
2816
02:47:47,620 --> 02:47:50,880
You know, like I'm never, I would never do that because I've spent nearly 20 years of
2817
02:47:50,880 --> 02:47:54,660
my life trying to create a career for myself.
2818
02:47:54,660 --> 02:47:58,160
Like I don't like, I want to see everyone succeed.
2819
02:47:58,160 --> 02:48:01,560
I want people to win and fight, but I'm not going to like, I don't know.
2820
02:48:01,560 --> 02:48:03,120
It just to me seems crazy.
2821
02:48:03,120 --> 02:48:08,080
So the first part of the question though was...
2822
02:48:08,080 --> 02:48:11,760
How much do you think setters are able to sway around particular athletes?
2823
02:48:11,760 --> 02:48:16,320
I mean, I think if, if I think anything's possible to the same points that I was just
2824
02:48:16,320 --> 02:48:24,200
kind of making is that like you could, it would have to really be a situation where
2825
02:48:24,200 --> 02:48:30,040
climber a climber was a hyper specific stylistic climber.
2826
02:48:30,040 --> 02:48:34,360
You know what I mean, like their strengths were so far and outside of other people's
2827
02:48:34,360 --> 02:48:36,000
strengths.
2828
02:48:36,000 --> 02:48:37,000
You know what I mean?
2829
02:48:37,000 --> 02:48:40,600
And they're like to where you could even create this possibility.
2830
02:48:40,600 --> 02:48:42,120
I'm just talking about theory here.
2831
02:48:42,120 --> 02:48:49,160
Like if someone was just so far above and above and beyond at jumps compared to the
2832
02:48:49,160 --> 02:48:54,160
rest of their field, and then you made it so that everything was just the same style
2833
02:48:54,160 --> 02:48:57,600
of jump, then maybe.
2834
02:48:57,600 --> 02:49:01,480
But again, like, but then honestly at this level, the jury president would come over
2835
02:49:01,480 --> 02:49:06,880
and be like, no, no, we're not doing this.
2836
02:49:06,880 --> 02:49:14,000
Like you're not having three, five arm paddle dinos back to back to back to back.
2837
02:49:14,000 --> 02:49:15,000
You know what I mean?
2838
02:49:15,000 --> 02:49:17,960
Like they just be like, no, like you have two hours reset it and get it.
2839
02:49:17,960 --> 02:49:19,560
Like that happened in Salt Lake.
2840
02:49:19,560 --> 02:49:23,680
Not this version, but they like canceled the boulder in Salt Lake this year.
2841
02:49:23,680 --> 02:49:28,680
Just three coaches, I think it was like three federations were like, no, we don't like that.
2842
02:49:28,680 --> 02:49:31,680
And then the jury president was like, no, that's unsafe.
2843
02:49:31,680 --> 02:49:32,680
So then they had to reset the boulder.
2844
02:49:32,680 --> 02:49:34,040
So you know what I mean?
2845
02:49:34,040 --> 02:49:35,840
So like, they'll do it.
2846
02:49:35,840 --> 02:49:41,720
So I just, I don't know, like it's, it's the probably closest of possibility and the least
2847
02:49:41,720 --> 02:49:42,720
likely to happen.
2848
02:49:42,720 --> 02:49:43,720
If that makes sense.
2849
02:49:43,720 --> 02:49:49,880
I think like the main one that people think of is like, like French climbers are supremely
2850
02:49:49,880 --> 02:49:50,880
good at slabs.
2851
02:49:50,880 --> 02:49:54,400
I think that's like the main one that comes from people's mind.
2852
02:49:54,400 --> 02:49:55,400
I think that's a, yeah.
2853
02:49:55,400 --> 02:49:58,960
I mean, then a lot of times people say like, oh, American climbers are just really good
2854
02:49:58,960 --> 02:50:01,200
at like fuggie pinches and steep stuff.
2855
02:50:01,200 --> 02:50:03,680
And it's like maybe historically that was the case.
2856
02:50:03,680 --> 02:50:06,520
And I think there probably are some, still some feelings on that.
2857
02:50:06,520 --> 02:50:09,800
A lot of that, I think a lot of that is driven by commercial climbing.
2858
02:50:09,800 --> 02:50:14,880
Actually, if you look around in gyms around the U S how many slabs do you really see?
2859
02:50:14,880 --> 02:50:22,840
How many like 12 foot, 14 foot long slabs that are four or five, six degree angled slabs?
2860
02:50:22,840 --> 02:50:28,520
Do you see where you are like truly, truly slab climbing?
2861
02:50:28,520 --> 02:50:31,240
Probably not many.
2862
02:50:31,240 --> 02:50:37,640
So it's kind of like, yeah, maybe the French climbers, they train that because they realize,
2863
02:50:37,640 --> 02:50:39,280
yep, we're really good at that.
2864
02:50:39,280 --> 02:50:40,280
They're really bad at that.
2865
02:50:40,280 --> 02:50:44,540
So when a slab comes up, if it's going to come up 25% of the time and around the chances
2866
02:50:44,540 --> 02:50:48,000
are high that I'm going to smash and I need that advantage.
2867
02:50:48,000 --> 02:50:50,880
So naturally the other athletes should be saying the same thing.
2868
02:50:50,880 --> 02:50:55,560
And actually Yoshiyuki this season, I talked with him a couple of times, so I was hanging
2869
02:50:55,560 --> 02:50:57,240
out with him in Tokyo a bit.
2870
02:50:57,240 --> 02:51:01,520
And then we did like a training camp in Nuremberg and you know, just like kind of saw him, we
2871
02:51:01,520 --> 02:51:03,120
were just kind of hanging out a little bit.
2872
02:51:03,120 --> 02:51:07,920
And he was telling me like other athletes in between, in between comps were like going
2873
02:51:07,920 --> 02:51:12,680
to train like whatever you think of, whenever you think of like climbing training, whether
2874
02:51:12,680 --> 02:51:16,280
it's like finger boarding and pull ups and sit ups or whatever, I don't know, whatever
2875
02:51:16,280 --> 02:51:18,080
you think of training.
2876
02:51:18,080 --> 02:51:21,920
He would go to the gym like three to four days a week and just climb slabs for three
2877
02:51:21,920 --> 02:51:22,920
hours a day.
2878
02:51:22,920 --> 02:51:26,440
Because he was like, I'm just not good on slabs.
2879
02:51:26,440 --> 02:51:27,640
I just need to go climb slabs.
2880
02:51:27,640 --> 02:51:30,640
And I'm just like, fuck yeah, dude, that is awesome.
2881
02:51:30,640 --> 02:51:34,820
Like that is exactly what you should be doing, you know, because he and then guess what?
2882
02:51:34,820 --> 02:51:37,480
Some slabs came around and he did a great job.
2883
02:51:37,480 --> 02:51:39,640
He did a really, really, really good job.
2884
02:51:39,640 --> 02:51:44,960
So it's kind of hard in those level of environments where you can really favor athletes too much
2885
02:51:44,960 --> 02:51:52,680
because the field is just so competitive nowadays that yeah, I don't know.
2886
02:51:52,680 --> 02:51:55,480
I don't know how I don't know how it'd be done.
2887
02:51:55,480 --> 02:51:56,480
Sounds good.
2888
02:51:56,480 --> 02:51:59,440
I think that's quite comprehensive.
2889
02:51:59,440 --> 02:52:01,720
And that's all the questions I had.
2890
02:52:01,720 --> 02:52:04,840
Yeah, thank you so much for all the time.
2891
02:52:04,840 --> 02:52:07,400
It was super interesting to get to know all this.
2892
02:52:07,400 --> 02:52:12,320
I know a lot of people were also really excited to hear about it and they had a lot of questions.
2893
02:52:12,320 --> 02:52:16,360
So hopefully this this answer is a lot.
2894
02:52:16,360 --> 02:52:19,360
Anything else you want to shout out or let people know where they can find you?
2895
02:52:19,360 --> 02:52:20,360
Yeah, sure.
2896
02:52:20,360 --> 02:52:25,600
I mean, if anyone ever has any questions and anything about like route setting or climbing
2897
02:52:25,600 --> 02:52:30,800
or consultation stuff, like I said, it's kind of how I make my bread and butter.
2898
02:52:30,800 --> 02:52:36,680
But even if it's just, you know, friendly personal stuff, Instagram, I try to communicate
2899
02:52:36,680 --> 02:52:38,160
people as much as I can through there.
2900
02:52:38,160 --> 02:52:39,160
It's just at see gradsky.
2901
02:52:39,160 --> 02:52:42,040
It's just my first and first initial last name.
2902
02:52:42,040 --> 02:52:45,600
And then my business account is syndicate route setting.
2903
02:52:45,600 --> 02:52:49,120
So I try to be up on both of those as much as possible.
2904
02:52:49,120 --> 02:52:52,360
So you kind of hit one or the other is fine.
2905
02:52:52,360 --> 02:52:56,760
And then the climbing gym that we're opening is called Boulder Union.
2906
02:52:56,760 --> 02:53:01,120
So of course, would love to invite everyone to come visit at some point in time.
2907
02:53:01,120 --> 02:53:05,760
And yeah, if you have any feedback for me or questions or anything, comments, concerns,
2908
02:53:05,760 --> 02:53:08,480
ideas, thoughts, feelings, just give me a shout.
2909
02:53:08,480 --> 02:53:09,480
Open book.
2910
02:53:09,480 --> 02:53:10,480
Awesome.
2911
02:53:10,480 --> 02:53:14,400
I'll leave all those links in the description so people can take a look.
2912
02:53:14,400 --> 02:53:15,400
And yeah, thank you again.
2913
02:53:15,400 --> 02:53:16,400
It was an amazing talk.
2914
02:53:16,400 --> 02:53:17,400
Awesome.
2915
02:53:17,400 --> 02:53:18,400
Thank you so much, Annie.
2916
02:53:18,400 --> 02:53:21,840
Thank you so much for making it to the end of the podcast.
2917
02:53:21,840 --> 02:53:24,440
Don't forget to like and subscribe if you enjoyed.
2918
02:53:24,440 --> 02:53:27,560
Otherwise you are a super fake climber.
2919
02:53:27,560 --> 02:53:32,240
If you're listening on a podcasting platform, I'd appreciate if you rate it five stars and
2920
02:53:32,240 --> 02:53:37,200
you can continue the discussion on the free competition climbing discord linked in the
2921
02:53:37,200 --> 02:53:38,200
description.
2922
02:53:38,200 --> 02:54:05,200
Thanks again for listening.
