38: Chaz Misuraca, Climbing Blind
Chaz is a blind paraclimber from team Canada and is in the B3 category, meaning he has about 10% of his sight left. What’s crazy is that he didn’t start climbing until after he lost his vision! In this episode, we’ll learn about his rocky journey losing his vision at 32 years old and struggling with alcoholism, how to lead belay blind, and hear some surprising stories about run-ins with famous climbers that he doesn’t know because he can’t “watch” climbing content.
Timestamps
Timestamps of discussion topics
0:00 - Intro
1:58 - Mad Rock Shoutout!!
2;27 - Intro/healing from surgery
7:49 - Chaz's impairment and how he started climbing
13:16 - Losing sight later in life
26:16 - Lead belaying blind
36:21 - Visually impaired climbing without a caller
38:07 - First time competition climbing...getting dumped...bro code broken?!
43:25 - Climbing + calling with Alannah Yip
46:37 - Accidental run-ins with the most famous comp climbers
52:38 - Lack of accessibility with climbing content
57:17 - Feeling unsafe on the wall
1:03:24 - Hiding his disability
1:07:37 - 2028 Paralympics
1:14:54 - Climbing blindfolded
1:18:02 - Me complaining about outdoor climbing + why he loves outdoor climbing
1:23:42 - Playing blind hockey
1:25:59 - More of me complaining about outdoor climbing + what is real climbing
1:28:57 - Blind ice climbing
1:31:12 - Being an inspiration for his son
1:33:47 - Blind hockey show and tell
1:41:46 - IG Q: How long does it take to get in sync with your caller?
1:42:54 - IG Q: Does speed climbing work well for blind people?
1:49:26 - DISCORD Q: Would paraclimbers want to compete in bouldering?
1:55:25 - Words of wisdom + where to find Chaz
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WEBVTT
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Boy meets girl, girl's a rock climber, says,
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if you want to date me, you better learn how
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to rock climb. Had almost hit a few people on
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bicycles and I was like really in denial on the
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fact of like how little I couldn't see. Great,
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now my kids are never going to look up to me.
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I'm just going to be this blind guy who can't
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do anything. And, you know, my kids are never
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going to think I'm a superhero or nothing. I
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like finished the climb. I come down, I look
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at Katie. I'm like, what the hell was Rachel's
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problem? Like, what was so serious? She's like,
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well, you basically just told Jakob Schubert
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to fuck off. There's no money in it. So someone
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has to kind of take the loss to build the space
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for us. So I think we're all very appreciative
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of the people that do this for us. Welcome to
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another episode of the That's Not Real Climbing
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podcast. I'm your host, Jinni, and I'm excited
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to introduce my guest for today, Chaz Misuraca.
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Chaz is a blind para climber from Team Canada
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and is in the B3 category, meaning he has about
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10 % of his sight left. What's crazy is that
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he didn't start climbing until after he lost
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his vision. In this episode, we'll learn about
00:01:10.769 --> 00:01:13.629
his rocky journey, losing his vision at 32 years
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old and struggling with alcoholism, how to lead
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belay blind, and we'll hear some stories about
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run -ins with famous climbers that he doesn't
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know because he can't watch climbing content.
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There are so many things I have never considered
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about visual impairments when it comes to climbing,
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so I hope you enjoy this episode with Chaz. Real
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quick, I'm excited to announce my new sponsor
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helping make this podcast episode possible, Mad
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Rock Climbing. I got fitted with their brand
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new line of high -performance shoes, the D2 .1s.
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They just came out December 6th, but you might
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notice a few of your favorite gomp climbers are
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already wearing them, like Oscar Beaudrin from
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Team Canada, and also me. This is the first time
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I've gotten to wear their shoes for an extended
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period of time, and I'm actually super impressed
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with the grip of their in -house rubber. And
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of course, the famous drone heel that everyone
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says is the cheat code to heel hooking small
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edges. Feel free to message me if you have any
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questions about the shoes or sizing, and you
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can use the discount code NOTREALCLIMBER for
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10 % off your entire MedRock order. Info will
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be in the description. Back to the show. In general,
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how was your day today? You said you're like
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in a training stint right now. i am yeah um i
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actually just got home from the gym i actually
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was just skiing for the last two days so oh body's
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kind of sore from that but aside from that everything's
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going well yeah so like climbing training yeah
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well i've also had two surgeries in the last
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you know 10 months i think so i'm still doing
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a bunch of physio for that which is pretty annoying
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um i had hip surgery and a shoulder surgery but
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i'm in the midst of just doing the full Body
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exercise. And then I'm going to the climbing
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gym this afternoon. Afternoon chatting with you.
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Did you get like injured? Is that why you need
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surgery? Yeah, I don't know about my hip. I've
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had a hip pain for since like before high school
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type of thing. And then I tore my labrum, some
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rotator cuff stuff in my shoulder climbing a
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few years ago. Never got it looked at. And then
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once I started competitively climbing. I decided
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I needed to actually go to the doctor. For the
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last, like, two years, I couldn't do a pull -up.
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Oh, wow. Which you can't really climb super hard
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when you can't. I mean, it made me a better climber,
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actually, because beforehand I would just muscle
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through things. So I had to be more technical.
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So I'm really looking forward to how my climbing
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will be once I'm fully healed. which will be
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a while still like they end up having to remove
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part of my bicep tendon like three centimeters
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of it and reattach it um and fix a tear in my
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labrum but yeah once i got that looked at they
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found all these injuries i was like maybe i should
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get my hip looked at because it's hurting worse
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a lot of days and then i'd get like some bone
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spurs ground off my femur so yeah i was a bit
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of a mess for a while i'm back to climbing now
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um i technically i'm not supposed to be climbing
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yet i haven't really been cleared by a doctor
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but i'm just listening to my body and climbing
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at the best of my ability without uh overdoing
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things yeah better to be able to climb in the
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future rather than get a little bit of training
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in now yeah same as like when i was skiing the
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last two days i'm like in the back of my head
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worried about falling and then setting myself
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back so luckily everything went well and body's
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feeling pretty good i mean i was pretty stiff
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this morning but um after the workout this morning
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i'm feeling pretty good yeah and so like what
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does climbing training look like for you right
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now it's uh mostly just working with my collar
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quite frequently and getting that down and just
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i mean it started off i'm gradually increasing
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it At first I was like, I'm not going to climb
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anything over 5 '9", then nothing over 5 '10",
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and then we've just been kind of slowly amping
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it up. Basically just like getting lots of miles
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in right now, it seems, without overdoing it.
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Trying to leave the gym not sore. But we're going
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on a climbing trip next week to Bermuda, so I
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need to be... I didn't know there was climbing
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in Bermuda. Yeah, no one really does. so my friend
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jazz who's been my caller for the last two or
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three comps is born and raised in bermuda and
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you know there's a lot of like i mean i've never
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been there but from what she has told me a lot
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of like really good deep water solo and there's
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i want to say bolted roots but i know they also
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use she calls it knots i think they call maybe
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they literally are no threads they literally
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thread rope through cracks and stuff and you
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clip the rope from what i believe or from what
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i understand apparently it's not sketchy um they
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do replace it i guess sometimes and actually
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another para climber i read this in the guidebook
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they were referring to jim hewing who was a sterling
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ropes engineer and i guess i sent him some rope
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and he did some tests on it and it had been on
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the cliff for like 10 years and it still didn't
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fail like eventually it failed obviously but
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was still very safe to be climbing on even though
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it's it's in the weather it's in the sun it's
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in the salt so that's why they do that because
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like if you use titanium bolts which are expensive
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um so yeah there's not a ton of development that
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has happened there i think it's all been done
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by like one or two people um like jazz has been
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one of the main climbers down there um so yeah
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i'm excited to go check it out but i'm bringing
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a fishing pole with me that way if my arm does
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get sore and such i think it's all like pretty
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stout climbing so that way i'm not forcing myself
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to continue climbing can you like have fun i
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can essentially you're climbing like on the seashore
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the whole time um that's where the cliffs and
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stuff are so yeah it sounds i'm getting sore
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i'll just fish yeah and the water there is beautiful
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from what i've heard and sand is gorgeous so
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It should be a pretty fun time. And before we
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get too much into things, for those who don't
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know you, I guess first, what is your disability
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and then how did you get into climbing and competing?
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So I guess my name is Chas Mazuraka. I am Canadian
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and I'm a blind rock climber. So being blind
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is my disability. I have about five to 10 % of
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my sight left. Like both eyes are a little different.
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I have a hereditary disease called LHON, which
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stands for Leber's Hereditary Optic Neuropathy.
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I was 32 years old when I lost 90 % of my vision.
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I'm now 38. So like six years ago, we'll say.
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The way it worked is February of 2018, I started
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losing sight in my left eye. And by the summertime,
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I quit driving and my right eye had basically
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caught up. My left eye is a little worse. Like
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I classify as a B2. So I essentially explain
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in international blind sports, there's three
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different categories. B1 is zero vision. B2 is
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5 % or less. And B3 is 10 % or less. I guess
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that's another thing a lot of people probably
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wouldn't know. I know I did not until I lost
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my vision, is that most people that are blind,
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I think it's like 8 % of people who identify
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as being blind have zero vision. Like there's
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very few B1s. A lot of people, vision loss is
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a huge spectrum. I have no central vision. There's
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people who have central vision. It's like they
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look through straws type of thing and have even
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less vision than I do, but yet they can see and
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read something, you know, like 20 -20 vision,
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but only through little holes. Where mine is
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basically just really blurry. I can see out of
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my periphery, which is, you know, not just left
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and right, like up and down as well. Essentially
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there's like a void in the center of it. And
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my brain's just kind of learned to adapt. I kind
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of like look around things, my eyes shuffle a
00:10:14.509 --> 00:10:19.230
bit. And I've never seen it in clearly. Like
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even if I stick my hand out, like I can see my
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hand is here, but I can't actually see like my
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individual fingers on it, but I can tell as a
00:10:27.730 --> 00:10:30.950
whole it's there. And maybe imagine being in
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a swimming pool with no goggles on and opening
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your eyes, you can see. stuff that's in the pool
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if you're close enough to it but you can't actually
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see anything clearly if that makes any sense
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you try it next time you're in a pool or the
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ocean I hate opening my eyes in a pool yeah it
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hurts it uh so yeah so I didn't know my family
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carried this and after they finally found because
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it's such a rare disease seven people a year
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in Canada get diagnosed with it so it took I
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mean, man, I started seeing doctors in February.
00:11:07.309 --> 00:11:11.389
I wasn't diagnosed with it until December. So
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almost a year just because, and even when I was
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diagnosed, the doctor knew so little about it.
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She like had told me some false information,
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actually really, really devastating information
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in the sense of I have two sons and she had told
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me that they were both going to go blind, which,
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which isn't true. So like I lived with that for
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like a month or two. I remember I was pretty
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like rattled about that. Cause it was like, who
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tells someone that unless you're like absolutely
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certain. Yeah. That's weird. Yeah. I, and actually
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it's kind of funny. She's a rock climber and
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actually climbs at the gym. One of the gyms I
00:11:49.299 --> 00:11:52.419
train at. Oh, interesting. I haven't crossed
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paths with her yet. I was telling this story
00:11:54.139 --> 00:11:57.460
to someone and I said her name and she was like,
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Oh wow. Like she climbs here. I won't say her
00:11:59.879 --> 00:12:01.960
name, but one of these days I'm going to tell
00:12:01.960 --> 00:12:05.500
her that she, she misinformed me. So she doesn't
00:12:05.500 --> 00:12:08.320
know that that's not true still? I'm not too
00:12:08.320 --> 00:12:11.139
sure. I haven't asked her. Hopefully she's learned.
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But I mean, if she's never been told, that's
00:12:13.840 --> 00:12:16.840
false. So how do you find out that that's not
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true? I got moved on to another specialist. I
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had to see a neuro -ophthalmologist, which she
00:12:25.019 --> 00:12:30.200
is, to get my diagnosis. And then there's one
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doctor in Canada who's part of a research team.
00:12:32.879 --> 00:12:36.639
um out of like ucla in italy like they have they
00:12:36.639 --> 00:12:40.000
work out of america and italy some specialists
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researching this and the one i see in ottawa
00:12:44.159 --> 00:12:48.539
and he knows pretty well the most about this
00:12:48.539 --> 00:12:51.360
disease out of like three people in the world
00:12:51.360 --> 00:12:55.279
so he then informed me that that is not true
00:12:55.279 --> 00:13:00.740
um like on a biological level it's passed on
00:13:00.740 --> 00:13:05.370
through like the x chromosome And I don't have
00:13:05.370 --> 00:13:09.009
that or produce that, I suppose. It's been a
00:13:09.009 --> 00:13:10.269
while since it's been explained to me, but you
00:13:10.269 --> 00:13:14.029
know, in the making of a baby, I do not pass
00:13:14.029 --> 00:13:17.929
on the X chromosome. So yeah. You lost your sight
00:13:17.929 --> 00:13:20.970
pretty late in life. Do you remember a lot of
00:13:20.970 --> 00:13:23.850
like, what was life like before versus after
00:13:23.850 --> 00:13:25.789
losing your vision? And in terms of like how
00:13:25.789 --> 00:13:28.169
you felt during that transition process? Yeah,
00:13:28.190 --> 00:13:32.139
it was way different. So I'm, a licensed diesel
00:13:32.139 --> 00:13:35.480
mechanic and I had just like a pretty basic normal
00:13:35.480 --> 00:13:37.519
life we'll call it you know I grew up in a small
00:13:37.519 --> 00:13:40.539
town and just yeah I just worked all the time
00:13:40.539 --> 00:13:43.620
was in like this echo chamber a journalist wrote
00:13:43.620 --> 00:13:45.720
like an article about me and titled that I had
00:13:45.720 --> 00:13:48.879
to go blind in order to see like I asked him
00:13:48.879 --> 00:13:51.000
where he came up with that title and he's like
00:13:51.000 --> 00:13:52.259
well you said that to me when I was interviewing
00:13:52.259 --> 00:13:56.980
you and it kind of makes sense because I didn't
00:13:57.580 --> 00:13:59.279
I wasn't exposed to, I guess, a lot of things.
00:13:59.360 --> 00:14:02.100
I lived literally in this little community, in
00:14:02.100 --> 00:14:04.779
my little echo chamber of like -minded humans,
00:14:04.980 --> 00:14:09.039
we'll say. And I never met a blind person before,
00:14:09.299 --> 00:14:11.279
never met anyone else with other disabilities.
00:14:11.960 --> 00:14:15.120
It's not that I avoided people. I just was never
00:14:15.120 --> 00:14:19.500
in crowds or scenarios where we were crossing
00:14:19.500 --> 00:14:25.720
paths. And yeah, my whole life literally changed.
00:14:26.889 --> 00:14:29.210
Was always kind of like seeking, making more
00:14:29.210 --> 00:14:32.470
money and having a better title at work and things
00:14:32.470 --> 00:14:34.330
like that. And then my whole life just kind of
00:14:34.330 --> 00:14:37.830
like imploded on itself. It's actually, you asked
00:14:37.830 --> 00:14:39.470
me, I didn't answer. How did I get into rock
00:14:39.470 --> 00:14:43.190
climbing? Yeah. It's kind of like a classic tale
00:14:43.190 --> 00:14:46.610
of boy meets girl. Girl's a rock climber says,
00:14:46.889 --> 00:14:48.889
if you want to date me, you better learn how
00:14:48.889 --> 00:14:52.090
to rock climb. Oh, really? Yeah. So I was like
00:14:52.090 --> 00:14:55.070
working at a shop. And my ex -girlfriend had
00:14:55.070 --> 00:14:57.909
came there to get a heater installed in her van
00:14:57.909 --> 00:15:01.450
she was building out to then move into and work
00:15:01.450 --> 00:15:06.710
and live out of. And during that, me working
00:15:06.710 --> 00:15:08.850
on her van, she had told me this whole like dream
00:15:08.850 --> 00:15:12.029
of traveling around, climbing, working. I'd never
00:15:12.029 --> 00:15:14.230
met any rock climbers before. I kind of thought
00:15:14.230 --> 00:15:17.470
it was just like far -fetched. Only crazy people
00:15:17.470 --> 00:15:21.309
do that and didn't really understand anything
00:15:21.309 --> 00:15:25.399
about climbing. And, you know, she was, like,
00:15:25.419 --> 00:15:26.759
very passionate about it, explained it all to
00:15:26.759 --> 00:15:33.340
me. And then we, I guess, started dating. It's
00:15:33.340 --> 00:15:35.320
kind of, like, a weird... At the end of the day,
00:15:35.340 --> 00:15:36.779
I had, like, given her my phone number because
00:15:36.779 --> 00:15:39.039
I thought we had this really good connection.
00:15:39.320 --> 00:15:42.860
And I even, like, asked her, like, out for dinner
00:15:42.860 --> 00:15:48.679
that night. And she said no. And then I... I
00:15:48.679 --> 00:15:50.080
had a broken ankle at the time. So I was like
00:15:50.080 --> 00:15:52.259
rolling around the shop in an office chair. My
00:15:52.259 --> 00:15:55.240
goodness. And she then, I was supposed to have
00:15:55.240 --> 00:15:57.279
surgery on the Monday because it's on a Friday.
00:15:57.980 --> 00:16:00.179
And she had then like messaged me to see how
00:16:00.179 --> 00:16:03.519
my surgery went. And then from there, we started
00:16:03.519 --> 00:16:04.919
chatting. And then like a couple weeks later,
00:16:05.019 --> 00:16:08.820
she came down to visit me. And we started dating.
00:16:08.899 --> 00:16:10.519
And I was already blind in one eye at this point.
00:16:10.940 --> 00:16:13.919
Just one eye though? Yeah. Because this was in
00:16:13.919 --> 00:16:18.450
like late June, early July. And I was still getting
00:16:18.450 --> 00:16:20.549
passed around from like doctor to doctor trying
00:16:20.549 --> 00:16:23.750
to figure out why I couldn't see. I was still
00:16:23.750 --> 00:16:26.429
in the mindset of like, oh, like it's just something.
00:16:27.090 --> 00:16:29.470
At first I thought I just scratched my eye at
00:16:29.470 --> 00:16:33.750
work. Like I've had to get things drilled out
00:16:33.750 --> 00:16:36.370
of my eye before, like rust rings, like getting
00:16:36.370 --> 00:16:39.610
steel in my eye at work. Oh my gosh. Right. So
00:16:39.610 --> 00:16:41.590
I just thought it was just a workplace hazard
00:16:41.590 --> 00:16:46.620
and was like, oh, it eventually goes away. was
00:16:46.620 --> 00:16:49.799
really optimistic that everything would just
00:16:49.799 --> 00:16:55.440
work out and then yeah her and I started dating
00:16:55.440 --> 00:16:57.340
and because I had a broken ankle she was like
00:16:57.340 --> 00:16:59.259
you know I'm gonna cut you some slack on the
00:16:59.259 --> 00:17:03.059
climbing but once you heal if if we're ever going
00:17:03.059 --> 00:17:05.079
to work out you need to rock climb because that's
00:17:05.079 --> 00:17:08.500
all I like to do and so I was like yeah yeah
00:17:08.500 --> 00:17:11.079
it's fine like I can get into this rock climbing
00:17:11.079 --> 00:17:13.880
thing maybe like a few weeks later I then like
00:17:13.880 --> 00:17:18.119
went to go to work one morning And I, like, looked
00:17:18.119 --> 00:17:20.779
left and right when I went to pull out onto the
00:17:20.779 --> 00:17:23.079
road. And, like, I couldn't see. And I was, like,
00:17:23.079 --> 00:17:25.619
rubbing my eyes. And I was, like, holy shit.
00:17:25.720 --> 00:17:28.079
Like, I had then, like, prior to that in the
00:17:28.079 --> 00:17:30.539
last, like, week had almost hit a few people
00:17:30.539 --> 00:17:33.400
on bicycles. Oh, my gosh. And I was, like, really
00:17:33.400 --> 00:17:35.140
in denial on the fact of, like, how little I
00:17:35.140 --> 00:17:38.799
couldn't see. And I kind of, like, broke down,
00:17:38.940 --> 00:17:41.920
started crying and stuff. And I called my work
00:17:41.920 --> 00:17:45.420
and told them. And they were, like, yeah, like.
00:17:45.930 --> 00:17:48.809
We've noticed that everyone around me could tell
00:17:48.809 --> 00:17:51.150
I couldn't see very well. Oh, man. Even though
00:17:51.150 --> 00:17:55.089
I just sort of didn't want to think about that,
00:17:55.150 --> 00:17:58.990
I suppose. Yeah, that's scary. Mm -hmm. But then,
00:17:59.190 --> 00:18:01.109
yeah, at that point, I was still, like, months
00:18:01.109 --> 00:18:04.470
away from seeing a neuro -ophthalmologist. And
00:18:04.470 --> 00:18:08.710
then, yeah, her and I moved, like, up north.
00:18:08.769 --> 00:18:13.089
I then did a lot of drinking and avoiding the
00:18:13.089 --> 00:18:17.799
fact of what was happening to me. And kind of
00:18:17.799 --> 00:18:19.359
went to like a bit of a dark place for a while.
00:18:19.420 --> 00:18:22.480
But then during that time also like helped build
00:18:22.480 --> 00:18:26.440
out this van. I then got into a clinical trial.
00:18:27.140 --> 00:18:30.920
Actually, I should back up a bit. I then was
00:18:30.920 --> 00:18:36.140
told I probably had LHON. And then my sister
00:18:36.140 --> 00:18:42.079
had found an LHON Canada group that was meeting
00:18:42.079 --> 00:18:45.819
in Ottawa in a couple of weeks. I was just like,
00:18:45.819 --> 00:18:48.140
oh, I don't want to go to that. Whatever. And
00:18:48.140 --> 00:18:50.819
Tara was like, well, I wanted to take you rock
00:18:50.819 --> 00:18:53.599
climbing in Gatineau for the first time. So my
00:18:53.599 --> 00:18:56.559
ankle was starting to heal. And Gatineau was
00:18:56.559 --> 00:18:58.039
like just on the other side of the bridge from
00:18:58.039 --> 00:19:01.380
Ottawa. So she kind of like lied to me a bit
00:19:01.380 --> 00:19:04.259
in the sense of like, we're going there anyways.
00:19:04.720 --> 00:19:07.559
We might as well stop in Ottawa. And if this
00:19:07.559 --> 00:19:10.660
meeting sucks, then we can just leave. So my
00:19:10.660 --> 00:19:12.319
sister and her were on my case about it. And
00:19:12.319 --> 00:19:15.589
then I finally agreed to that. And I walked in,
00:19:15.710 --> 00:19:20.289
never have met a blind person before. It was
00:19:20.289 --> 00:19:23.450
pretty sad. I thought very low of myself because
00:19:23.450 --> 00:19:25.990
I'd only ever seen a blind person in a movie.
00:19:26.069 --> 00:19:29.170
And it's either one of two things. You're either
00:19:29.170 --> 00:19:34.250
this crazy superhero or you're this very feeble,
00:19:34.349 --> 00:19:39.069
inactive, can't do anything type of thing. And
00:19:39.069 --> 00:19:40.509
I kind of thought that's what my life is going
00:19:40.509 --> 00:19:44.930
to be. And then I go there, and this first man
00:19:44.930 --> 00:19:47.769
I meet is all happy and walks up to me, and he's
00:19:47.769 --> 00:19:49.809
like, hey, man, do you play hockey? I was like,
00:19:49.869 --> 00:19:52.470
well, I used to. I can't anymore. He's like,
00:19:52.509 --> 00:19:53.529
well, just because your eyes don't work doesn't
00:19:53.529 --> 00:19:55.569
mean your legs stop working. And I thought he
00:19:55.569 --> 00:19:57.329
was sighted. I was like, this guy's a prick.
00:19:57.509 --> 00:20:00.170
Get him away from me. And then a bit later, he
00:20:00.170 --> 00:20:02.690
was on stage giving a speech, talked about how
00:20:02.690 --> 00:20:04.789
he rollerbladed across Canada and how he plays
00:20:04.789 --> 00:20:07.849
for Team Canada in hockey. And I looked at her,
00:20:07.890 --> 00:20:08.869
and I was like, well, that sounds like that prick
00:20:08.869 --> 00:20:11.390
I was talking to. She's like, well, that is him.
00:20:11.880 --> 00:20:13.279
I said, well, I need to talk to him again. Like,
00:20:13.279 --> 00:20:16.440
how is he walking around here so freely and he's
00:20:16.440 --> 00:20:18.319
all happy? Like who could be happy with their
00:20:18.319 --> 00:20:20.319
vision like this? And like everyone here sees
00:20:20.319 --> 00:20:24.259
the same, like kind of. And then I get talking
00:20:24.259 --> 00:20:34.259
to Mark DeMontis, this is his name. Sorry. He
00:20:34.259 --> 00:20:38.759
like very positively impacted my life. Yeah.
00:20:40.839 --> 00:20:42.740
He invited me to come to a blind hockey game,
00:20:42.920 --> 00:20:45.640
which I was like, that's going to be a joke.
00:20:46.220 --> 00:20:47.720
A bunch of blind players are going to be skating
00:20:47.720 --> 00:20:52.119
into one another. And he was right, just because
00:20:52.119 --> 00:20:53.880
your eyes don't work doesn't mean your legs stop
00:20:53.880 --> 00:20:56.619
working. Because everyone's ripping around the
00:20:56.619 --> 00:21:00.319
rink. They've all learned how to listen to the
00:21:00.319 --> 00:21:03.619
puck and to each other and communicate. And there
00:21:03.619 --> 00:21:05.359
really isn't any collisions. I mean, it does
00:21:05.359 --> 00:21:07.680
happen, but it even happens in sighted hockey.
00:21:10.340 --> 00:21:13.440
And, and yeah, then like, I never rock climbed
00:21:13.440 --> 00:21:18.500
before my sight loss. So I went to Gatineau and
00:21:18.500 --> 00:21:22.180
climbed outdoors there and it was absolutely
00:21:22.180 --> 00:21:27.980
amazing. Yeah. Like, because I didn't climb before,
00:21:28.180 --> 00:21:33.119
I couldn't relate to how hard it was compared
00:21:33.119 --> 00:21:36.500
to when I could do it. Like, for example, like
00:21:36.500 --> 00:21:41.259
everything else. I would take for granted like
00:21:41.259 --> 00:21:44.299
things like brushing my teeth. Yeah. You don't
00:21:44.299 --> 00:21:46.960
think about like putting toothpaste on the toothbrush.
00:21:49.160 --> 00:21:50.799
So it's been a while since I've thought of some
00:21:50.799 --> 00:21:53.740
of these things. No. Okay. Yeah. Take as much
00:21:53.740 --> 00:21:57.299
time as you need. And definitely like how far
00:21:57.299 --> 00:21:59.900
you've come since then. Yeah. It's crazy actually.
00:22:00.460 --> 00:22:03.420
Cause I was like Savick this all the time. Oh
00:22:03.420 --> 00:22:09.259
wow. Yeah. And it was really hard on myself.
00:22:09.740 --> 00:22:11.740
I'd be like, I can't even put toothpaste on my
00:22:11.740 --> 00:22:15.559
toothbrush. How pathetic am I? And again, I meet
00:22:15.559 --> 00:22:18.299
a buddy of mine at hockey and I'm like, why didn't
00:22:18.299 --> 00:22:20.759
you come up with this? I'll never forget. Joey's
00:22:20.759 --> 00:22:23.259
like, bro, just squirt it in your mouth. And
00:22:23.259 --> 00:22:27.000
I was like, oh wow. Yeah. Like brilliant. Is
00:22:27.000 --> 00:22:29.299
that how you do it now? Yeah. And now I don't
00:22:29.299 --> 00:22:31.680
cry when I brush my teeth. I just squirt it in
00:22:31.680 --> 00:22:36.710
my mouth and it's like so easy. But anyways,
00:22:37.009 --> 00:22:41.170
I, you know, rock climbing, I couldn't compare
00:22:41.170 --> 00:22:45.210
how hard it had gotten with sight loss because
00:22:45.210 --> 00:22:47.289
I didn't do it before. Everything else I had
00:22:47.289 --> 00:22:50.569
to pretty well relearn. And climbing, you know,
00:22:50.589 --> 00:22:55.029
got me out in nature. I had to like try hard,
00:22:55.250 --> 00:22:59.269
climb these like epic things. And yeah, it was
00:22:59.269 --> 00:23:01.289
just quiet. I had to be like a lure in my thoughts
00:23:01.289 --> 00:23:03.630
or like essentially like remove the thoughts
00:23:03.630 --> 00:23:07.359
that quieted my mind. Um, I was just like in
00:23:07.359 --> 00:23:10.019
the moment trying to figure out where the next
00:23:10.019 --> 00:23:14.019
hold is. How do I move here? Um, so it was very
00:23:14.019 --> 00:23:17.420
calming. So in a way it was, it was a lot better
00:23:17.420 --> 00:23:20.259
that you didn't get to experience it before going
00:23:20.259 --> 00:23:23.059
blind. Yeah, I believe so because like everything
00:23:23.059 --> 00:23:26.099
else, I probably, I experienced this with a lot
00:23:26.099 --> 00:23:29.980
of new blind people or people that I've met.
00:23:30.119 --> 00:23:32.819
I try to do as much as I can within the blind
00:23:32.819 --> 00:23:36.670
community to get people. into sports and such
00:23:36.670 --> 00:23:42.970
it's been so helpful to me post I lost and you
00:23:42.970 --> 00:23:44.630
know it's the same old thing like people be like
00:23:44.630 --> 00:23:46.309
well like I used to be able to see double black
00:23:46.309 --> 00:23:51.049
diamonds and now I can't do this and I guess
00:23:51.049 --> 00:23:53.750
that's the thing I hate hearing is like I can't
00:23:53.750 --> 00:23:57.250
um I'm like well yeah you can like clearly there's
00:23:57.250 --> 00:23:59.170
going to be a learning curve but you can I mean
00:23:59.170 --> 00:24:00.750
I was just skiing double black diamonds for the
00:24:00.750 --> 00:24:04.339
last two days but like I obviously didn't lose
00:24:04.339 --> 00:24:06.720
my sight first time on the hill ski double black
00:24:06.720 --> 00:24:09.359
diamonds i had to like relearn how to do these
00:24:09.359 --> 00:24:12.660
things i think a lot of people just quit because
00:24:12.660 --> 00:24:14.359
like well i can't do this thing i used to do
00:24:14.359 --> 00:24:17.839
as well as i used to do it but it's just like
00:24:17.839 --> 00:24:19.940
well you can get there if you put the effort
00:24:19.940 --> 00:24:23.220
in um so yeah so with climbing it was the one
00:24:23.220 --> 00:24:25.359
thing i got to do and i did it all the time because
00:24:25.359 --> 00:24:28.500
of this new woman in my life that only wanted
00:24:28.500 --> 00:24:31.839
to rock climb yeah okay and then i got into a
00:24:31.839 --> 00:24:37.210
clinical trial in Colorado for this like a synthetic
00:24:37.210 --> 00:24:41.509
form of vitamin Q10 to help like prevent my sight
00:24:41.509 --> 00:24:44.890
from getting worse um so now I'm in Colorado
00:24:44.890 --> 00:24:47.029
all the time we like finished building the van
00:24:47.029 --> 00:24:50.450
we're down there and then for like the next three
00:24:50.450 --> 00:24:53.450
and a half years while her and I dated I basically
00:24:53.450 --> 00:24:55.869
like just toured around and rock climbed all
00:24:55.869 --> 00:24:58.849
over North America and we went skiing did all
00:24:58.849 --> 00:25:02.049
these things Um, I also like, so I'm an alcoholic
00:25:02.049 --> 00:25:05.069
and I really struggled throughout a lot of time
00:25:05.069 --> 00:25:07.349
with my drinking, even though I was doing these
00:25:07.349 --> 00:25:10.289
awesome things, I'd go on these waves of like
00:25:10.289 --> 00:25:13.049
climbing and being really good. And then as long
00:25:13.049 --> 00:25:16.710
as I would come home or like back into like civilization,
00:25:17.009 --> 00:25:20.170
we'll say, and I'd be reminded of how blind I
00:25:20.170 --> 00:25:22.569
am. It's like when I'm just out hiking down a
00:25:22.569 --> 00:25:26.509
trail, following her, she's, you know, putting
00:25:26.509 --> 00:25:29.759
up these climbs, I'm following them. not really
00:25:29.759 --> 00:25:33.180
thinking about being blind. She never even gave
00:25:33.180 --> 00:25:36.440
me an opportunity to really whine about it. There'd
00:25:36.440 --> 00:25:39.400
be the odd time I'd wake up and I'd be like pretty
00:25:39.400 --> 00:25:40.619
emotional and she'd be like, oh, like what's
00:25:40.619 --> 00:25:42.500
wrong? Like, well, I woke up today and I kind
00:25:42.500 --> 00:25:45.099
of thought I would see and it was all a bad dream.
00:25:45.859 --> 00:25:48.000
And I'd be like, oh, I'm not going to climb today.
00:25:48.099 --> 00:25:50.980
I'm just going to like lay in bed and sulk. And
00:25:50.980 --> 00:25:53.220
because she needed me to belay her, probably
00:25:53.220 --> 00:25:56.150
she'd be like. Well, like, no, that's not an
00:25:56.150 --> 00:25:57.390
option. Like, do you know where you are right
00:25:57.390 --> 00:26:00.009
now? People would like kill to be in the side
00:26:00.009 --> 00:26:01.950
of this mountain that we're on. Like, get your
00:26:01.950 --> 00:26:06.069
ass out of bed and come. And, you know, I would
00:26:06.069 --> 00:26:07.890
resent her in the moments for that, but I can
00:26:07.890 --> 00:26:10.130
look back on that and I'm like super grateful
00:26:10.130 --> 00:26:14.369
that she didn't sit there and let me like, you
00:26:14.369 --> 00:26:18.930
know, put myself down in that moment. I then
00:26:18.930 --> 00:26:24.019
was talking with like Ontario Blind Sports. ontario
00:26:24.019 --> 00:26:26.980
was the province i live in and i was like well
00:26:26.980 --> 00:26:29.240
like i rock climb like where can i rock because
00:26:29.240 --> 00:26:31.059
i could probably i didn't really climb in gyms
00:26:31.059 --> 00:26:35.519
like like ever i got been in a couple maybe just
00:26:35.519 --> 00:26:37.680
randomly if it was like raining somewhere for
00:26:37.680 --> 00:26:40.180
a few days in a row and we kind of wanted to
00:26:40.180 --> 00:26:43.539
keep up climbing and even that's kind of funny
00:26:43.539 --> 00:26:46.440
because like i learned how to lead climb outdoors
00:26:46.440 --> 00:26:50.400
and i would go to gyms even one of the gyms i
00:26:50.910 --> 00:26:53.109
train it quite frequently I became friends with
00:26:53.109 --> 00:26:56.289
the manager there and I'm lead certified there
00:26:56.289 --> 00:26:58.450
and she had asked me she was like well who certified
00:26:58.450 --> 00:27:01.130
you to climb here I was like well you did she's
00:27:01.130 --> 00:27:02.490
like really I was like well like I obviously
00:27:02.490 --> 00:27:04.410
don't like act blind around you I'm like pretending
00:27:04.410 --> 00:27:08.410
I can see the belayer as I'm belaying and I'm
00:27:08.410 --> 00:27:11.490
not like leading on to like you know that a fact
00:27:11.490 --> 00:27:15.230
that I can't see very well um because I can belay
00:27:15.230 --> 00:27:18.670
very safely I just don't look at my climber while
00:27:18.670 --> 00:27:23.400
they're climbing which during tests I do just
00:27:23.400 --> 00:27:26.440
to not... To make it look like you are. Yeah.
00:27:26.440 --> 00:27:28.339
Okay. Same people would be like, well, you can't
00:27:28.339 --> 00:27:30.660
belay if you can't see, but like that is definitely
00:27:30.660 --> 00:27:35.279
not true. Like I feel the rope and such. And
00:27:35.279 --> 00:27:37.539
yeah, like instead of, and especially if I'm
00:27:37.539 --> 00:27:39.359
climbing out the doors, it's really cool because
00:27:39.359 --> 00:27:42.079
I, if it's quiet, you know, like I'm listening
00:27:42.079 --> 00:27:45.400
for the carabiner to be unhooked from the, your
00:27:45.400 --> 00:27:48.859
harness, like here at the... the gate close and
00:27:48.859 --> 00:27:50.799
i'm kind of like envisioning i can like hear
00:27:50.799 --> 00:27:55.019
you like put it through the bolt and yeah like
00:27:55.019 --> 00:27:57.000
i'm essentially like imagining everything that's
00:27:57.000 --> 00:28:00.940
happening up there um and then yeah i'm just
00:28:00.940 --> 00:28:03.500
paying attention to like feeding rope and and
00:28:03.500 --> 00:28:07.200
how much slack is out all by feeling it versus
00:28:07.200 --> 00:28:10.660
you know looking and like how much to give you
00:28:10.660 --> 00:28:12.460
like i just feed your rope and if you're pulling
00:28:12.460 --> 00:28:15.819
i'm just like quickly reacting to it. And if
00:28:15.819 --> 00:28:17.559
I've thrown out, thrown out too much, I then,
00:28:17.619 --> 00:28:19.420
you know, pull it back in. Once I've heard you
00:28:19.420 --> 00:28:23.839
clip the draw, um, like knock on wood. Yeah.
00:28:23.940 --> 00:28:27.380
Like I've never had any accidents and I, I have
00:28:27.380 --> 00:28:31.299
a lot of people that like ask me, like I, one
00:28:31.299 --> 00:28:33.700
of the first big multi pitches I did was like
00:28:33.700 --> 00:28:35.880
this big adventure. It was like a five hour hike
00:28:35.880 --> 00:28:39.160
into the Rocky mountains with this team of people
00:28:39.160 --> 00:28:43.779
from Texas. And like we were in Alberta and i'd
00:28:43.779 --> 00:28:46.140
met these people a day before they invited me
00:28:46.140 --> 00:28:48.720
on to go do this climb i had no idea what it
00:28:48.720 --> 00:28:50.480
was i had no idea i've signed up for this like
00:28:50.480 --> 00:28:54.599
epic adventure and as we're like hiking in the
00:28:54.599 --> 00:28:56.500
one guy's like hey like i'm gonna do all the
00:28:56.500 --> 00:28:58.880
leading he's like don't let my buddy belay me
00:28:58.880 --> 00:29:01.180
and i was like dude like you don't remember i'm
00:29:01.180 --> 00:29:03.079
blind right he's like yeah he's like i watched
00:29:03.079 --> 00:29:04.880
you belay all day yesterday and you're just like
00:29:04.880 --> 00:29:08.039
you're so much better than he is and i was just
00:29:08.039 --> 00:29:11.099
like oh okay like i was just like that's interesting
00:29:11.099 --> 00:29:14.930
that this man doesn't want his you know best
00:29:14.930 --> 00:29:17.609
friend to belay him on this like climb that they
00:29:17.609 --> 00:29:20.630
came to canada to do he wants this random blind
00:29:20.630 --> 00:29:24.910
guy to do it for him yeah well um and yeah and
00:29:24.910 --> 00:29:27.490
even on that climb like i remember you know i
00:29:27.490 --> 00:29:30.509
was only following it but like i had the other
00:29:30.509 --> 00:29:33.029
guy he was like a very strong climber he had
00:29:33.029 --> 00:29:35.190
fallen on one of the pitches and i was like wow
00:29:35.190 --> 00:29:37.869
like little things like this had to happen for
00:29:37.869 --> 00:29:41.890
me to realize i'm not this and blind people aren't
00:29:41.890 --> 00:29:44.650
these people that are portrayed in most movies
00:29:44.650 --> 00:29:47.829
like i am very capable two of the people that
00:29:47.829 --> 00:29:50.450
were on this team of five that were going to
00:29:50.450 --> 00:29:53.670
this climb didn't even make the approach because
00:29:53.670 --> 00:29:56.869
it was so scary to them like i have a benefit
00:29:56.869 --> 00:29:59.390
of not being able to see things that i was supposed
00:29:59.390 --> 00:30:02.789
to be afraid of okay and i remember they pointed
00:30:02.789 --> 00:30:06.589
out where in which direction the climb was we're
00:30:06.589 --> 00:30:09.119
going through the scree field rocks are falling
00:30:09.119 --> 00:30:11.019
and i was just like someone behind me is going
00:30:11.019 --> 00:30:13.640
to kill me with like rocks are you know kicking
00:30:13.640 --> 00:30:15.799
out so i was just like i'm gonna like trek ahead
00:30:15.799 --> 00:30:19.079
and i'll meet you over there and i was like sitting
00:30:19.079 --> 00:30:21.440
there for like two hours i need to walk to like
00:30:21.440 --> 00:30:24.500
waist deep snow at one point oh my gosh it was
00:30:24.500 --> 00:30:26.839
in like june so it was like 30 degrees out but
00:30:26.839 --> 00:30:28.460
and i remember i was just like i stripped down
00:30:28.460 --> 00:30:30.539
i was like sitting on this rock it's like you
00:30:30.539 --> 00:30:33.920
know sunbathing and drying out and eventually
00:30:33.920 --> 00:30:36.720
one of them found me and he was like well like
00:30:36.720 --> 00:30:38.750
how did you get over here And I was like, oh,
00:30:38.789 --> 00:30:41.250
and I just like walked across this rock. And
00:30:41.250 --> 00:30:42.630
he's like, well, if you were to fall, I'm like,
00:30:42.710 --> 00:30:45.029
you would have died. I was like, oh, I'm like,
00:30:45.049 --> 00:30:47.890
I don't know. I'm like, I just, I could see that
00:30:47.890 --> 00:30:49.990
it was like a spire we were climbing. And like,
00:30:50.049 --> 00:30:52.210
once I got close enough to it, I could like see
00:30:52.210 --> 00:30:54.549
it because it was massive. I'm like, I decided
00:30:54.549 --> 00:30:56.329
to come to the base of it. And this is the way
00:30:56.329 --> 00:30:59.849
I found to get here. And then two of the people
00:30:59.849 --> 00:31:03.150
were like, I'm not walking across that. And then
00:31:03.150 --> 00:31:05.109
they bailed. I'm like, you just walk for five
00:31:05.109 --> 00:31:07.980
hours in one way to. get here just to be like,
00:31:08.019 --> 00:31:11.579
I'm too scared to walk across this. But again,
00:31:11.619 --> 00:31:13.240
I had no idea that I should have even been afraid
00:31:13.240 --> 00:31:15.539
of it. I mean, in hindsight, does it scare you
00:31:15.539 --> 00:31:18.160
that you like run into these moments and you
00:31:18.160 --> 00:31:21.000
may or may not know that it's like a life or
00:31:21.000 --> 00:31:24.359
death situation? No, because I'm very careful.
00:31:24.440 --> 00:31:30.319
I feel like I'm careless. There's like a controversial
00:31:30.319 --> 00:31:33.539
man, Jordan Peterson, like or dislike what he
00:31:33.539 --> 00:31:37.200
says. The one thing I do agree with is He's quoted
00:31:37.200 --> 00:31:39.740
saying, like, when kids are doing dangerous things
00:31:39.740 --> 00:31:45.640
carefully, leave them be. Yeah. And I am a kid,
00:31:45.660 --> 00:31:47.759
I suppose. And I'm doing things dangerous, but
00:31:47.759 --> 00:31:51.680
I'm doing them very carefully. And I'm not being
00:31:51.680 --> 00:31:53.380
told, like, oh, be careful and this and that.
00:31:53.519 --> 00:31:57.920
And I'm not psyched out. So I'm just, like, careful.
00:31:58.059 --> 00:32:00.039
And I also use hiking sticks. I feel around with
00:32:00.039 --> 00:32:02.000
them. Oh, okay. Yeah. I guess I should maybe
00:32:02.000 --> 00:32:03.519
say that. I'm not just, like, blindly, like,
00:32:03.539 --> 00:32:06.839
feeling around. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. I learned,
00:32:06.920 --> 00:32:10.759
I really fought using hiking sticks. Cause again,
00:32:10.859 --> 00:32:13.119
I was just like, hiking sticks are for like old
00:32:13.119 --> 00:32:17.299
people with bad knees. And I really struggled
00:32:17.299 --> 00:32:22.799
on approaches. And I remember one day, um, my
00:32:22.799 --> 00:32:25.980
ex girlfriend, I was like on my butt, like scooching
00:32:25.980 --> 00:32:29.400
around and people like walking by us. And it's
00:32:29.400 --> 00:32:30.859
probably like very embarrassing for her. Cause
00:32:30.859 --> 00:32:33.220
like I, the hill I was going down, I'm now like
00:32:33.220 --> 00:32:35.740
leveled out, but I don't know that. And she's
00:32:35.740 --> 00:32:37.059
like, I'm buying you hiking sticks tomorrow.
00:32:37.299 --> 00:32:38.539
And I was like, quit being ridiculous. I'm not
00:32:38.539 --> 00:32:40.619
using hiking sticks. She was like, Chaz, like,
00:32:40.660 --> 00:32:42.660
stop and like, think about yourself right now.
00:32:42.759 --> 00:32:45.259
And I like feeling around, like I'm on flat ground
00:32:45.259 --> 00:32:47.960
and I'm like crawling on my butt. I remember
00:32:47.960 --> 00:32:49.200
I got like a bit of a breakdown. I was like,
00:32:49.279 --> 00:32:51.319
damn, I can't even walk on flat ground. It's
00:32:51.319 --> 00:32:54.359
ridiculous. And then I got hiking sticks and
00:32:54.359 --> 00:32:58.640
my whole life changed. I can like, I mean, I've
00:32:58.640 --> 00:33:00.420
had friends that have, you know, if I've been
00:33:00.420 --> 00:33:02.339
to the crag before, I know how to get there.
00:33:02.960 --> 00:33:05.339
And I'm like ahead of everyone. Like, dude, like
00:33:05.339 --> 00:33:06.700
what took you so long? Like, well, we don't have
00:33:06.700 --> 00:33:08.539
your fancy hiking sticks. We can't, you know,
00:33:08.539 --> 00:33:10.880
get here as quick as you. And it's just like,
00:33:10.920 --> 00:33:13.559
wow, like here I could barely walk. And I get
00:33:13.559 --> 00:33:15.160
these like, you know, two little things in my
00:33:15.160 --> 00:33:18.160
hand. And now I'm just like powering through
00:33:18.160 --> 00:33:21.980
just confidently. And again, like I don't always
00:33:21.980 --> 00:33:24.160
know where I'm going or like what I'm stepping
00:33:24.160 --> 00:33:27.720
on. Maybe not even be on trail sometimes. But
00:33:27.720 --> 00:33:29.599
if I know the general direction, I just kind
00:33:29.599 --> 00:33:34.279
of like haul ass and get there. Okay. I'm getting
00:33:34.279 --> 00:33:36.339
the picture that you were like very stubborn
00:33:36.339 --> 00:33:39.759
in your own relationship and she, uh, she helped
00:33:39.759 --> 00:33:42.720
you through a lot of this. Yeah, she did. She,
00:33:42.799 --> 00:33:45.099
like, I'm very grateful for the time that we
00:33:45.099 --> 00:33:50.059
had together and the things that I was able to,
00:33:50.119 --> 00:33:52.920
I think losing your sight, a lot of people I've
00:33:52.920 --> 00:33:55.220
experienced kind of go like one of two ways that
00:33:55.220 --> 00:33:58.880
feels maybe as with most disabilities, you know,
00:33:58.880 --> 00:34:00.700
it's very easy to go into like a very dark place
00:34:00.700 --> 00:34:04.329
and just like, stay there and you know i would
00:34:04.329 --> 00:34:06.049
have moved back home to my parents house and
00:34:06.049 --> 00:34:09.389
probably just like drank myself to death type
00:34:09.389 --> 00:34:11.989
of thing and felt sorry for myself and oh poor
00:34:11.989 --> 00:34:17.949
me and i never i mean i did have those experiences
00:34:17.949 --> 00:34:20.090
but because i was out doing these awesome things
00:34:20.090 --> 00:34:25.730
and climbing i yeah my whole life just kind of
00:34:25.730 --> 00:34:29.110
like blew up yeah i guess i'm back to the comp
00:34:29.110 --> 00:34:33.119
climbing I then, you know, I started playing
00:34:33.119 --> 00:34:36.460
blind hockey. I then heard about there being
00:34:36.460 --> 00:34:39.679
a Team Canada. So that was a goal of mine. I
00:34:39.679 --> 00:34:41.619
wanted to make the Canadian blind hockey team.
00:34:42.460 --> 00:34:45.320
And I was going to a tournament and then I got
00:34:45.320 --> 00:34:48.800
a phone call. I never actually even asked her,
00:34:48.840 --> 00:34:54.619
but the woman that runs CEC, the Climbing National
00:34:54.619 --> 00:34:59.019
Federation, she had called me. And I remember
00:34:59.019 --> 00:35:03.500
being in Bulk Barn, and it's like a store here
00:35:03.500 --> 00:35:07.519
in Canada. It's like Costco. Yeah, well, better,
00:35:07.679 --> 00:35:11.280
but less. Oh, wow. Okay. You buy bulk food. I
00:35:11.280 --> 00:35:14.320
go there to buy seeds and such that I mix in
00:35:14.320 --> 00:35:18.420
my yogurt. Okay. But anyways, she had called
00:35:18.420 --> 00:35:21.599
me, introduced herself, and I don't even know
00:35:21.599 --> 00:35:24.480
how she got my number. I should ask her that
00:35:24.480 --> 00:35:27.019
sometime. But anyways. She was like, hey, like,
00:35:27.039 --> 00:35:30.260
there's this World Cup coming up in Salt Lake
00:35:30.260 --> 00:35:34.199
City. Would you like to be the first blind or
00:35:34.199 --> 00:35:36.300
visually impaired climber to represent Canada
00:35:36.300 --> 00:35:38.639
at an international climbing event? And I was
00:35:38.639 --> 00:35:41.599
like, yeah, sure. No idea what that even meant.
00:35:42.320 --> 00:35:45.659
And then that's how I, like, started all this
00:35:45.659 --> 00:35:48.639
journey of comp climbing. And I'd never even
00:35:48.639 --> 00:35:51.420
heard of a collar. Like, didn't even know what
00:35:51.420 --> 00:35:54.219
that was, even though, like, friends of mine.
00:35:55.139 --> 00:35:57.000
Would sometimes, I guess, spray beta at me, but
00:35:57.000 --> 00:35:59.340
sometimes wouldn't. Like, I can remember my buddy,
00:35:59.480 --> 00:36:02.179
Matt, who I was talking about. We were, like,
00:36:02.179 --> 00:36:05.559
climbing in Vegas, and I'd come down, and he'd
00:36:05.559 --> 00:36:06.960
be like, dude, like, what are you doing? Like,
00:36:07.000 --> 00:36:08.320
you're holding this little crimp. There's this
00:36:08.320 --> 00:36:10.480
fucking jug beside it. And I'm like, a lot of
00:36:10.480 --> 00:36:13.480
my friends forget I can't see. Okay, yeah. And
00:36:13.480 --> 00:36:16.639
I'm just like, dude, I can't see the big jug
00:36:16.639 --> 00:36:18.739
beside me. Like, you could have told me to move
00:36:18.739 --> 00:36:21.639
my hand over. Yeah. Like, I make a lot of climbs
00:36:21.639 --> 00:36:24.150
harder than they need to be. Going back a little,
00:36:24.250 --> 00:36:26.829
when you are climbing, I guess most of the time
00:36:26.829 --> 00:36:29.889
when you're climbing outside or not climbing
00:36:29.889 --> 00:36:33.230
in a competition format, you are just climbing
00:36:33.230 --> 00:36:36.349
without getting information about the climb or
00:36:36.349 --> 00:36:39.309
without a caller? Yes and no. A lot of times,
00:36:39.329 --> 00:36:43.309
depending where I'm climbing, like in Red Rocks,
00:36:43.309 --> 00:36:46.690
where the rock is red, you have people chalk.
00:36:46.989 --> 00:36:49.150
up their hands so like there's white on the rock
00:36:49.150 --> 00:36:52.230
i can see when i'm close enough to that ah okay
00:36:52.230 --> 00:36:54.969
to tell at least where the general direction
00:36:54.969 --> 00:36:59.570
of where i start feeling will be and i may i
00:36:59.570 --> 00:37:02.269
won't i don't know is that a gaston am i under
00:37:02.269 --> 00:37:06.150
clinging it is sometimes it's even misleading
00:37:06.150 --> 00:37:08.869
because people may touch something and then realize
00:37:08.869 --> 00:37:11.250
oh you need to like bump to something else why
00:37:11.250 --> 00:37:13.090
just touch the first thing if like oh there is
00:37:13.090 --> 00:37:15.659
a hole there i'll use it even though there's
00:37:15.659 --> 00:37:18.860
an even better hold somewhere else. So if I'm
00:37:18.860 --> 00:37:22.199
climbing with someone who knows the route, because
00:37:22.199 --> 00:37:25.440
it's harder to see rock shapes, they can then
00:37:25.440 --> 00:37:29.119
say to me, like, you know, go up further, move
00:37:29.119 --> 00:37:31.860
your hand like this, give me some beta that way.
00:37:32.360 --> 00:37:34.119
But like outdoor calling is a little harder.
00:37:34.539 --> 00:37:37.280
Sometimes people will tick things. So they'll
00:37:37.280 --> 00:37:39.300
be like, hey, when you see this tick mark, when
00:37:39.300 --> 00:37:40.699
you're there, tell me when you have to tick,
00:37:40.719 --> 00:37:43.820
because they maybe can't see me. and then they'll
00:37:43.820 --> 00:37:48.000
maybe explain something to me there um to the
00:37:48.000 --> 00:37:50.159
point of like i've even had people carry like
00:37:50.159 --> 00:37:52.820
charcoal with them if i've been climbing places
00:37:52.820 --> 00:37:55.159
where the rock is very white so like white on
00:37:55.159 --> 00:37:57.900
white and they'll like tick things with like
00:37:57.900 --> 00:38:03.519
a piece of you know campfire um and yeah so it's
00:38:03.519 --> 00:38:08.320
a lot of feeling around um people do call for
00:38:08.320 --> 00:38:11.250
me if they if they can Okay. So then, yeah, going
00:38:11.250 --> 00:38:13.409
back to your, I guess like first competition
00:38:13.409 --> 00:38:17.250
experience, what was that like? It was pretty
00:38:17.250 --> 00:38:19.570
awesome. Cause then, yeah, they'd, I was in like
00:38:19.570 --> 00:38:21.730
a zoom call. They'd asked me to bring a caller
00:38:21.730 --> 00:38:25.610
with me. Like what the hell is a caller? And
00:38:25.610 --> 00:38:28.489
then they explained to me that I can have someone
00:38:28.489 --> 00:38:31.190
there that can help, you know, tell me how to
00:38:31.190 --> 00:38:33.469
grab the holds and like sequence my moves and
00:38:33.469 --> 00:38:36.329
stuff like that. And I was like, Oh, like, well,
00:38:36.389 --> 00:38:38.329
I don't really have anyone to bring. And they're
00:38:38.329 --> 00:38:40.639
like, well, don't you like a climbing partner
00:38:40.639 --> 00:38:46.260
and my girlfriend i just broke up in january
00:38:46.260 --> 00:38:50.519
this is now may and i was like no i'm like i
00:38:50.519 --> 00:38:52.880
don't like my climbing partner was my girlfriend
00:38:52.880 --> 00:38:56.460
i doubt she wants to come okay and call for me
00:38:56.460 --> 00:38:58.719
yeah and then i was like anyone else and it was
00:38:58.719 --> 00:39:00.980
like american and stuff like well like an american
00:39:00.980 --> 00:39:04.719
can come so i'd actually asked it's kind of like
00:39:04.719 --> 00:39:06.849
a crazy part of my life as well as And I asked
00:39:06.849 --> 00:39:08.170
this friend of mine, he was like, you know, one
00:39:08.170 --> 00:39:10.849
of my best friends. And it was like a week or
00:39:10.849 --> 00:39:13.809
two before the event. He had then like started
00:39:13.809 --> 00:39:15.889
dating my girlfriend when we broke up and he
00:39:15.889 --> 00:39:19.030
hadn't told me about it. Whoa. Okay, wait a minute.
00:39:20.269 --> 00:39:25.550
Okay, that's kind of. It turned out to be a really
00:39:25.550 --> 00:39:28.849
good thing. Okay. I didn't, he had sent me this
00:39:28.849 --> 00:39:31.849
big message before him because he was going to
00:39:31.849 --> 00:39:36.340
be my caller. And then he. my friend had told
00:39:36.340 --> 00:39:38.579
him he's like you got to come out and like tell
00:39:38.579 --> 00:39:41.639
chas this enough of you like doing spanish back
00:39:41.639 --> 00:39:45.179
type of thing and he then wrote me this big big
00:39:45.179 --> 00:39:51.280
uh message and i uh i read it i was like devastated
00:39:51.280 --> 00:39:53.420
and like i remember screenshotting it and like
00:39:53.420 --> 00:39:55.440
sending it to like i'm in a 12 -step program
00:39:55.440 --> 00:39:58.699
i got i quit drinking like you know a few days
00:39:58.699 --> 00:40:05.530
after my uh girlfriend left me um Oh, that's
00:40:05.530 --> 00:40:09.269
good, I guess. Yeah, it was. It was really necessary.
00:40:09.889 --> 00:40:11.809
I mean, I'm not trying to, like, bad talk her.
00:40:11.969 --> 00:40:15.849
She had her reasons, and I stand by them. But,
00:40:15.869 --> 00:40:17.329
like, yeah, she, like, left me in a parking lot
00:40:17.329 --> 00:40:21.250
in Las Vegas. Oh, my God. Okay. And, yeah, it
00:40:21.250 --> 00:40:23.610
was, like, awful. But it was very necessary for
00:40:23.610 --> 00:40:26.349
that to happen for me to, I now didn't have someone,
00:40:26.389 --> 00:40:28.969
like, asking me to quit drinking. I was just,
00:40:28.989 --> 00:40:30.670
like, all alone. I kind of came to that conclusion
00:40:30.670 --> 00:40:35.480
on my own. I mean, even my friend who is now,
00:40:35.559 --> 00:40:37.539
they're now married. It's like, I'm proud for
00:40:37.539 --> 00:40:41.559
them. He then took me to get like a PCR COVID
00:40:41.559 --> 00:40:45.280
test. And I remember asking him like, oh, take
00:40:45.280 --> 00:40:47.699
me to the liquor store because I have like another
00:40:47.699 --> 00:40:51.780
two days before my flight home. And he looked
00:40:51.780 --> 00:40:53.119
at me and was like, Chaz, if you could see yourself,
00:40:53.400 --> 00:40:56.400
he's like, you would know that you're not going
00:40:56.400 --> 00:40:58.239
to be allowed to get on an airplane. He's like,
00:40:58.320 --> 00:41:00.199
you look ridiculous right now. Because I've just
00:41:00.199 --> 00:41:02.719
been drinking day in and day out for a few days
00:41:02.719 --> 00:41:05.940
now. And he's like, you should go and eat an
00:41:05.940 --> 00:41:07.820
edible and just pass out for the next day and
00:41:07.820 --> 00:41:12.079
get home and whatever. And then I went back to
00:41:12.079 --> 00:41:14.980
my hotel room. And I still had booze there. And
00:41:14.980 --> 00:41:19.300
I heard what he had said. And I've never drank
00:41:19.300 --> 00:41:24.119
another day in my life. And I never will. So
00:41:24.119 --> 00:41:29.659
I then flew home. And then my friend Matt drove
00:41:29.659 --> 00:41:31.199
me to the airport and he suggested that maybe
00:41:31.199 --> 00:41:36.960
I try going to like a 12 -step program. And then,
00:41:36.960 --> 00:41:41.440
and I did. And yeah, I've been so, like, you
00:41:41.440 --> 00:41:43.260
have to do a lot of work. You don't just join
00:41:43.260 --> 00:41:47.619
a program and magically you now don't have problems
00:41:47.619 --> 00:41:49.039
anymore. Because again, like alcohol wasn't my
00:41:49.039 --> 00:41:52.239
problem. It was what I used as a solution to
00:41:52.239 --> 00:41:53.800
all my problems that I didn't know how to deal
00:41:53.800 --> 00:42:00.340
with. But anyway, so then I screenshot that message
00:42:00.340 --> 00:42:03.599
sent to my sponsor. And he's like, well, you
00:42:03.599 --> 00:42:06.360
need to pray for them to be. And in the message,
00:42:06.440 --> 00:42:08.539
I guess my friend had asked me to forgive him.
00:42:08.619 --> 00:42:10.239
So my sponsor was like, well, you need to forgive
00:42:10.239 --> 00:42:13.179
them and pray for them to be healthy and happy
00:42:13.179 --> 00:42:15.539
and have everything in life that you want. And
00:42:15.539 --> 00:42:17.639
I remember being like, that's not at all what
00:42:17.639 --> 00:42:21.440
I want for them. And he was just like, yeah,
00:42:21.480 --> 00:42:24.360
but again, this man had never. misled me so I
00:42:24.360 --> 00:42:26.719
was like I'm just gonna keep following his guidance
00:42:26.719 --> 00:42:30.960
and and I did pray for that repeatedly and eventually
00:42:30.960 --> 00:42:35.079
I did believe it and I do truthfully I am hoping
00:42:35.079 --> 00:42:38.320
that they are having a grateful wonderful life
00:42:38.320 --> 00:42:41.440
together but then anyways that then takes me
00:42:41.440 --> 00:42:44.820
to I now don't have a caller yeah that was quite
00:42:44.820 --> 00:42:48.260
a roundabout story that was good to know yeah
00:42:48.260 --> 00:42:51.019
I kind of went off topic there I do that a bit
00:42:51.019 --> 00:42:55.590
sometimes but uh It's getting me to where sometimes
00:42:55.590 --> 00:42:59.369
in life I've learned that these awful things
00:42:59.369 --> 00:43:02.409
happen. I'm just like, why me? And afterwards,
00:43:02.730 --> 00:43:04.730
there's a quote I've heard. It's like, life is
00:43:04.730 --> 00:43:07.909
lived forward but understood backwards. And that
00:43:07.909 --> 00:43:11.869
right there is a very important part of my life
00:43:11.869 --> 00:43:14.550
where in the moment I was like, oh, this couldn't
00:43:14.550 --> 00:43:16.469
be any worse. And it turned out to be such a
00:43:16.469 --> 00:43:19.969
great thing because I then am on this Zoom call
00:43:19.969 --> 00:43:22.099
with the Canadian team. I was like, well, can
00:43:22.099 --> 00:43:23.920
one of the other pair of climbers call for me?
00:43:24.000 --> 00:43:25.699
And they're like, no, like they can't see the
00:43:25.699 --> 00:43:28.340
roots and stuff. I was like, it's like, well,
00:43:28.420 --> 00:43:31.559
like I have like a week or two. I don't, how
00:43:31.559 --> 00:43:32.719
am I going to get someone to call for me? And
00:43:32.719 --> 00:43:35.820
then they had also said in the Zoom call that
00:43:35.820 --> 00:43:39.019
we would have access to watch the able -bodied
00:43:39.019 --> 00:43:41.940
climbers compete because they had, because of
00:43:41.940 --> 00:43:43.619
COVID and stuff, they had like back -to -back
00:43:43.619 --> 00:43:47.659
comps, if I remember correctly. So then I was
00:43:47.659 --> 00:43:49.179
like, oh, like, well, can one of the other Canadians
00:43:49.179 --> 00:43:51.000
that are going to be there call for me? keep
00:43:51.000 --> 00:43:52.340
in mind, like, I don't know any of these people.
00:43:52.599 --> 00:43:55.579
Never even heard of them. Cause I don't, I don't
00:43:55.579 --> 00:43:57.519
comp climb. Don't know anything about comp climbing.
00:43:59.019 --> 00:44:02.599
And the one guy who was on the call was like,
00:44:02.639 --> 00:44:04.159
yeah, he's like, I know an athlete who I think
00:44:04.159 --> 00:44:05.760
would be like really interested in this opportunity.
00:44:06.719 --> 00:44:09.400
And then like an hour later, I get like an email
00:44:09.400 --> 00:44:13.420
from someone named Alana Yip. And I was just
00:44:13.420 --> 00:44:16.500
like, oh, cool. Alana Yip, neat. She, this woman
00:44:16.500 --> 00:44:19.239
wants to help call for me. I remember like the
00:44:19.239 --> 00:44:21.670
next day. being in the climbing gym and my phone
00:44:21.670 --> 00:44:23.829
rang it was elena yep because she'd email me
00:44:23.829 --> 00:44:25.409
like here's my number i'm going to call you tomorrow
00:44:25.409 --> 00:44:28.570
remember the manager of the climbing gym could
00:44:28.570 --> 00:44:30.590
read the big font on my phone she's like why
00:44:30.590 --> 00:44:32.329
does elena yep have your phone number i'm like
00:44:32.329 --> 00:44:34.650
who the hell's elena yep because like she's like
00:44:34.650 --> 00:44:38.449
so stoked right and again like i hadn't known
00:44:38.449 --> 00:44:40.409
anything it's like i have a second time i've
00:44:40.409 --> 00:44:42.789
ever heard her name not knowing that she's like
00:44:42.789 --> 00:44:47.219
the most badass rock climber in canada and but
00:44:47.219 --> 00:44:51.239
I was like very ignorant to all of that and then
00:44:51.239 --> 00:44:53.440
yeah like Alana and I then like you know met
00:44:53.440 --> 00:44:56.900
we talked on the phone she was like yeah like
00:44:56.900 --> 00:44:58.420
you know like I think it'd be an awesome opportunity
00:44:58.420 --> 00:45:01.920
to like you know help you and be your caller
00:45:01.920 --> 00:45:05.059
and stuff and then we'd met in Salt Lake City
00:45:05.059 --> 00:45:09.880
like a day or two days before my comp like we
00:45:09.880 --> 00:45:12.639
climbed once together and then next thing you
00:45:12.639 --> 00:45:16.519
know we like jump into a world cup and and yeah
00:45:16.519 --> 00:45:20.820
we like ended up crushing it and uh yeah and
00:45:20.820 --> 00:45:22.780
then like i said that was like the cherry on
00:45:22.780 --> 00:45:26.760
top of the story of my girlfriend and friend
00:45:26.760 --> 00:45:29.860
like getting together and stuff like it was that
00:45:29.860 --> 00:45:33.280
had to happen in order to like lead me to you
00:45:33.280 --> 00:45:35.599
know meet like get to like climb with eleni up
00:45:35.599 --> 00:45:37.539
and have her like literally in my ear while i'm
00:45:37.539 --> 00:45:40.719
rock climbing and yeah like i said i i'm really
00:45:40.719 --> 00:45:45.400
happy for my ex and my friend that they got to
00:45:45.400 --> 00:45:48.599
go their way and stuff and it then allowed me
00:45:48.599 --> 00:45:51.260
to go you know it closed the door for me like
00:45:51.260 --> 00:45:55.380
it's just redirecting me somewhere else um and
00:45:55.380 --> 00:45:58.199
yeah like my life turned like I have a great
00:45:58.199 --> 00:46:00.360
life now and I get to do a lot of like awesome
00:46:00.360 --> 00:46:04.039
things like I ended up winning we got silver
00:46:04.039 --> 00:46:07.099
medal in that competition um oh nice yeah congrats
00:46:07.099 --> 00:46:11.019
yeah I was sick and then yeah like since then
00:46:11.019 --> 00:46:13.840
I've got to do like a ton of climbing like all
00:46:13.840 --> 00:46:16.199
over in Europe and stuff like that as well. I've
00:46:16.199 --> 00:46:18.119
went to a couple of world cups there, world championships.
00:46:19.480 --> 00:46:21.440
Um, you know, I get to like hang out with like,
00:46:21.559 --> 00:46:24.460
you know, literally the best female log climber
00:46:24.460 --> 00:46:28.460
in Canada. Um, where like I, my, my path never
00:46:28.460 --> 00:46:31.539
would have crossed hers if it wasn't for that
00:46:31.539 --> 00:46:33.659
happening type of thing. It's really interesting
00:46:33.659 --> 00:46:36.760
that you like thinking about you not knowing,
00:46:36.800 --> 00:46:40.519
like being active in competition climbing and
00:46:40.519 --> 00:46:43.619
not really knowing any of like the other competition
00:46:43.619 --> 00:46:47.659
climbers um is there like a is there like a big
00:46:47.659 --> 00:46:52.179
name that you just didn't know of like what's
00:46:52.179 --> 00:46:54.099
the biggest name that you feel like you had no
00:46:54.099 --> 00:46:56.849
idea about Please excuse this brief intermission,
00:46:56.929 --> 00:46:59.130
but if you're interested in deleted scenes from
00:46:59.130 --> 00:47:01.190
this episode where we talk about run -ins with
00:47:01.190 --> 00:47:04.030
famous pro climbers and what good versus bad
00:47:04.030 --> 00:47:06.829
calling sounds like, do consider helping support
00:47:06.829 --> 00:47:09.690
this podcast on Patreon. Some other perks include
00:47:09.690 --> 00:47:12.090
a membership pin shipped to you after two months,
00:47:12.289 --> 00:47:14.809
prioritize guest questions or the ability to
00:47:14.809 --> 00:47:17.829
submit video questions, and more to come. The
00:47:17.829 --> 00:47:20.070
proceeds go back into the podcast to help me
00:47:20.070 --> 00:47:23.389
break even, and they help me improve the experience
00:47:23.389 --> 00:47:27.039
of the guest. If you'd like to help out non -monetarily,
00:47:27.079 --> 00:47:29.900
liking, commenting, and sharing helps a great
00:47:29.900 --> 00:47:33.800
deal as well. Back to the show. Well, I'll tell
00:47:33.800 --> 00:47:40.940
you a story. In Bern, Switzerland, I was there.
00:47:40.940 --> 00:47:42.599
And again, I had to have these crazy moments.
00:47:42.659 --> 00:47:46.760
So the men's lead world championship was happening.
00:47:47.420 --> 00:47:51.329
So I go in this big arena. and i can't see so
00:47:51.329 --> 00:47:54.590
that i'm like asking the security guard hey i'm
00:47:54.590 --> 00:47:56.849
blind can i go and stand like down there with
00:47:56.849 --> 00:47:59.389
like the photographers and stuff so i can try
00:47:59.389 --> 00:48:02.190
to get closer and i'm standing on there like
00:48:02.190 --> 00:48:03.530
i run into a friend of mine she gives me one
00:48:03.530 --> 00:48:05.349
of her cameras i have this like huge telephoto
00:48:05.349 --> 00:48:08.789
lens i'm trying to zoom in and the crowd's going
00:48:08.789 --> 00:48:11.349
crazy and like i'm zooming in but i can still
00:48:11.349 --> 00:48:13.550
just see like this blur i can now like tell where
00:48:13.550 --> 00:48:15.889
this body is but like i have no idea what he's
00:48:15.889 --> 00:48:19.150
grabbing what he's doing and i remember like
00:48:19.469 --> 00:48:20.909
The crowd's going nuts. I remember being like,
00:48:20.969 --> 00:48:22.690
fuck, like, I wish I could see what was going
00:48:22.690 --> 00:48:25.329
on up there. And then all of a sudden this like
00:48:25.329 --> 00:48:26.829
voice in my head came in and was like, Chaz,
00:48:26.849 --> 00:48:28.469
if you could see, you wouldn't be here right
00:48:28.469 --> 00:48:30.469
now. I was like, I wouldn't be standing here.
00:48:30.650 --> 00:48:33.869
I wouldn't even be a rock climber. I wouldn't
00:48:33.869 --> 00:48:35.989
be in Switzerland at the world championships.
00:48:36.329 --> 00:48:38.989
And all of a sudden I was just okay with not
00:48:38.989 --> 00:48:43.210
being able to see. And who this was, was Jakob
00:48:43.210 --> 00:48:45.809
Schubert, who I'd never heard of before. Cause
00:48:45.809 --> 00:48:48.289
again, unless I've been somewhere with Atlanta.
00:48:49.050 --> 00:48:50.730
And she's like, introduce me to someone. Cause
00:48:50.730 --> 00:48:53.230
again, like I don't look up things on internet,
00:48:53.289 --> 00:48:55.010
on the internet. And like, I'm not reading magazines.
00:48:55.269 --> 00:48:58.289
So I think that's also really cool because I
00:48:58.289 --> 00:49:01.309
meet these people who it's just like, oh, this
00:49:01.309 --> 00:49:02.650
is so -and -so. And I'm like, oh, hey. And I
00:49:02.650 --> 00:49:05.909
just talk to them like some other climber and
00:49:05.909 --> 00:49:09.150
I'm not fanboying over them. And I feel like
00:49:09.150 --> 00:49:11.530
they get to have like a regular interaction with
00:49:11.530 --> 00:49:13.849
me that I feel a lot of people that are in the
00:49:13.849 --> 00:49:18.969
spotlight don't get to have that often. So again,
00:49:18.989 --> 00:49:21.110
like being blind is another, there's a lot of
00:49:21.110 --> 00:49:23.809
benefits to it. I mean, in a roundabout way.
00:49:25.690 --> 00:49:30.150
But so then the next day I'm in the gym. I remember
00:49:30.150 --> 00:49:32.329
my friend Katie's blinding me. There was like
00:49:32.329 --> 00:49:35.349
this cool like outdoor pillar at this gym. Like
00:49:35.349 --> 00:49:38.449
this outdoor climbing wall. And I'm like cruxing
00:49:38.449 --> 00:49:41.809
out hard. And my friend Rachel, who's a para
00:49:41.809 --> 00:49:43.409
climber, comes over and she's like yelling at
00:49:43.409 --> 00:49:45.250
me. She's like, come down. I want you to meet
00:49:45.250 --> 00:49:48.289
someone. And I'm like. can you shut up? Like
00:49:48.289 --> 00:49:49.489
I'm trying to climb. She's like, no, like stop,
00:49:49.610 --> 00:49:51.030
come down. I remember being like, can you just
00:49:51.030 --> 00:49:54.349
fuck off right now? And tell me about the fall.
00:49:54.469 --> 00:49:58.349
I'm like stressing hard. Yeah. And then I like
00:49:58.349 --> 00:50:00.409
finished the climb. I come down, I look at Katie.
00:50:00.469 --> 00:50:01.750
I'm like, what the hell was Rachel's problem?
00:50:01.849 --> 00:50:03.949
Like what was so serious? She's like, well, you
00:50:03.949 --> 00:50:06.369
basically just told Jakob Schubert to fuck off.
00:50:06.510 --> 00:50:08.590
And I was like, oh my God. Well, there was my
00:50:08.590 --> 00:50:11.369
one opportunity of, you know, meeting the world
00:50:11.369 --> 00:50:14.289
champion rock climber who like just got brought
00:50:14.289 --> 00:50:17.980
over here to like say hi to me. And again, I'm
00:50:17.980 --> 00:50:20.380
looking down. I can't see them. I can hear Rachel's
00:50:20.380 --> 00:50:23.539
voice. And I'm just thinking, we're literally
00:50:23.539 --> 00:50:25.719
traveling around Europe right now together. You
00:50:25.719 --> 00:50:29.820
can wait three minutes. But obviously, yeah.
00:50:29.960 --> 00:50:31.760
So we never ever did meet. But I'm sure one day
00:50:31.760 --> 00:50:32.880
my path will cross. Oh, no, you didn't meet?
00:50:33.139 --> 00:50:35.659
No. Oh, no. Well, he's a busy dude. He just won
00:50:35.659 --> 00:50:38.219
the world championship. He's making his rounds.
00:50:38.260 --> 00:50:40.980
I think him and Adam Ondra are in the gym signing
00:50:40.980 --> 00:50:44.659
autographs and stuff. And yeah, somehow Rachel
00:50:44.659 --> 00:50:47.030
got him. alone for a few minutes and was like,
00:50:47.050 --> 00:50:49.190
come over here. There's this Canadian guy I want
00:50:49.190 --> 00:50:51.630
you to meet. So maybe one of these days I'll
00:50:51.630 --> 00:50:54.389
tell him the story and we'll see if he remembers
00:50:54.389 --> 00:50:56.469
this interaction. So I'm sure very few people
00:50:56.469 --> 00:50:59.670
like talk to him in that manner. Yeah. I wasn't
00:50:59.670 --> 00:51:03.250
saying it to him. I was saying it to her mostly.
00:51:03.409 --> 00:51:05.750
We're really good friends. So she wouldn't have
00:51:05.750 --> 00:51:07.710
been offended by it. And again, like I'm like
00:51:07.710 --> 00:51:11.090
above my bowl trying to figure out shit and it's
00:51:11.090 --> 00:51:13.449
not a time to be bothering someone. As a rock
00:51:13.449 --> 00:51:15.530
climber, she should have understood that. So
00:51:15.530 --> 00:51:20.210
if I, like, throw out some big names, can you
00:51:20.210 --> 00:51:22.070
let me know? Yeah, try one. Yeah. Okay. Well,
00:51:22.170 --> 00:51:24.769
so the obvious one would be, like, Yanya. Yanya
00:51:24.769 --> 00:51:28.269
Garbrandt. Yeah, I know that name. I have been
00:51:28.269 --> 00:51:31.289
in places that she's been. Okay. You don't know,
00:51:31.349 --> 00:51:35.730
like, about her, like, accomplishments? Yeah,
00:51:36.070 --> 00:51:39.869
she's, what are they, the GOAT. Okay. In, I guess,
00:51:39.889 --> 00:51:41.469
some people's opinion. Like, right now, she's
00:51:41.469 --> 00:51:43.590
definitely... From what I understand, it's just
00:51:43.590 --> 00:51:47.269
crushing it and pretty well cleaning up house,
00:51:47.329 --> 00:51:50.630
taking first place at everything. I could be
00:51:50.630 --> 00:51:52.449
wrong, but is that not true? No, yeah, that's
00:51:52.449 --> 00:51:55.469
true. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, it's just an absolute
00:51:55.469 --> 00:51:59.449
crusher. Okay. What about like a newer name,
00:51:59.650 --> 00:52:04.730
like Serato? No, don't know Serato. Sorry, Serato.
00:52:05.090 --> 00:52:10.079
Toby Roberts? He's from the UK? Yeah. I've heard
00:52:10.079 --> 00:52:12.119
that name, but I couldn't tell you anything about
00:52:12.119 --> 00:52:14.960
him other than I've heard the name. He, he won
00:52:14.960 --> 00:52:18.199
gold at the, at the last Olympics. Really? See,
00:52:18.219 --> 00:52:22.019
that's it. Like I don't watch TV. I, I mean,
00:52:22.039 --> 00:52:25.019
that's a lie. I've been, after my surgeries,
00:52:25.079 --> 00:52:29.320
I've started to watch more TV, like listening
00:52:29.320 --> 00:52:32.780
to books and stuff, but normally I don't spend
00:52:32.780 --> 00:52:37.800
any time laying around doing that type of stuff.
00:52:39.179 --> 00:52:41.880
And again, like with climbing, even climbing
00:52:41.880 --> 00:52:45.800
films and stuff like that, for me to actually
00:52:45.800 --> 00:52:49.699
watch someone rock climb, it's basically impossible.
00:52:50.260 --> 00:52:52.960
Like I must have like a massive screen TV. And
00:52:52.960 --> 00:52:54.980
even if I can see they're grabbing this hold,
00:52:55.219 --> 00:52:58.159
say it's a white wall and there's a black hold
00:52:58.159 --> 00:53:01.840
on it. Like I can't tell what the hold is. I
00:53:01.840 --> 00:53:04.739
can't see enough to know that. So I'm basically
00:53:04.739 --> 00:53:07.610
just seeing this blurb. go across the screen.
00:53:07.829 --> 00:53:11.550
Yeah, not very interesting. Yeah. If I watch
00:53:11.550 --> 00:53:14.730
like a Real Rocks, like when I had my surgery,
00:53:14.809 --> 00:53:17.329
I was like, oh, I'm going to get Real Rocks and
00:53:17.329 --> 00:53:18.409
I'm going to subscribe and I'm going to watch
00:53:18.409 --> 00:53:19.869
them all. I watched like three and I was just
00:53:19.869 --> 00:53:24.389
like, well, some of the stories are cool. But
00:53:24.389 --> 00:53:25.429
I mean, it was also a lot of them were like the
00:53:25.429 --> 00:53:27.829
same old, same old. It was like man or woman
00:53:27.829 --> 00:53:30.510
goes to Craig. They want to climb this hard thing.
00:53:30.650 --> 00:53:35.849
They fail. Injury. Whatever. It rained. Last
00:53:35.849 --> 00:53:38.010
day of trip, going to try hard one more time.
00:53:38.130 --> 00:53:41.349
Sent project, which is like cool and all, but
00:53:41.349 --> 00:53:43.389
like I don't get to actually see the holds they're
00:53:43.389 --> 00:53:47.989
climbing, the rock they're on. Like I think all
00:53:47.989 --> 00:53:51.670
the, and none of them have audio, like video
00:53:51.670 --> 00:53:53.389
description. It's like when I do watch things,
00:53:53.489 --> 00:53:57.809
I only watch shows or movies that have described
00:53:57.809 --> 00:54:01.829
video. And I would watch more Real Rocks or other
00:54:01.829 --> 00:54:05.150
climbing films if they. describe them the one
00:54:05.150 --> 00:54:07.789
i was kind of upset about is eric weinmeier he's
00:54:07.789 --> 00:54:11.250
probably the most famous blind rock climber alpinist
00:54:11.250 --> 00:54:16.309
skier kayaker biker i'll be above clint everest
00:54:16.309 --> 00:54:18.030
he's climbed the seven tallest peaks in the world
00:54:18.030 --> 00:54:24.349
and he's a b1 um and he has a real rocks out
00:54:24.349 --> 00:54:25.969
and i was super stoked i think it's the first
00:54:25.969 --> 00:54:30.369
one i found and same thing like no one's describing
00:54:30.369 --> 00:54:32.429
anything so i'm just like shit like of all the
00:54:32.429 --> 00:54:34.489
movies that should have described video that
00:54:34.489 --> 00:54:36.869
makes sense this one i think would have it and
00:54:36.869 --> 00:54:39.849
it doesn't yeah so yeah i don't know if anyone's
00:54:39.849 --> 00:54:41.969
listening to this that can chime in and make
00:54:41.969 --> 00:54:44.349
this happen but you would get more of an audience
00:54:44.349 --> 00:54:49.250
base i mean for blind people um i mean not just
00:54:49.250 --> 00:54:53.250
that even it's like when i lived in the van me
00:54:53.250 --> 00:54:56.889
and my girlfriend would watch some say seinfeld
00:54:56.889 --> 00:55:00.889
for instance and At first it was really annoying
00:55:00.889 --> 00:55:03.989
for her to have to listen to these things. And
00:55:03.989 --> 00:55:05.809
it got to the point where she would now, even
00:55:05.809 --> 00:55:08.329
when I wasn't around, be listening to stuff on
00:55:08.329 --> 00:55:09.630
described video. Cause you'd be like cooking
00:55:09.630 --> 00:55:13.210
or doing work. Cause it, yeah, like it describes
00:55:13.210 --> 00:55:16.190
so much. I remember her and I went to a movie
00:55:16.190 --> 00:55:18.650
once. Cause I used to, again, I am stubborn.
00:55:18.710 --> 00:55:21.010
I don't like change. I go to the movie theater.
00:55:22.090 --> 00:55:24.190
She hears about like the described videos. They're
00:55:24.190 --> 00:55:26.530
going to give me headphones. I was like, whatever.
00:55:26.670 --> 00:55:29.380
I'm like, this is so annoying. But I was like,
00:55:29.400 --> 00:55:32.559
I'll do a whole movie like it or with this. And
00:55:32.559 --> 00:55:35.059
then we leave the movie and are being like, oh,
00:55:35.079 --> 00:55:37.079
wow. Like as if the girl in the red dress had
00:55:37.079 --> 00:55:38.880
the key the whole time. It's like in the movie,
00:55:38.920 --> 00:55:41.500
they like unlock some box or something. She's
00:55:41.500 --> 00:55:42.599
like, how did you know that? She's like, I was
00:55:42.599 --> 00:55:44.659
curious who had the key, where the key came from.
00:55:45.059 --> 00:55:46.460
I was like, I don't know. The man on the headset
00:55:46.460 --> 00:55:48.199
was like, the girl in the red dress is handing
00:55:48.199 --> 00:55:51.820
the man the key. And she then would start listening
00:55:51.820 --> 00:55:55.000
to movies with the described video as well, because
00:55:55.000 --> 00:55:59.179
it just makes it easier. to watch things even
00:55:59.179 --> 00:56:02.639
my stepdad because i'll have it on tv at home
00:56:02.639 --> 00:56:06.179
and at first it annoyed him he obviously would
00:56:06.179 --> 00:56:08.440
be turning it off and eventually he's like oh
00:56:08.440 --> 00:56:11.119
i can now be like you know on my tablet looking
00:56:11.119 --> 00:56:13.659
at things while watching a movie because it's
00:56:13.659 --> 00:56:15.800
like describing it all to me you don't have to
00:56:15.800 --> 00:56:20.239
even look at it um so yeah try it sometime it's
00:56:20.239 --> 00:56:22.639
kind of neat how does it work with like the dialogue
00:56:22.639 --> 00:56:25.179
on top of it is it just like a lot of talking
00:56:25.179 --> 00:56:27.969
at once Companies are pretty good nowadays. They,
00:56:28.050 --> 00:56:31.309
cause a lot of times dialogue gives you enough.
00:56:31.389 --> 00:56:36.449
And then when there's a pause, they'll just kind
00:56:36.449 --> 00:56:40.550
of say something that is important to the, like,
00:56:40.670 --> 00:56:42.329
for instance, on Seinfeld, you know, a Kramer
00:56:42.329 --> 00:56:43.929
kind of like comes sliding through the door.
00:56:44.289 --> 00:56:46.909
It would be like a man with crazy hair slides
00:56:46.909 --> 00:56:49.530
across the floor while entering the room. And
00:56:49.530 --> 00:56:52.090
it's just like a quick saying that. So it's now
00:56:52.090 --> 00:56:54.829
like painting that photo in your mind of this
00:56:54.829 --> 00:56:58.440
man with crazy hair. And that's all it says.
00:56:58.579 --> 00:56:59.760
And then all of a sudden they start talking.
00:56:59.840 --> 00:57:01.440
You don't need to know what color shirt they
00:57:01.440 --> 00:57:03.980
have on. It's not telling you useless information.
00:57:05.099 --> 00:57:09.079
It's just giving you a couple little tidbits
00:57:09.079 --> 00:57:12.800
of information here and there. Interesting. Okay.
00:57:13.119 --> 00:57:16.820
So then going back to like comp clapping real
00:57:16.820 --> 00:57:19.400
quick, is there anything that makes you feel
00:57:19.400 --> 00:57:22.119
unsafe when you're on the wall? No. Maybe the
00:57:22.119 --> 00:57:25.960
odd time if I... I know that I'm going to take
00:57:25.960 --> 00:57:28.940
a big swing. And if there's volumes out of the
00:57:28.940 --> 00:57:35.480
wall, cause I, yeah, I'm just like, Jesus take
00:57:35.480 --> 00:57:40.539
the wheel type of thing. In terms of like depth
00:57:40.539 --> 00:57:42.699
perception, is that what it is? Yeah. I can't
00:57:42.699 --> 00:57:45.539
see that. And it's happening so quickly. I don't
00:57:45.539 --> 00:57:49.340
have a chance to react. Well, we just had Canadian
00:57:49.340 --> 00:57:52.599
nationals a couple of weeks ago and jazz. And
00:57:52.599 --> 00:57:57.039
I went to that and. They merged some categories,
00:57:57.059 --> 00:57:59.980
which happens sometimes. So they merged me with
00:57:59.980 --> 00:58:03.780
a B1, but then they called the category B3, which
00:58:03.780 --> 00:58:06.679
doesn't make sense because Terry can't just magically
00:58:06.679 --> 00:58:10.519
see a little bit better. So then I thought it
00:58:10.519 --> 00:58:15.099
would be fair if I blindfolded myself to level
00:58:15.099 --> 00:58:18.780
the playing field, but I've never done that before.
00:58:19.219 --> 00:58:22.340
And then when I fell, I thought I was just in
00:58:22.340 --> 00:58:25.570
thin air falling. And I wasn't, well, I mean,
00:58:25.590 --> 00:58:27.570
I was until I wasn't when I smashed my face in
00:58:27.570 --> 00:58:30.429
the wall because I didn't put my hands out. I
00:58:30.429 --> 00:58:32.570
can normally see enough to tell like, okay, there
00:58:32.570 --> 00:58:35.949
is a wall coming. I don't know. And again, this
00:58:35.949 --> 00:58:39.030
is hurt sometimes if I like put my feet out and
00:58:39.030 --> 00:58:41.510
I hit a hole, then it like twists my ankle or
00:58:41.510 --> 00:58:44.210
something. But I've kind of just learned over
00:58:44.210 --> 00:58:47.170
the years to be more rigid. I mean, not even
00:58:47.170 --> 00:58:48.829
rigid, like learning how to like hit it and like
00:58:48.829 --> 00:58:52.489
absorb the impact. Yeah, I don't seem to get
00:58:52.489 --> 00:58:55.769
hurt so much anymore. Earlier on, I used to quite
00:58:55.769 --> 00:58:58.030
a bit, but it was mostly, I was always rolling
00:58:58.030 --> 00:59:01.869
my ankles, walking before I acquired hiking sticks.
00:59:02.929 --> 00:59:04.829
So they were always like sprained and then I'd
00:59:04.829 --> 00:59:06.590
go into the wall and it would twist it more.
00:59:08.030 --> 00:59:10.210
The first like two years of my sight loss, I
00:59:10.210 --> 00:59:13.289
basically like always had a boot on or an ankle
00:59:13.289 --> 00:59:17.090
brace. I guess that makes sense in a way. Yeah,
00:59:17.170 --> 00:59:18.469
I mean, it didn't stop me from living though.
00:59:19.849 --> 00:59:24.050
I still climbed all the time, either one -legged
00:59:24.050 --> 00:59:27.710
or dragging my boot up the wall, using it as
00:59:27.710 --> 00:59:30.210
best I could. Actually, that reminds me of this
00:59:30.210 --> 00:59:34.449
one video I saw of a climber. I think it was
00:59:34.449 --> 00:59:37.969
during some older World Cup where he topped the
00:59:37.969 --> 00:59:41.789
route or topped the boulder. And then he was
00:59:41.789 --> 00:59:44.929
celebrating. He was really happy. And then as
00:59:44.929 --> 00:59:48.050
he jumped down, I think he closed his eyes and
00:59:48.050 --> 00:59:52.940
he... misjudged like how far away the ground
00:59:52.940 --> 00:59:57.539
was and so he stiffened before he actually hit
00:59:57.539 --> 00:59:59.500
the ground and then i think he like hurt his
00:59:59.500 --> 01:00:02.340
back really bad or something and that was like
01:00:02.340 --> 01:00:05.199
a really bad injury i bet bouldering is very
01:00:05.199 --> 01:00:09.099
tough for blind people it so i was just bowling
01:00:09.099 --> 01:00:12.199
the other day and i'll get to the top and i'll
01:00:12.199 --> 01:00:15.400
like hang there i'll be like i was like let go
01:00:16.239 --> 01:00:18.900
And I just like wait for my feet to hit. And
01:00:18.900 --> 01:00:21.699
it's like feet butt back. And I like absorb the
01:00:21.699 --> 01:00:24.400
roll as quick as I can. And it's exhilarating
01:00:24.400 --> 01:00:28.199
in the moment, but if it's not controlled, like
01:00:28.199 --> 01:00:30.880
my favorite time to fall is when I don't know
01:00:30.880 --> 01:00:33.280
it's coming. Like, cause then it's just like,
01:00:33.300 --> 01:00:34.760
you don't have a chance. And I just kind of like
01:00:34.760 --> 01:00:38.820
naturally fall and like roll. Don't ever seem
01:00:38.820 --> 01:00:42.139
to get hurt. It's more stressful when I'm at
01:00:42.139 --> 01:00:44.780
the top and have to like actively think about
01:00:44.780 --> 01:00:48.449
I'm going to. now let go it's like you don't
01:00:48.449 --> 01:00:49.889
want to straighten up you don't want to like
01:00:49.889 --> 01:00:53.789
lock your knees um because like things like that
01:00:53.789 --> 01:00:55.309
happen all the time because i have no idea how
01:00:55.309 --> 01:00:59.750
far away it is so i'm just winging it um terrifying
01:00:59.750 --> 01:01:01.769
yeah for the most part it goes really well but
01:01:01.769 --> 01:01:05.510
it took me a long time to get there i for the
01:01:05.510 --> 01:01:07.289
longest time i wouldn't climb anything if i couldn't
01:01:07.289 --> 01:01:09.630
down climb it and every time i'd be like freaking
01:01:09.630 --> 01:01:10.949
out trying to down climb because i'd be like
01:01:10.949 --> 01:01:14.829
super pumped and trying to down climb and Be
01:01:14.829 --> 01:01:18.530
like, help me find my feet type of thing. Panicking,
01:01:18.550 --> 01:01:20.730
I'm like, I'm never doing that again. I mean,
01:01:20.750 --> 01:01:26.610
I obviously do, but it makes it hard to project
01:01:26.610 --> 01:01:29.809
and stuff when you are literally terrified of
01:01:29.809 --> 01:01:31.829
falling because you're like, I'm not just going
01:01:31.829 --> 01:01:33.130
to fall on my own, I'm going to break my ankle.
01:01:35.250 --> 01:01:37.869
But it took a while. That's why when I think
01:01:37.869 --> 01:01:40.929
like new blind people, rock climbing, it's always
01:01:40.929 --> 01:01:44.539
on ropes first. right yeah that makes sense just
01:01:44.539 --> 01:01:48.639
because yeah bouldering while blind is pretty
01:01:48.639 --> 01:01:53.260
sketchy yeah no yeah i i probably wouldn't do
01:01:53.260 --> 01:01:55.619
it yeah i mean like next time you're at the gym
01:01:55.619 --> 01:01:58.420
go to the top like close your eyes no i'm not
01:01:58.420 --> 01:02:01.980
doing that go halfway then and and keep your
01:02:01.980 --> 01:02:04.019
knees bent because like you don't want to walk
01:02:04.019 --> 01:02:07.000
your knee yeah um because i've definitely had
01:02:07.000 --> 01:02:09.360
things like that happen where I'm doing the same
01:02:09.360 --> 01:02:11.519
route, falling in the same spot. And I think
01:02:11.519 --> 01:02:15.340
I know how far it is, but for some reason remembered
01:02:15.340 --> 01:02:18.420
it wrong and like straightened my knee too far
01:02:18.420 --> 01:02:22.840
or something. So luckily I've never really injured
01:02:22.840 --> 01:02:25.840
myself too hard that way. And mind you, I still,
01:02:26.000 --> 01:02:28.000
I don't know, I was climbing, I don't know if
01:02:28.000 --> 01:02:30.539
you knew this or not, but in Central Park in
01:02:30.539 --> 01:02:33.579
New York, there's bouldering there. Yeah, I've
01:02:33.579 --> 01:02:36.500
heard. And I was there and like one of the head
01:02:36.500 --> 01:02:40.750
coaches for the USA, para climbing team was meeting
01:02:40.750 --> 01:02:43.769
me in central park to take me bouldering and
01:02:43.769 --> 01:02:48.010
as i was waiting for phil i saw these other guys
01:02:48.010 --> 01:02:49.530
climbing i was like oh just like come and start
01:02:49.530 --> 01:02:52.650
hanging out with you guys and then they went
01:02:52.650 --> 01:02:55.769
to like move the mat when i was falling and they
01:02:55.769 --> 01:03:00.210
moved it not correctly and i landed not poor
01:03:00.210 --> 01:03:02.449
like i landed like feet butt back but i hit the
01:03:02.449 --> 01:03:04.929
ground so hard like to this day i was two years
01:03:04.929 --> 01:03:06.750
ago like the bottom of my right heel is still
01:03:06.750 --> 01:03:12.170
like It feels broken. Yeah, it hasn't healed
01:03:12.170 --> 01:03:13.690
yet. I don't know what's going on with it. It
01:03:13.690 --> 01:03:15.210
should maybe get it worked out one day. Yeah,
01:03:15.210 --> 01:03:19.289
that's not good to hear. Yeah, but I feel like,
01:03:19.329 --> 01:03:22.849
because I let go, and if I could see, I probably
01:03:22.849 --> 01:03:24.409
would have been like, hey, move the mat a little
01:03:24.409 --> 01:03:26.949
bit, because I'm not going to hit it. But I just
01:03:26.949 --> 01:03:29.610
have faith in people. Well, did they know that
01:03:29.610 --> 01:03:32.250
you have visual impairments? No, I don't tell
01:03:32.250 --> 01:03:36.289
people that normally, most of the time. Sometimes
01:03:36.289 --> 01:03:38.480
it comes out. I mean, eventually if I talk to
01:03:38.480 --> 01:03:41.539
you long enough, it comes out, but, uh, I don't
01:03:41.539 --> 01:03:44.679
normally, I try to hide it a lot of the time,
01:03:44.699 --> 01:03:47.460
to be honest. Why is that? Sometimes it's annoying
01:03:47.460 --> 01:03:52.340
to deal with, with that. And then also, I mean,
01:03:52.340 --> 01:03:56.039
the main thing I think is, uh, having to deal
01:03:56.039 --> 01:03:58.380
with the whole, like you're faking it, or I know
01:03:58.380 --> 01:04:02.019
you could see, for instance, on the way back
01:04:02.019 --> 01:04:04.699
from the gym. Now I had to walk through, I cut
01:04:04.699 --> 01:04:07.159
through this school. And the kids are out for
01:04:07.159 --> 01:04:10.239
recess. And I was like, oh, damn, like, what's
01:04:10.239 --> 01:04:12.280
the rules with that? But I was like, sure. I'm
01:04:12.280 --> 01:04:13.719
like, I'm just going to quick cut through. It's
01:04:13.719 --> 01:04:16.440
like 10 meters. I had to walk to the yard. And
01:04:16.440 --> 01:04:18.340
I had my cane in my hand, but I was folded up.
01:04:18.980 --> 01:04:21.639
And then I like walk straight to the fence. I
01:04:21.639 --> 01:04:23.960
know where the handle is. I do this every day.
01:04:24.940 --> 01:04:27.619
And then I can hear these little kids being like,
01:04:27.679 --> 01:04:29.280
that guy's blind. And like, how did he do that?
01:04:29.699 --> 01:04:32.159
And then, oh, he is blind. He has a cane or he
01:04:32.159 --> 01:04:33.780
has a stick in his hand. And I'm like listening
01:04:33.780 --> 01:04:36.099
to this conversation happening. And it was like
01:04:36.099 --> 01:04:39.079
really cute because there were kids. And if I
01:04:39.079 --> 01:04:40.760
wasn't worried about getting like a trespassing
01:04:40.760 --> 01:04:43.239
fine, or I don't know what the rules are for
01:04:43.239 --> 01:04:44.800
cutting through school property with kids there,
01:04:44.920 --> 01:04:48.239
but I just kept moving. I would have maybe stopped
01:04:48.239 --> 01:04:51.119
and had a conversation with them to, you know,
01:04:51.119 --> 01:04:54.139
educate them a bit because again, prior to being
01:04:54.139 --> 01:04:56.739
in this world, I was unaware of it. And due to
01:04:56.739 --> 01:04:59.460
lack of education, like I wasn't willfully ignorant
01:04:59.460 --> 01:05:03.440
to it. I just never really thought of looking
01:05:03.440 --> 01:05:06.409
into what blindness is. but anyways i'll have
01:05:06.409 --> 01:05:09.329
those same interactions with adults and stuff
01:05:09.329 --> 01:05:13.429
and it's always hearing the same old thing like
01:05:13.429 --> 01:05:17.510
like because they see me do something if they
01:05:17.510 --> 01:05:19.829
know i'm blind it's always like well you can't
01:05:19.829 --> 01:05:23.590
be blind you just did that like a very memorable
01:05:23.590 --> 01:05:27.409
moment for that is i remember going so i have
01:05:27.409 --> 01:05:30.889
two sons and you know they're young and growing
01:05:30.889 --> 01:05:35.769
and we're going swimming and my one son His bathing
01:05:35.769 --> 01:05:37.650
suit didn't fit him and the pool was going to
01:05:37.650 --> 01:05:40.050
close like an hour. So I asked my mom to drive
01:05:40.050 --> 01:05:42.010
us to Walmart to get him a bathing suit. I was
01:05:42.010 --> 01:05:43.170
like, everyone stay in the car. I'm just going
01:05:43.170 --> 01:05:46.510
to run in quick, grab it and leave. And then
01:05:46.510 --> 01:05:48.730
I'm like running around the store, walking pretty
01:05:48.730 --> 01:05:52.130
quickly and I can't find a bathing suit. So when
01:05:52.130 --> 01:05:54.889
I see an employee and I was like, you know, excuse
01:05:54.889 --> 01:05:57.050
me, excuse me, can you help me find a bathing
01:05:57.050 --> 01:05:59.190
suit? She's like, they're over there. I was like,
01:05:59.230 --> 01:06:00.449
yeah, I know they're over here, but I'm like,
01:06:00.469 --> 01:06:02.510
I'm visually impaired. I've been looking, I can't
01:06:02.510 --> 01:06:04.929
find one. Can you please help me? And she was
01:06:04.929 --> 01:06:06.789
like, well, you move pretty quick for somebody
01:06:06.789 --> 01:06:09.250
who claims they can't see very well. I'm just
01:06:09.250 --> 01:06:12.289
like, can you just help me find a bathing suit?
01:06:12.449 --> 01:06:14.969
Like, what is that? Like, in what world do we
01:06:14.969 --> 01:06:17.250
live in that it says a blind man can only walk
01:06:17.250 --> 01:06:22.349
this fast? Where it's just like, literally, if
01:06:22.349 --> 01:06:25.349
you look into anything, it was like the 2015
01:06:25.349 --> 01:06:29.969
Olympics. One of the blind, like a B1, so a completely
01:06:29.969 --> 01:06:32.929
blind sprinter ran the hundred meter quicker
01:06:32.929 --> 01:06:36.960
than. some of the slowest able -bodied Olympians.
01:06:36.980 --> 01:06:41.900
Like he ran like a 10 point something, 100 meters.
01:06:41.940 --> 01:06:44.079
So it's just like this man who's tethered to
01:06:44.079 --> 01:06:48.559
another human is running as quick as able -bodied
01:06:48.559 --> 01:06:51.579
Olympic athletes. Oh, okay. I didn't know they
01:06:51.579 --> 01:06:53.780
did it that way. That's cool. Yeah. So like it's,
01:06:53.780 --> 01:06:57.320
again, like this guy, and I have some vision,
01:06:57.360 --> 01:07:02.199
so it's less. Yeah. Things that it's just, it's
01:07:02.199 --> 01:07:06.380
annoying to have to be doubted all the time.
01:07:07.579 --> 01:07:09.880
Like I even have friends of mine who know, like
01:07:09.880 --> 01:07:11.519
if we're driving, say they're driving me home
01:07:11.519 --> 01:07:14.739
or something and they'll, people always make
01:07:14.739 --> 01:07:16.900
this mistake. They always turn, try to turn a
01:07:16.900 --> 01:07:20.659
road that's one road early. And I'm always just
01:07:20.659 --> 01:07:22.840
like, no, not, not yet. Like, oh, I knew you
01:07:22.840 --> 01:07:26.119
could see. I'm just like, well, like, no, like
01:07:26.119 --> 01:07:29.369
I've lived here my whole life. I know that you
01:07:29.369 --> 01:07:31.570
haven't driven far enough. Like I could be tied
01:07:31.570 --> 01:07:33.449
up in a trunk and I would know you're turning
01:07:33.449 --> 01:07:37.750
on the wrong road. Um, yeah, I think hearing
01:07:37.750 --> 01:07:41.030
things like that are just annoying quite often.
01:07:41.269 --> 01:07:45.150
And you had also, um, brought up, uh, like the
01:07:45.150 --> 01:07:48.769
Olympics or the Paralympics. Um, and of course,
01:07:48.769 --> 01:07:53.809
yeah, big news, para climbing 2028. I'm stoked.
01:07:54.110 --> 01:07:57.349
Yeah. Any thoughts on that? Yeah. Um, if you're
01:07:57.349 --> 01:07:59.650
going to compete. Oh, I'm going to compete. The
01:07:59.650 --> 01:08:04.789
only thing that would stop me would be they haven't
01:08:04.789 --> 01:08:08.909
announced the categories yet. So in para climbing,
01:08:09.150 --> 01:08:14.909
there are 10 categories, male, female. So that's
01:08:14.909 --> 01:08:20.289
like a ton of medals. So if you remember with
01:08:20.289 --> 01:08:23.609
the able -bodied climbing, Tokyo, they had to
01:08:23.609 --> 01:08:26.720
do the combined all three disciplines. Yeah.
01:08:26.899 --> 01:08:28.539
Like the reason why they did that is because
01:08:28.539 --> 01:08:31.180
they could only issue so many medals. So they
01:08:31.180 --> 01:08:33.260
had, you know, six medals to give out, three
01:08:33.260 --> 01:08:36.880
male, three female. And then they then for Paris
01:08:36.880 --> 01:08:41.619
were allotted, you know, 12 medals. So they can
01:08:41.619 --> 01:08:43.939
now have two different events. And I think they're
01:08:43.939 --> 01:08:47.619
hoping to have, you know, three sets of medals
01:08:47.619 --> 01:08:50.119
so they can have individual disciplines like
01:08:50.119 --> 01:08:53.460
the speed, boulder, lead. But it takes time.
01:08:54.729 --> 01:08:59.710
for the Olympic Federation to allow a lot that
01:08:59.710 --> 01:09:04.409
many medals to see sports. So for us, they haven't
01:09:04.409 --> 01:09:08.390
told us what categories are going to be involved,
01:09:08.670 --> 01:09:11.569
if there's going to be merging. I mean, all of
01:09:11.569 --> 01:09:14.609
this is just rumors, but a lot of talk is blind
01:09:14.609 --> 01:09:18.029
people don't look disabled. So it's not enough
01:09:18.029 --> 01:09:23.029
inspiration porn for us to be on the TV, I suppose.
01:09:24.270 --> 01:09:25.829
Even, like, a lot of people find blind climbing
01:09:25.829 --> 01:09:29.949
very interesting. And my suggestion to the IFSC
01:09:29.949 --> 01:09:35.869
was to televise the callers, like, mic both of
01:09:35.869 --> 01:09:38.050
us. I mean, we're already mic'd. Oh, yeah, that
01:09:38.050 --> 01:09:40.250
would be interesting, yeah. That way, if at home,
01:09:40.270 --> 01:09:41.989
you're not just flipping through the channels
01:09:41.989 --> 01:09:45.789
and seeing some man or woman climbing slowly,
01:09:46.069 --> 01:09:50.289
you can hear the two -way. Because, like, yeah,
01:09:50.310 --> 01:09:55.460
there's chatter back and forth. I think it's
01:09:55.460 --> 01:09:58.500
very interesting to listen to the back and forth
01:09:58.500 --> 01:10:02.819
conversation. Like I even me, like I wish I could
01:10:02.819 --> 01:10:04.920
hear what's happening through the other people.
01:10:06.199 --> 01:10:08.619
I feel like some teams don't want to share that
01:10:08.619 --> 01:10:13.039
because they have developed their own secret
01:10:13.039 --> 01:10:15.779
information. Yeah. And they don't want everyone
01:10:15.779 --> 01:10:18.000
to know the beta that they have. I hope they
01:10:18.000 --> 01:10:22.439
get over themselves and that's not. I think it
01:10:22.439 --> 01:10:25.979
makes it very engaging too. And also it makes
01:10:25.979 --> 01:10:30.199
climbing this team sport. It's very much, so
01:10:30.199 --> 01:10:32.239
even at the Canadian Nationals, and I think,
01:10:32.260 --> 01:10:35.140
so USA Nationals just happened. They're now,
01:10:35.319 --> 01:10:39.000
and a lot of other blind sports, the caller or
01:10:39.000 --> 01:10:42.899
the guide are treated equal to the athlete. I
01:10:42.899 --> 01:10:47.319
just referenced the 100 meter dash. You ain't
01:10:47.319 --> 01:10:50.800
just some random dude. You're an Olympic athlete.
01:10:51.229 --> 01:10:54.189
to be that guy's guide like the guy who ran that
01:10:54.189 --> 01:10:57.869
10 10 .5 seconds with him also just beat a guy
01:10:57.869 --> 01:11:00.550
who was in the olympics so it's just like but
01:11:00.550 --> 01:11:03.689
he's there's a canadian cross -country skier
01:11:03.689 --> 01:11:07.750
he's on both teams and again his brother is his
01:11:07.750 --> 01:11:10.689
guide but his brother's also an olympic cross
01:11:10.689 --> 01:11:13.430
-country skier yeah and they train together every
01:11:13.430 --> 01:11:16.090
day anyways so like i mean like you need to have
01:11:16.090 --> 01:11:20.289
high level guides so then they need to be treated
01:11:21.229 --> 01:11:23.109
You know, like they've been getting medals, like
01:11:23.109 --> 01:11:25.890
other sports, if there's a cash prize, the caller
01:11:25.890 --> 01:11:28.909
or guide will get, you know, that money as well.
01:11:29.930 --> 01:11:31.869
Because they, and that's an argument people have
01:11:31.869 --> 01:11:33.449
is like, yeah, but they're not training as hard,
01:11:33.449 --> 01:11:36.529
say in climbing. Because, you know, if I'm doing
01:11:36.529 --> 01:11:38.729
off the wall training, like say this afternoon,
01:11:39.050 --> 01:11:41.590
you know, Jazz is going to call for me. So that's
01:11:41.590 --> 01:11:44.449
equal time spent. But this morning when I spent
01:11:44.449 --> 01:11:46.409
a couple hours at the YMCA working out, like
01:11:46.409 --> 01:11:50.100
she wasn't there doing that. So it's not a hundred
01:11:50.100 --> 01:11:53.399
percent equal, but she's still putting a lot
01:11:53.399 --> 01:11:55.000
of time in and she still has to, you know, be
01:11:55.000 --> 01:11:57.520
educated on the hold. But yeah, so I hope that
01:11:57.520 --> 01:12:01.600
they merge us as I think, I don't know what they're
01:12:01.600 --> 01:12:05.399
going to do, but they, for a lot of other blind
01:12:05.399 --> 01:12:09.579
sports. They combine B1, B2, B3, and they just
01:12:09.579 --> 01:12:12.100
blindfold everyone. Yeah, I was going to say
01:12:12.100 --> 01:12:15.020
like in terms of inspiration porn, being blindfolded
01:12:15.020 --> 01:12:18.520
is pretty decent, I think. Yeah. I mean, also
01:12:18.520 --> 01:12:23.020
someone who has classified as a B3 and I have
01:12:23.020 --> 01:12:25.800
central vision, or I have no central vision and
01:12:25.800 --> 01:12:27.880
they do have central vision, people can argue,
01:12:27.939 --> 01:12:30.779
well, that's not even fair because that person
01:12:30.779 --> 01:12:33.500
could view the whole route where I can't. Like,
01:12:33.520 --> 01:12:35.539
I don't get into the nitty gritty details like
01:12:35.539 --> 01:12:37.300
that. Like, I don't like to complain about things.
01:12:37.399 --> 01:12:39.159
I'm just grateful that I get to climb these wicked
01:12:39.159 --> 01:12:44.659
awesome routes and that we, you know, are involved.
01:12:44.960 --> 01:12:49.039
Like, I feel, and again, I wasn't aware of this,
01:12:49.119 --> 01:12:53.779
but a lot of disabled people grew up never getting
01:12:53.779 --> 01:12:58.659
to experience sports or, you know, being included
01:12:58.659 --> 01:13:05.659
in the things. blind people I meet are, they
01:13:05.659 --> 01:13:07.939
don't have like people skills or they're very,
01:13:08.039 --> 01:13:09.560
they're not very confident in themselves and
01:13:09.560 --> 01:13:12.140
their abilities. And it's because they haven't
01:13:12.140 --> 01:13:15.399
been given opportunities to do anything. And
01:13:15.399 --> 01:13:19.039
they're, they're babied and treated so differently.
01:13:19.140 --> 01:13:20.619
I'm just like, I'm not any different than you
01:13:20.619 --> 01:13:22.960
are. I just don't see, I mean, I can do everything
01:13:22.960 --> 01:13:24.699
you can do. I just do differently than you do.
01:13:25.300 --> 01:13:27.859
I mean, other than driving a car illegally, there's
01:13:27.859 --> 01:13:30.060
nothing that anyone else can do that I can't,
01:13:30.060 --> 01:13:33.909
that I can drive. Not on roads. No, I'm joking.
01:13:34.069 --> 01:13:36.750
Oh my gosh. I was going to say, wait, how? I
01:13:36.750 --> 01:13:39.470
had no idea. I drive by feel when I hit bumps,
01:13:39.529 --> 01:13:42.750
I turn. Yeah. Like I'll drive off, off road and
01:13:42.750 --> 01:13:44.350
stuff. I have a friend of mine. I won't say her
01:13:44.350 --> 01:13:47.670
name, but she's sponsored by a car company that
01:13:47.670 --> 01:13:50.869
I won't mention their name. And she's been known
01:13:50.869 --> 01:13:55.409
to let me drive her fancy expensive vehicle off
01:13:55.409 --> 01:14:00.880
road more than once. Because, yeah, like, I can
01:14:00.880 --> 01:14:04.600
drive. I just, when there's nothing around for
01:14:04.600 --> 01:14:07.840
me to hit. Yeah, okay. Yeah, if I drove on the
01:14:07.840 --> 01:14:11.020
road, I would probably kill someone. So I don't
01:14:11.020 --> 01:14:12.239
do that. Well, then you wouldn't know to turn,
01:14:12.300 --> 01:14:16.920
so. Yeah. But, like, I mean, I have an ATV and
01:14:16.920 --> 01:14:21.380
stuff that I started riding again. And I, yeah,
01:14:21.460 --> 01:14:23.539
same thing. I just, like, follow a friend. And
01:14:23.539 --> 01:14:26.500
once I've been on the trail a couple times, I
01:14:26.500 --> 01:14:31.949
know it, I remember it. Yeah, I do everything
01:14:31.949 --> 01:14:35.189
other than driving a car. I've learned how to,
01:14:35.310 --> 01:14:37.489
like there's a saying of mine, it's instead of
01:14:37.489 --> 01:14:40.409
saying I can't, say how can I? And that's like
01:14:40.409 --> 01:14:43.250
a very powerful thing to me. Because early on
01:14:43.250 --> 01:14:45.609
I was constantly saying I can't, I can't do this,
01:14:45.630 --> 01:14:49.369
I can't do that. And my older sister, when she
01:14:49.369 --> 01:14:51.430
said to me like, quit saying I can't, start saying
01:14:51.430 --> 01:14:56.850
how can I? Yeah. And now I will always do that.
01:14:57.130 --> 01:14:59.159
That's a good way of thinking about it. I was
01:14:59.159 --> 01:15:02.119
also wondering, like going back to, I guess like
01:15:02.119 --> 01:15:06.039
the para climbing or Paralympics, how much of
01:15:06.039 --> 01:15:08.560
a difference do you feel when you're climbing
01:15:08.560 --> 01:15:10.819
blindfolded versus with the site you currently
01:15:10.819 --> 01:15:14.520
have? It's definitely way different as I already
01:15:14.520 --> 01:15:18.399
shared. Falling is different. I mean, but once
01:15:18.399 --> 01:15:20.439
I did that, I then learned that I need to like,
01:15:20.479 --> 01:15:23.380
you know, be prepared. And like, believe it or
01:15:23.380 --> 01:15:25.600
not, you can hear the wall. Like, you know, in
01:15:25.600 --> 01:15:28.840
hockey, I can hear. where the boards are like
01:15:28.840 --> 01:15:32.100
the echoing off of it and yeah i just wasn't
01:15:32.100 --> 01:15:33.939
like i said i wasn't preparing myself at all
01:15:33.939 --> 01:15:36.880
because i thought that i was just like gonna
01:15:36.880 --> 01:15:38.560
because i think it was my second route the first
01:15:38.560 --> 01:15:40.619
route i fell like a lot of it's overhung so you
01:15:40.619 --> 01:15:44.319
just fall and then you just get lowered and you're
01:15:44.319 --> 01:15:49.399
just in air but for some reason i i swung in
01:15:49.399 --> 01:15:53.180
to the wall so moving forward i was then now
01:15:53.180 --> 01:15:55.720
prepared and like it was actually like listening
01:15:56.250 --> 01:15:59.710
for when the wall was coming so it's definitely
01:15:59.710 --> 01:16:03.949
you need to practice more with your collar because
01:16:03.949 --> 01:16:08.029
yeah like at least when i'm told okay next hold
01:16:08.029 --> 01:16:10.590
grab it with your left hand and grab the top
01:16:10.590 --> 01:16:13.890
of it i know like exactly kind of where to go
01:16:13.890 --> 01:16:17.109
versus now i'm blindfolded it's just like you
01:16:17.109 --> 01:16:20.430
know i have no idea they say like you know left
01:16:20.430 --> 01:16:24.229
the 10 o 'clock well how far three feet six inches
01:16:25.130 --> 01:16:28.430
So there's like a lot of like, it's more static
01:16:28.430 --> 01:16:30.189
climbing, which we statically climb anyways,
01:16:30.289 --> 01:16:33.050
but then you, you reach, you don't feel that
01:16:33.050 --> 01:16:34.449
I have to like correct you. Like, you know, go
01:16:34.449 --> 01:16:36.390
down, down and stop, go right, right, right.
01:16:36.449 --> 01:16:41.409
Stop. So all those little micro movements, they
01:16:41.409 --> 01:16:45.069
all add up to, to a lot at the end. So I think
01:16:45.069 --> 01:16:46.609
that's maybe some of the beta that people don't
01:16:46.609 --> 01:16:49.989
want exposed is I've heard of other callers that
01:16:49.989 --> 01:16:53.289
have like the, the body's kind of broken up into
01:16:53.289 --> 01:16:56.319
quadrants. And then within the quadrant, they'll
01:16:56.319 --> 01:16:59.199
have, you know, a number system in there. So
01:16:59.199 --> 01:17:01.359
if, you know, if this is quadrant number two,
01:17:01.380 --> 01:17:03.119
it'd be like, you know, two, three would mean
01:17:03.119 --> 01:17:07.640
like here. Interesting. So I feel like those
01:17:07.640 --> 01:17:10.640
are the secrets that people don't want exposed
01:17:10.640 --> 01:17:13.359
because they don't want other people to know
01:17:13.359 --> 01:17:16.500
what they're using and then incorporate that
01:17:16.500 --> 01:17:21.640
into their climbing. Okay. So like, I do understand
01:17:21.640 --> 01:17:25.640
that aspect of it. It's kind of like, you know,
01:17:25.640 --> 01:17:27.380
in football or something, people have these plays
01:17:27.380 --> 01:17:31.399
written down and they're secret. Yeah, I guess
01:17:31.399 --> 01:17:34.800
I could see that. Yeah. So, I mean, if that's
01:17:34.800 --> 01:17:40.859
the edge that you need, then take it. But it's
01:17:40.859 --> 01:17:44.539
definitely more difficult. But if they, I hope
01:17:44.539 --> 01:17:48.659
that they allow us time. Like they're supposed
01:17:48.659 --> 01:17:52.970
to tell us this summer, I think. which they always
01:17:52.970 --> 01:17:56.050
are late with everything they tell us so maybe
01:17:56.050 --> 01:17:58.550
next summer i'll know and then it'll give me
01:17:58.550 --> 01:18:03.390
two years to to train okay well i hope that works
01:18:03.390 --> 01:18:08.489
out yeah and then um going into a bit more of
01:18:08.489 --> 01:18:11.189
like outdoor climbing you've done um i think
01:18:11.189 --> 01:18:13.850
for a lot of people well i don't personally climb
01:18:13.850 --> 01:18:17.989
outside much because i just why is that um well
01:18:17.989 --> 01:18:21.819
it's like a lot of Effort, it's a lot more effort
01:18:21.819 --> 01:18:23.659
than like climbing inside. I don't feel like
01:18:23.659 --> 01:18:26.140
it's as efficient in terms of like getting better.
01:18:26.960 --> 01:18:30.899
Yeah, the approach. I also just don't like dealing
01:18:30.899 --> 01:18:34.399
with weather. So if it's like too hot or it's
01:18:34.399 --> 01:18:37.460
too cold, it's just, I would rather not deal
01:18:37.460 --> 01:18:41.720
with it. You had said about it's the effort and
01:18:41.720 --> 01:18:46.260
getting better. So do you equate having fun rock
01:18:46.260 --> 01:18:49.729
climbing with I have to climb this hard? Well,
01:18:49.729 --> 01:18:52.890
because my goal is more like I have some like
01:18:52.890 --> 01:18:57.430
competition goals. And so I want to work towards
01:18:57.430 --> 01:19:00.930
those. And I feel like in terms of training,
01:19:01.289 --> 01:19:06.130
it's like I could spend a whole day outside or
01:19:06.130 --> 01:19:10.829
I could spend that day training. And then I also
01:19:10.829 --> 01:19:13.470
get a chance to do like other non -climbing stuff
01:19:13.470 --> 01:19:17.310
too. Do you find climbing in a gym fun all the
01:19:17.310 --> 01:19:23.439
time? I really, I mean, it depends. I just, I
01:19:23.439 --> 01:19:25.920
don't feel like I love climbing as much as a
01:19:25.920 --> 01:19:28.619
lot of people do, which is weird to say with
01:19:28.619 --> 01:19:31.300
someone with a climbing podcast and someone who
01:19:31.300 --> 01:19:34.399
climbs all the time. But I mean, I find it like
01:19:34.399 --> 01:19:38.819
very frustrating. And I sometimes find it hard
01:19:38.819 --> 01:19:43.609
to like motivate myself to go and climb. I just
01:19:43.609 --> 01:19:45.829
don't feel like I can say that I love it as much
01:19:45.829 --> 01:19:49.390
as someone who is able to like motivate themselves
01:19:49.390 --> 01:19:52.810
to go to the gym like six days a week. Like I
01:19:52.810 --> 01:19:55.010
was kind of asking that because one of the things
01:19:55.010 --> 01:19:59.170
that I need to work on is my endurance and power
01:19:59.170 --> 01:20:02.329
endurance. So I look forward to say spending
01:20:02.329 --> 01:20:04.789
a lot of time in the red like in Kentucky where
01:20:04.789 --> 01:20:07.470
there's a lot of like overhung climbs because
01:20:07.470 --> 01:20:11.819
sure it's not. comp climbing and it's not climbing
01:20:11.819 --> 01:20:15.319
on plastic but the power and the endurance that
01:20:15.319 --> 01:20:19.840
i'm going to gain from climbing outside there
01:20:19.840 --> 01:20:23.039
and again i just have i have more fun personally
01:20:23.039 --> 01:20:28.779
climbing outdoors um because like yeah like i
01:20:28.779 --> 01:20:31.819
do like going to the gym and stuff but if i were
01:20:31.819 --> 01:20:33.699
to pick gym climbing outdoor climbing it's like
01:20:33.699 --> 01:20:36.420
hands down outdoor climbing Well, I guess for
01:20:36.420 --> 01:20:39.619
a lot of people, or at least from what I hear,
01:20:39.859 --> 01:20:42.760
they love an outdoor climb because of the way
01:20:42.760 --> 01:20:45.300
the rock looks or because they think it looks
01:20:45.300 --> 01:20:48.699
aesthetic or something like that. And I guess
01:20:48.699 --> 01:20:50.460
that's not really something you can go off of.
01:20:50.560 --> 01:20:53.279
So like what makes a great outdoor climb for
01:20:53.279 --> 01:20:55.739
you? Like, is it like rock texture? The feel
01:20:55.739 --> 01:21:00.979
of the rock. But even I do say that the people
01:21:00.979 --> 01:21:02.720
look at a climb like, wow, it's so aesthetic.
01:21:02.800 --> 01:21:04.479
I want to climb that line. I don't get that.
01:21:05.430 --> 01:21:09.890
I do get to see like this big red rock, which
01:21:09.890 --> 01:21:14.609
is in mountains. Like I live in South Washington,
01:21:14.670 --> 01:21:19.250
Ontario. It's fairly flat here. So to just get
01:21:19.250 --> 01:21:22.270
to like stand beside this epic, cause like I
01:21:22.270 --> 01:21:24.989
can see that you don't have to have much vision.
01:21:25.029 --> 01:21:27.270
You can have 1 % vision left and to tell there's
01:21:27.270 --> 01:21:29.550
a mountain in front of you, you can see that.
01:21:30.010 --> 01:21:32.670
So sure. I can't see the little details of it,
01:21:32.689 --> 01:21:35.329
but like everywhere I go and I, I'm just like,
01:21:35.329 --> 01:21:39.409
I want to go stand on top of that. And no idea
01:21:39.409 --> 01:21:42.609
how I'm going to get there, but I can see this
01:21:42.609 --> 01:21:47.930
big thing where like a gym climb, I, you know,
01:21:47.930 --> 01:21:50.750
it's all the same. It's just, I don't know. Like,
01:21:50.789 --> 01:21:54.430
so it's, it's not, so I do, the aesthetics do
01:21:54.430 --> 01:21:58.649
please me. And then the nature and colors of
01:21:58.649 --> 01:22:02.260
the leaves when they're changing. I just like
01:22:02.260 --> 01:22:03.859
being out in nature. I think that's what it is.
01:22:04.000 --> 01:22:08.640
It's quiet. The birds are chirping. I have to
01:22:08.640 --> 01:22:13.420
communicate with people. Gyms are loud. For the
01:22:13.420 --> 01:22:15.899
most part, especially if you go to some pretty
01:22:15.899 --> 01:22:18.520
epic climbs, no one's there because the average
01:22:18.520 --> 01:22:20.159
person doesn't want to put the effort in to get
01:22:20.159 --> 01:22:23.560
there. I see. Especially if you're multi -pitching,
01:22:23.600 --> 01:22:26.319
you're definitely not there with people. Anyone
01:22:26.319 --> 01:22:28.659
who's there is a pretty serious climber at some
01:22:28.659 --> 01:22:31.670
point. and you're not climbing beside someone
01:22:31.670 --> 01:22:36.449
you know it's just free um i think it was all
01:22:36.449 --> 01:22:38.949
just because i didn't do things like that and
01:22:38.949 --> 01:22:41.489
and i think i was saying when i first lost my
01:22:41.489 --> 01:22:43.229
sight i was like i'm not going to be able to
01:22:43.229 --> 01:22:46.069
do anything and now it's just like i'm doing
01:22:46.069 --> 01:22:47.930
shit i didn't even dream of doing beforehand
01:22:47.930 --> 01:22:50.789
yeah that's that makes sense that's really awesome
01:22:50.789 --> 01:22:53.189
i think just like the try hard aspect of like
01:22:53.189 --> 01:22:55.310
sometimes the approach you hate it in the moment
01:22:55.310 --> 01:22:59.380
yeah i do hate it yeah a lot Yeah, for some reason
01:22:59.380 --> 01:23:03.039
I enjoy the Sufferfest sometimes. Okay. Like
01:23:03.039 --> 01:23:05.359
in the moment, and it's always kind of training
01:23:05.359 --> 01:23:07.739
for me, like because I'm a dual sport athlete,
01:23:08.100 --> 01:23:10.539
for me, like if I'm like approaching and like
01:23:10.539 --> 01:23:13.979
going up these, you know, big hard things, carrying
01:23:13.979 --> 01:23:16.359
a heavy backpack, instead of like bitching and
01:23:16.359 --> 01:23:18.220
complaining about it, in my mind I'm just like,
01:23:18.340 --> 01:23:20.119
no, I'm making my legs stronger. I'm going to
01:23:20.119 --> 01:23:23.439
skate harder. And I try to make everything I'm
01:23:23.439 --> 01:23:27.420
doing training. It's kind of how I counter that.
01:23:28.460 --> 01:23:32.159
in my brain even i can't drive so i i run everywhere
01:23:32.159 --> 01:23:36.020
i go or i roller blade and you know there's times
01:23:36.020 --> 01:23:40.039
that i'm like sick of it but i just remind myself
01:23:40.039 --> 01:23:43.579
you know like i'm training right now i'm very
01:23:43.579 --> 01:23:45.560
fortunate that just to get from point a to point
01:23:45.560 --> 01:23:48.460
b i have to be training and i do want to like
01:23:48.460 --> 01:23:51.460
ask a little bit about the blind hockey um since
01:23:51.460 --> 01:23:53.460
i i don't know much about that do you feel like
01:23:53.460 --> 01:23:56.729
playing hockey helps with climbing much Yeah.
01:23:56.770 --> 01:24:00.550
In the sense of like, I might have to be like
01:24:00.550 --> 01:24:04.430
very physically fit for both. Like people ask
01:24:04.430 --> 01:24:07.670
like, how do you train for both? Um, and actually
01:24:07.670 --> 01:24:10.270
I mostly like train climbing. It seems minus
01:24:10.270 --> 01:24:15.789
like my cardio, like endurance that way. But
01:24:15.789 --> 01:24:18.569
you're like me making my like hands and wrists
01:24:18.569 --> 01:24:21.729
and stuff stronger. Just made my shot better.
01:24:22.390 --> 01:24:26.819
Um, the one downfall would be like, Being heavier
01:24:26.819 --> 01:24:30.000
and stronger in hockey is better because you
01:24:30.000 --> 01:24:32.760
don't get like pushed around as much, which,
01:24:32.800 --> 01:24:34.640
you know, there's this big thing in climbing
01:24:34.640 --> 01:24:36.960
with like eating disorders and stuff like that
01:24:36.960 --> 01:24:40.239
where I definitely do not have an eating disorder,
01:24:40.319 --> 01:24:41.500
but there was times I was thinking, oh, like
01:24:41.500 --> 01:24:43.460
I need to like quit hitting the gym so hard because
01:24:43.460 --> 01:24:47.819
I'm like going to weigh too much. Like for your
01:24:47.819 --> 01:24:50.500
legs, yeah. Yeah, because like when I get like
01:24:50.500 --> 01:24:53.199
skating a lot, like, you know, you hold a lot
01:24:53.199 --> 01:24:56.260
of weight in your legs. but also i've now been
01:24:56.260 --> 01:25:00.180
learning to like use my legs more um and again
01:25:00.180 --> 01:25:01.899
like we were talking about like me having these
01:25:01.899 --> 01:25:05.100
like high level callers and like coaches i remember
01:25:05.100 --> 01:25:07.800
like alana pointing out to me like you have like
01:25:07.800 --> 01:25:09.520
strong legs like use them like you're coming
01:25:09.520 --> 01:25:11.159
off the wall it's not because your legs are pumped
01:25:11.159 --> 01:25:13.899
so if you can get into like a good spot with
01:25:13.899 --> 01:25:16.699
your legs like sit on them and like until they're
01:25:16.699 --> 01:25:18.739
like exhausted like if you can hold yourself
01:25:18.739 --> 01:25:21.880
somewhere with your legs don't just you know
01:25:21.880 --> 01:25:23.560
throw a knee bar in and hang out there for two
01:25:23.560 --> 01:25:26.199
seconds because that's the move like stay there
01:25:26.199 --> 01:25:30.140
like rest your arms as long as you can um so
01:25:30.140 --> 01:25:33.779
I try to like use the legs to a benefit but I
01:25:33.779 --> 01:25:35.520
guess for the most part though like hockey doesn't
01:25:35.520 --> 01:25:40.300
necessarily improve my climbing I would say it
01:25:40.300 --> 01:25:45.060
helps with the approaches on things I have to
01:25:45.060 --> 01:25:48.529
be like pretty physically fit to play like high
01:25:48.529 --> 01:25:51.529
level hockey so it definitely goes the opposite
01:25:51.529 --> 01:25:54.949
way for not for the act of climbing but definitely
01:25:54.949 --> 01:25:58.109
getting to and from climbing and having to carry
01:25:58.109 --> 01:26:01.069
a bunch of heavy stuff yeah that's true all the
01:26:01.069 --> 01:26:04.289
stuff that i avoid yeah do you ever climb outside
01:26:04.289 --> 01:26:08.109
at all um i get convinced every once in a while
01:26:08.109 --> 01:26:10.630
like people want me to go just because i never
01:26:10.630 --> 01:26:13.510
go and then i go and i complain the whole time
01:26:13.510 --> 01:26:15.430
and they're like okay yeah this is why i don't
01:26:15.430 --> 01:26:18.699
go where are you going Like maybe it's really
01:26:18.699 --> 01:26:23.539
hot or. I mean, sometimes I'm, yeah, my body
01:26:23.539 --> 01:26:26.439
doesn't like adjust very well to temperatures.
01:26:26.560 --> 01:26:28.500
So, I mean, sometimes I'm too hot. Sometimes
01:26:28.500 --> 01:26:31.659
I'm too cold. But yeah, I've like, I used to
01:26:31.659 --> 01:26:34.960
live in Vegas for years. So I, I did some climbing
01:26:34.960 --> 01:26:38.720
there. I was in Washington climbing. So I've
01:26:38.720 --> 01:26:41.520
been to a few spots out there. And right now
01:26:41.520 --> 01:26:44.439
in San Diego, I've actually been out like once
01:26:44.439 --> 01:26:47.390
or twice, but yeah, a little bit out here. And
01:26:47.390 --> 01:26:49.930
you haven't found a spot you like, eh? No. I
01:26:49.930 --> 01:26:51.949
mean, it's also just like the movement outside.
01:26:52.409 --> 01:26:54.770
I'm more interested in like competition style
01:26:54.770 --> 01:26:59.270
moves. Okay. And you don't find that as much
01:26:59.270 --> 01:27:01.510
outside. I'm trying to think. I don't think you
01:27:01.510 --> 01:27:05.390
really like doing laches on natural rock. Yeah.
01:27:05.630 --> 01:27:08.829
Well, I'm actually really bad at laches. So not
01:27:08.829 --> 01:27:12.869
that, but you know, just other stuff. Maybe you'll
01:27:12.869 --> 01:27:15.930
have to try to find, I guess you probably wouldn't.
01:27:16.239 --> 01:27:18.199
like the whole like adventuring around to try
01:27:18.199 --> 01:27:21.939
to like find new developments yeah i mean it's
01:27:21.939 --> 01:27:24.760
not for everyone yeah and it's it's fine i don't
01:27:24.760 --> 01:27:27.180
need to climb outside outside people don't need
01:27:27.180 --> 01:27:29.979
to climb inside and i i guess that's where the
01:27:29.979 --> 01:27:31.960
name of your podcast comes in that's not real
01:27:31.960 --> 01:27:34.939
climbing because i'm sure it's especially like
01:27:34.939 --> 01:27:39.239
the old school you know trad daddy type people
01:27:39.239 --> 01:27:41.520
are just like sport climbing is not climbing
01:27:41.520 --> 01:27:45.170
and Indoor climbing definitely is not climbing.
01:27:45.510 --> 01:27:48.430
Yeah. I knew Alex Honnold, I heard in an interview
01:27:48.430 --> 01:27:52.329
talking about, he was saying that he could then,
01:27:52.470 --> 01:27:54.590
he's one of very few people that could say to
01:27:54.590 --> 01:27:56.289
someone like, well, like what you're doing is
01:27:56.289 --> 01:27:59.470
not real climbing. Real climbing is technically
01:27:59.470 --> 01:28:02.850
a climbing barefoot with no chalk. That is real
01:28:02.850 --> 01:28:04.529
climbing. He's like, where are we drawing this
01:28:04.529 --> 01:28:07.189
limit? And like, if you want to climb top rope
01:28:07.189 --> 01:28:11.069
inside at a gym, that is raw climbing. So, you
01:28:11.069 --> 01:28:14.119
know, get off your high horse. Yeah. Free soloing
01:28:14.119 --> 01:28:16.359
is the only real, it's the only real climbing.
01:28:17.479 --> 01:28:19.439
Yeah. I mean, it depends on where you want to
01:28:19.439 --> 01:28:22.500
look at it. Like, are you moving off the ground?
01:28:22.640 --> 01:28:27.220
Are you using your body? Are you climbing? I
01:28:27.220 --> 01:28:28.439
don't know. What's the definition of climbing?
01:28:28.739 --> 01:28:30.840
You know, I remember the first time I ice climbed,
01:28:30.960 --> 01:28:33.079
I'd posted a video of it or something and someone
01:28:33.079 --> 01:28:36.079
had commented because I was top roping and they
01:28:36.079 --> 01:28:39.720
were chirping me that I wasn't climbing. And
01:28:39.720 --> 01:28:40.939
I'd be like, what are you talking about? Like.
01:28:41.439 --> 01:28:43.979
Oh, okay. I'm sorry that I'm not lead climbing
01:28:43.979 --> 01:28:49.680
my first time blind ice climbing. My bad. And
01:28:49.680 --> 01:28:51.460
I realized like, you know, why am I getting upset
01:28:51.460 --> 01:28:55.319
at some idiot who is on his fucking keyboard
01:28:55.319 --> 01:28:59.520
typing away? Like I, I climbed, I don't care
01:28:59.520 --> 01:29:02.460
what you want to say. I did. And it was great.
01:29:02.659 --> 01:29:04.819
That's really cool. How'd you like ice climbing?
01:29:05.720 --> 01:29:07.319
Loved it. I thought it was going to be really
01:29:07.319 --> 01:29:11.329
hard. like not physically like yes it is but
01:29:11.329 --> 01:29:15.829
i thought it was going to be hard trying to pick
01:29:15.829 --> 01:29:19.390
in but complete opposite it was awesome i didn't
01:29:19.390 --> 01:29:21.850
have to try to find a little foot i want my foot
01:29:21.850 --> 01:29:25.649
to go here i just kick it there um true you don't
01:29:25.649 --> 01:29:28.909
feel like look for a foothold or a handhold you
01:29:28.909 --> 01:29:31.590
just like well i want my axe here and not every
01:29:31.590 --> 01:29:33.750
time but like if it didn't go in and it would
01:29:33.750 --> 01:29:36.100
like kind of like bounce i would just like drag
01:29:36.100 --> 01:29:38.319
the ice or the axle on the ice and i could kind
01:29:38.319 --> 01:29:40.260
of feel how it was shaped and be like oh i'm
01:29:40.260 --> 01:29:45.539
gonna put it there and the learning curve wasn't
01:29:45.539 --> 01:29:49.199
as hard as i thought it was going to be it uh
01:29:49.199 --> 01:29:52.500
because yeah no one gave me any tips on it and
01:29:52.500 --> 01:29:56.279
i plan to do a bunch of like ice climbing at
01:29:56.279 --> 01:30:00.340
some point also i feel the days i went i've been
01:30:00.340 --> 01:30:03.119
a few times now and it's what they call like
01:30:03.119 --> 01:30:06.909
hero ice so maybe i won't enjoy it as much hero
01:30:06.909 --> 01:30:11.689
ice meaning it was pretty i think the one day
01:30:11.689 --> 01:30:13.409
i was even climbing in a t -shirt it was like
01:30:13.409 --> 01:30:15.170
maybe like zero degrees like negative two or
01:30:15.170 --> 01:30:19.369
something so the ice is hard hard enough to hold
01:30:19.369 --> 01:30:22.449
you but it's pretty soft i guess if it's super
01:30:22.449 --> 01:30:24.850
hard it like chips away more it's maybe harder
01:30:24.850 --> 01:30:29.609
to get into um so maybe i just haven't experienced
01:30:29.609 --> 01:30:37.729
bad um environments yeah that makes sense but
01:30:37.729 --> 01:30:40.789
i'm still one of my goals in life is to i want
01:30:40.789 --> 01:30:43.130
to like do something where i need to like backcountry
01:30:43.130 --> 01:30:49.710
ski leading to some ice climb and then get on
01:30:49.710 --> 01:30:51.949
top of something to then ski off the top of it
01:30:51.949 --> 01:30:55.310
um and kind of put where again people might be
01:30:55.310 --> 01:30:58.069
like that's crazy or like not because like that
01:30:58.069 --> 01:31:00.350
sounds like a suffer fest like that would be
01:31:00.350 --> 01:31:03.520
cool Yeah, I think it would be a bit of a sufferfest,
01:31:03.539 --> 01:31:07.899
but it would be very enjoyable. Yeah, I just
01:31:07.899 --> 01:31:11.340
like doing things like that that aren't the norm
01:31:11.340 --> 01:31:15.460
for a blind person. I mean, in general, it would
01:31:15.460 --> 01:31:18.399
be cool to combine all of your interests. Yeah,
01:31:18.420 --> 01:31:20.279
I think I also just like pushing the envelope
01:31:20.279 --> 01:31:25.079
of what we are quote -unquote allowed or supposed
01:31:25.079 --> 01:31:29.640
to be doing. Because I guess I myself was very...
01:31:30.369 --> 01:31:32.609
down on myself thinking i'm not going to be able
01:31:32.609 --> 01:31:35.970
to do anything like a lot of that stem from you
01:31:35.970 --> 01:31:37.350
know like growing up i was like looked up to
01:31:37.350 --> 01:31:40.109
my father and stuff and i was like great now
01:31:40.109 --> 01:31:41.729
my kids are never going to look up to me i'm
01:31:41.729 --> 01:31:46.170
just going to be this blind guy who can't do
01:31:46.170 --> 01:31:48.329
anything and you know my kids are never going
01:31:48.329 --> 01:31:52.189
to think i'm a superhero or nothing where it's
01:31:52.189 --> 01:31:55.189
actually like the complete opposite um my son
01:31:55.189 --> 01:31:58.590
they did like in school they do a project i'm
01:31:58.590 --> 01:32:02.760
like a canadian or something and he he did it
01:32:02.760 --> 01:32:05.260
on me and like he found a photo of me on google
01:32:05.260 --> 01:32:08.319
because it was like a research party they'd like
01:32:08.319 --> 01:32:13.699
research some like canadian and he then like
01:32:13.699 --> 01:32:16.140
did me like the one photo i'm like bouldering
01:32:16.140 --> 01:32:19.100
and i'm like hanging upside down or something
01:32:19.100 --> 01:32:20.880
and he's like some of his friends were like well
01:32:20.880 --> 01:32:23.340
like your dad looks like spider -man and i was
01:32:23.340 --> 01:32:25.199
like oh like it's like here like i'm getting
01:32:25.199 --> 01:32:29.109
referred to as a superhero so i It was kind of
01:32:29.109 --> 01:32:32.069
neat to go from thinking I'm never going to be
01:32:32.069 --> 01:32:36.210
that. And I do things that sighted dads don't
01:32:36.210 --> 01:32:38.250
do. It's not that they're not physically capable
01:32:38.250 --> 01:32:42.909
of doing it. They just don't. So yeah, I get
01:32:42.909 --> 01:32:45.069
to do a lot of really cool shit. Yeah, absolutely.
01:32:45.689 --> 01:32:48.529
I think you must be stronger than most people
01:32:48.529 --> 01:32:50.930
out there doing a lot of cool stuff. Oh, even
01:32:50.930 --> 01:32:52.710
today at the gym, I was like moving this plate
01:32:52.710 --> 01:32:56.109
off of a thing. Yeah. And it's like. super jacked
01:32:56.109 --> 01:32:57.609
dude come over and he's like well how did you
01:32:57.609 --> 01:32:59.250
lift those off there he's like i have to shim
01:32:59.250 --> 01:33:02.909
them because he can't get his fingers behind
01:33:02.909 --> 01:33:05.909
the plates to like lift them off like just because
01:33:05.909 --> 01:33:09.609
they stack flat and you know i just like grabbed
01:33:09.609 --> 01:33:11.470
it and lifted it i didn't think twice about it
01:33:11.470 --> 01:33:15.010
but the fact that he came over to ask me i was
01:33:15.010 --> 01:33:17.369
like oh my i'm a rock climber i guess maybe my
01:33:17.369 --> 01:33:19.630
fingers are stronger yeah and he's like well
01:33:19.630 --> 01:33:22.170
he's like i just i saw you just grab it and he's
01:33:22.170 --> 01:33:24.439
just like I can't do that. And I'm like, this
01:33:24.439 --> 01:33:27.020
guy's just massive. I'm just thinking like, it's
01:33:27.020 --> 01:33:29.760
not that hard, but I guess he's not training
01:33:29.760 --> 01:33:32.760
his fingers at all. He's got to be able to figure
01:33:32.760 --> 01:33:35.180
out a way to do it. Well, he told me his beta.
01:33:35.260 --> 01:33:37.100
How can you do it? Yeah, exactly. He's like,
01:33:37.140 --> 01:33:39.699
I put little two pound plates in between each
01:33:39.699 --> 01:33:42.239
45. He's like, that way my fingers can get behind
01:33:42.239 --> 01:33:46.819
it. Okay. So he shared with me his how can I.
01:33:47.119 --> 01:33:49.739
Yeah. Even though I don't need to know it, but
01:33:49.739 --> 01:33:51.920
it's good to know. I'm happy we got to have that
01:33:51.920 --> 01:33:55.130
conversation. You mentioned blind hockey. I figured
01:33:55.130 --> 01:33:57.670
you haven't heard about that. So I brought with
01:33:57.670 --> 01:34:02.890
me a, I want to show a blind hockey puck. Oh,
01:34:02.949 --> 01:34:06.250
okay. So this is a traditional blind hockey puck.
01:34:06.310 --> 01:34:07.750
It's normally black. This is a training one.
01:34:07.810 --> 01:34:09.529
So that's why it's red. Oh, you might want to
01:34:09.529 --> 01:34:12.569
show it a little higher. Can you see it there?
01:34:12.770 --> 01:34:16.989
Yeah, that works. Okay. So then it's way bigger,
01:34:17.090 --> 01:34:19.810
but then they're annoying. So I keep a magnet
01:34:19.810 --> 01:34:25.569
on it if I'm not using it. because it make noise
01:34:25.569 --> 01:34:30.789
the dog thinks it's a toy so we need we track
01:34:30.789 --> 01:34:34.350
the puck by listening to it and even when i first
01:34:34.350 --> 01:34:36.850
started playing i you know if a puck was getting
01:34:36.850 --> 01:34:39.890
passed to me i would miss it because i hadn't
01:34:39.890 --> 01:34:42.829
learned how to listen to something traveling
01:34:42.829 --> 01:34:45.449
towards me to then figure out where it's going
01:34:45.449 --> 01:34:49.729
to end up and now like at very high speed you
01:34:49.729 --> 01:34:52.600
know I'll be clapping one -timers and shit if
01:34:52.600 --> 01:34:56.979
they're getting fed to me. It's really crazy,
01:34:57.079 --> 01:34:59.300
amazing to see what people are capable of doing
01:34:59.300 --> 01:35:02.319
if you practice enough. One little adaptation
01:35:02.319 --> 01:35:05.880
is the puck that's bigger. It does move a little
01:35:05.880 --> 01:35:09.260
slower, but it's the noise it makes. Just the
01:35:09.260 --> 01:35:11.539
way we communicate with each other on a much
01:35:11.539 --> 01:35:17.779
higher level. We're now capable of playing really
01:35:17.779 --> 01:35:21.619
high -level hockey. it was very shocking to me
01:35:21.619 --> 01:35:25.800
when I was able to they said my first instinct
01:35:25.800 --> 01:35:27.979
was this is going to be a joke because I'd only
01:35:27.979 --> 01:35:29.920
been blind for like maybe a month I hadn't learned
01:35:29.920 --> 01:35:33.260
because like basically when I when you look at
01:35:33.260 --> 01:35:35.199
something you're looking straight at it but now
01:35:35.199 --> 01:35:37.359
for me like when I'm looking straight at something
01:35:37.359 --> 01:35:40.520
that's when I don't see it so if I'm like looking
01:35:40.520 --> 01:35:42.939
my eyes are facing this way I'm actually like
01:35:42.939 --> 01:35:46.239
looking at you right now and I said like relearn
01:35:46.970 --> 01:35:49.210
To anything I'm looking at. I'm not actually
01:35:49.210 --> 01:35:51.350
like looking at. I'm looking at something else.
01:35:52.430 --> 01:35:57.810
So it was like. Adapting to that. And I was like
01:35:57.810 --> 01:36:01.670
very fortunate. Like one of. A big experience
01:36:01.670 --> 01:36:05.130
of mine was. I was climbing in Joshua Tree. With
01:36:05.130 --> 01:36:07.869
some friends. And every day afterwards. They
01:36:07.869 --> 01:36:09.909
would be playing hacky sack in the parking lot.
01:36:10.449 --> 01:36:12.590
Or at our campsite. And I'd always make up an
01:36:12.590 --> 01:36:17.510
excuse not to play. And. Basically, I was still
01:36:17.510 --> 01:36:19.090
drinking back then. I would basically go and
01:36:19.090 --> 01:36:21.189
get in the van. I would like drink my sorrows
01:36:21.189 --> 01:36:23.310
away. I was just like, oh, I'm such a piece of
01:36:23.310 --> 01:36:25.470
shit. I can't even hit a hacky sack anymore.
01:36:26.510 --> 01:36:30.630
And finally, my friend Rob one day called me
01:36:30.630 --> 01:36:31.729
out on it. He's like, I know you don't have to
01:36:31.729 --> 01:36:33.770
go do that. He's like, why every day do you make
01:36:33.770 --> 01:36:35.750
up this excuse? And I was like, Rob, I can't
01:36:35.750 --> 01:36:37.350
see the hacky sack. I'm not going to ruin your
01:36:37.350 --> 01:36:40.149
rally. He's like, dude, we're playing hacky sack.
01:36:40.329 --> 01:36:42.470
Like, we don't care. Basically, it's an excuse
01:36:42.470 --> 01:36:44.510
to stand around and shoot the shit and kick around
01:36:44.510 --> 01:36:49.140
a little bag. So then I came over and I started
01:36:49.140 --> 01:36:51.699
playing and I was like missing it and missing
01:36:51.699 --> 01:36:54.880
it, missing it. And then eventually like, and
01:36:54.880 --> 01:36:57.380
again, these guys were like being encouraging,
01:36:57.460 --> 01:36:59.920
like, oh, you almost got it that time and being
01:36:59.920 --> 01:37:02.680
very inclusive. And then all of a sudden I remember
01:37:02.680 --> 01:37:04.079
like I hit it the one time. And again, they're
01:37:04.079 --> 01:37:05.899
not like firing at me. They're like lobbing it,
01:37:05.960 --> 01:37:08.739
hoping that I can maybe hit it. And when I finally
01:37:08.739 --> 01:37:12.100
hit it. I remember I started crying. I broke
01:37:12.100 --> 01:37:14.140
down out of excitement. I was like, do you guys
01:37:14.140 --> 01:37:16.960
see that? I meant to do that. I remember being
01:37:16.960 --> 01:37:18.960
like, holy shit, I can do this. I just need to
01:37:18.960 --> 01:37:22.779
look here and the bag's coming here. And then
01:37:22.779 --> 01:37:26.140
it allowed me to have the confidence in myself
01:37:26.140 --> 01:37:28.000
that I can do these things. I just need to learn
01:37:28.000 --> 01:37:30.600
how to. I feel like they discredit a lot of the
01:37:30.600 --> 01:37:35.399
effort that I've put into being able to do certain
01:37:35.399 --> 01:37:39.479
things. And it's also, I think, why I spend a
01:37:39.479 --> 01:37:43.279
lot of time helping the blind youth. I volunteer
01:37:43.279 --> 01:37:45.159
with the blind youth as often as I can because
01:37:45.159 --> 01:37:49.859
basically I remember being a kid and most kids
01:37:49.859 --> 01:37:53.239
are assholes. And if there's a blind kid that
01:37:53.239 --> 01:37:55.039
wants to play hacky sack and he's missing it,
01:37:55.100 --> 01:37:57.779
he's probably going to get made fun of. Where
01:37:57.779 --> 01:38:00.640
the experience I had as a grown adult with other
01:38:00.640 --> 01:38:05.039
grown adults, they're like hyping me up. oh you
01:38:05.039 --> 01:38:07.199
almost got it and saying all these things and
01:38:07.199 --> 01:38:09.520
you know gently passing the hacky sack to me
01:38:09.520 --> 01:38:13.619
where the kid that is 10 years old that can't
01:38:13.619 --> 01:38:16.840
see it kids are probably firing at him and he's
01:38:16.840 --> 01:38:18.880
missing it and they're like see you know you
01:38:18.880 --> 01:38:21.180
can't do it and that kid's probably now going
01:38:21.180 --> 01:38:24.380
to like migrate into his basement and probably
01:38:24.380 --> 01:38:28.720
become you know dependent on some form of substance
01:38:28.720 --> 01:38:33.119
because his childhood traumas from being blind
01:38:33.119 --> 01:38:37.720
led him to having to drink or something and yeah
01:38:37.720 --> 01:38:40.180
and like the belief that you aren't able to do
01:38:40.180 --> 01:38:43.260
it yeah and it's like no one told me that but
01:38:43.260 --> 01:38:46.859
yet i was telling myself that um and i feel like
01:38:46.859 --> 01:38:51.479
little kids probably actually hear that and and
01:38:51.479 --> 01:38:55.020
it's awful so i try to you know even like little
01:38:55.020 --> 01:38:58.399
tips like squirting toothpaste in my mouth um
01:38:58.399 --> 01:39:02.760
you know i like to teach kids. I have little
01:39:02.760 --> 01:39:06.020
tricks on everything I do. So if I can share
01:39:06.020 --> 01:39:09.939
those with them, then that'll hopefully make
01:39:09.939 --> 01:39:13.039
their life go a lot smoother. It's like less
01:39:13.039 --> 01:39:16.220
barriers for them to they already have enough
01:39:16.220 --> 01:39:20.680
hurdles to jump over. If I can help get them
01:39:20.680 --> 01:39:24.319
there, then that's a good thing. And also just
01:39:24.319 --> 01:39:29.180
trying to grow blind sports in Canada. Adaptive
01:39:29.180 --> 01:39:33.250
sports are you know lacking a lot here like blind
01:39:33.250 --> 01:39:37.729
hockey as a charity does a really great job um
01:39:37.729 --> 01:39:41.229
incorporating you know blind youth like at the
01:39:41.229 --> 01:39:43.130
beginning i was i got a little emotional talking
01:39:43.130 --> 01:39:45.869
about my friend mark who he lost his sight he
01:39:45.869 --> 01:39:47.510
has the same disease as me he was like on his
01:39:47.510 --> 01:39:51.210
way to making it into like the nhl loses sight
01:39:51.210 --> 01:39:55.149
at 17 and his life is just like stripped from
01:39:55.149 --> 01:39:59.109
him and then he learned about blind hockey And
01:39:59.109 --> 01:40:00.649
it was like mostly adults. And he got asking
01:40:00.649 --> 01:40:03.149
if kids play. I'm like, no, there's no kid programs.
01:40:03.369 --> 01:40:05.010
And he was like, wow, like my whole life was
01:40:05.010 --> 01:40:07.989
spent playing hockey. All my best friends I got
01:40:07.989 --> 01:40:10.810
from hockey. And it can be with any sport, but
01:40:10.810 --> 01:40:14.050
blind kids don't have these sports to play. So
01:40:14.050 --> 01:40:16.710
he rollerbladed across Canada to try to raise
01:40:16.710 --> 01:40:19.729
money and awareness for blind hockey. And now,
01:40:19.869 --> 01:40:22.050
like two weeks from now, I'm helping run a multi
01:40:22.050 --> 01:40:23.789
-sport camp in Toronto. There's going to be 50
01:40:23.789 --> 01:40:25.930
kids there and they're going to get the rock
01:40:25.930 --> 01:40:28.340
climb. Oh, that'll be great. And play four other
01:40:28.340 --> 01:40:30.939
sports. You know, I get to take kids climbing,
01:40:31.039 --> 01:40:33.239
like, quite, you know, a few times a year type
01:40:33.239 --> 01:40:36.199
of thing. And they, not just them, even their
01:40:36.199 --> 01:40:38.619
parents get to see, like, you know, Mark and
01:40:38.619 --> 01:40:41.840
I and a couple other guys who, like, live normal
01:40:41.840 --> 01:40:44.539
lives and were, like, confident growing adults.
01:40:44.699 --> 01:40:48.699
And it gives them faith that their kid can also
01:40:48.699 --> 01:40:53.039
be something and hold their head high. And you,
01:40:53.060 --> 01:40:55.470
like, take them outside as well? i've yet to
01:40:55.470 --> 01:40:58.949
take any kids outdoor climbing um that will happen
01:40:58.949 --> 01:41:02.829
eventually though i'm uh i'm in the works of
01:41:02.829 --> 01:41:06.369
like trying to get some things going like i can
01:41:06.369 --> 01:41:08.789
only be in so many places at once and also like
01:41:08.789 --> 01:41:12.189
i can't call so like i'll like climb on routes
01:41:12.189 --> 01:41:18.050
beside kids which is maybe harder outside and
01:41:18.050 --> 01:41:22.039
mostly like where we go in toronto And the climbs
01:41:22.039 --> 01:41:24.159
are like the hardest ones, like a five, 10. So
01:41:24.159 --> 01:41:27.300
I'll just like, I don't clip in the guys that
01:41:27.300 --> 01:41:28.939
run it. Don't really say anything to me. And
01:41:28.939 --> 01:41:30.939
I just, the kids having a hard time. I was like,
01:41:30.979 --> 01:41:34.079
screw you up beside them and, you know, give
01:41:34.079 --> 01:41:38.079
them some motivation or I'll like tap on the
01:41:38.079 --> 01:41:39.779
holds or something. So they can like hear where
01:41:39.779 --> 01:41:44.079
to move their hand to. Some of them now are getting
01:41:44.079 --> 01:41:46.159
strong enough that they can for sure climb outside.
01:41:48.510 --> 01:41:50.649
and hopefully this summer we can make that happen
01:41:50.649 --> 01:41:53.409
and i do want to get into a couple of like the
01:41:53.409 --> 01:41:55.970
audience submitted questions um through like
01:41:55.970 --> 01:41:59.970
discord or instagram um so the first one how
01:41:59.970 --> 01:42:02.090
long does it take to get in sync with your caller
01:42:02.090 --> 01:42:06.789
depending who they are i suppose um again like
01:42:06.789 --> 01:42:09.329
when i have like a high like i'll keep referencing
01:42:09.329 --> 01:42:13.369
like jazz and atlanta when they say something
01:42:13.369 --> 01:42:15.850
like i believe what they're saying to be true
01:42:15.850 --> 01:42:18.529
i mean in saying that there's times that I will
01:42:18.529 --> 01:42:20.109
go to do something and it'd be like, I can't
01:42:20.109 --> 01:42:24.050
do that. Um, cause I think that they forget that
01:42:24.050 --> 01:42:27.890
I'm not as strong as they are. Okay. Um, so like,
01:42:27.890 --> 01:42:29.090
there's something like, you know, grab that jug
01:42:29.090 --> 01:42:31.189
there. I'm just like, this isn't a jug. And like,
01:42:31.250 --> 01:42:38.050
I can't hold this. Um, I need new beta. Um, so
01:42:38.050 --> 01:42:41.050
it's not too bad as long as I just believe in
01:42:41.050 --> 01:42:42.630
truck. It's yeah. It's a trust thing. As long
01:42:42.630 --> 01:42:44.829
as I'm trusting them. Cause there is times I'll
01:42:44.829 --> 01:42:46.779
be like, all right, now do this. And it's like,
01:42:46.800 --> 01:42:48.899
oh, that doesn't feel right, but like, okay.
01:42:49.460 --> 01:42:51.600
And then I'll do it. And it's like, holy shit,
01:42:51.699 --> 01:42:57.939
like, why was I doubting you? So yeah, it is
01:42:57.939 --> 01:43:00.199
a bit of a learning curve, but not too long.
01:43:00.960 --> 01:43:07.140
Okay. Next question about speed climbing. Since
01:43:07.140 --> 01:43:10.380
speed climbing is a standardized route, would
01:43:10.380 --> 01:43:14.239
it work well for blind people? It would. Me and
01:43:14.239 --> 01:43:17.180
Diego, he's one of the American blind climbers.
01:43:17.359 --> 01:43:20.819
We want to challenge each other to a speed climbing
01:43:20.819 --> 01:43:25.619
race. Have you done it? I've only, I have speed
01:43:25.619 --> 01:43:28.140
climbed. I wouldn't, I don't even want to call
01:43:28.140 --> 01:43:30.239
it that because I climbed the speed climbing
01:43:30.239 --> 01:43:33.619
route. Right. It was not very speedy. No. Same
01:43:33.619 --> 01:43:35.640
for me. Yeah. But it could be, because like you
01:43:35.640 --> 01:43:37.680
said, like it's the same thing. And if I repeated
01:43:37.680 --> 01:43:43.970
it, I would learn it like fairly quickly. I'm
01:43:43.970 --> 01:43:46.829
not near a speed climbing. There's only a few
01:43:46.829 --> 01:43:50.609
walls in Canada. But yeah, I totally would love
01:43:50.609 --> 01:43:54.050
to do that. And any other blind people out there
01:43:54.050 --> 01:43:55.529
in other countries that want to challenge me
01:43:55.529 --> 01:43:58.529
to a speed climbing off. Because I thought it'd
01:43:58.529 --> 01:44:00.229
be neat to do that at one of the World Cups.
01:44:01.109 --> 01:44:03.149
And Diego and I talked about doing it in Salt
01:44:03.149 --> 01:44:06.590
Lake City when they had the speed climbing. They
01:44:06.590 --> 01:44:09.069
were like, oh, let's race each other just for
01:44:09.069 --> 01:44:11.949
fun. For one, just to show people like, you know,
01:44:11.949 --> 01:44:13.270
just because you're blind doesn't mean you can't
01:44:13.270 --> 01:44:15.829
speed climb. Obviously, I'm going to do it in
01:44:15.829 --> 01:44:19.289
like 10 minutes. Yeah. Do you remember your time?
01:44:19.609 --> 01:44:22.869
No, I don't think I even time myself. I was in
01:44:22.869 --> 01:44:24.449
like Switzerland or Austria or something like
01:44:24.449 --> 01:44:26.210
that. And my friend was like, oh, it was a speed
01:44:26.210 --> 01:44:28.710
climbing route there. So I just wanted to like
01:44:28.710 --> 01:44:33.890
touch the holds. They were harder. They weren't
01:44:33.890 --> 01:44:35.710
as positive as I was expecting. I thought it
01:44:35.710 --> 01:44:38.600
was just like a jug hold. yeah no i think it's
01:44:38.600 --> 01:44:42.439
maybe like a i don't know if you graded it as
01:44:42.439 --> 01:44:44.659
like a top rope route maybe like a five five
01:44:44.659 --> 01:44:48.119
ten i think i heard that it's like a 10 10 c
01:44:48.119 --> 01:44:51.840
or something um which and i don't even know who
01:44:51.840 --> 01:44:53.560
told me that it could be made up but it's definitely
01:44:53.560 --> 01:44:56.939
i also feel like i heard that so yeah maybe it
01:44:56.939 --> 01:45:00.000
definitely is not you know just a 5 -8 jug haul
01:45:00.000 --> 01:45:02.939
the way they fly up that wall i was like oh this
01:45:02.939 --> 01:45:06.770
clearly must be they're just like nope it uh
01:45:06.770 --> 01:45:12.090
yeah it definitely was not fast but so i've competed
01:45:12.090 --> 01:45:14.609
a few times in seca block which is like the deep
01:45:14.609 --> 01:45:17.529
water soloing yeah cool and they time us there
01:45:17.529 --> 01:45:20.409
and it's crazy to see so the first time i climb
01:45:20.409 --> 01:45:21.930
the route because i don't do it with a collar
01:45:21.930 --> 01:45:24.430
so i'll climb it like there was a lot of times
01:45:24.430 --> 01:45:26.689
i'll grab a hole and like feel around for where
01:45:26.689 --> 01:45:29.430
the best part is or like oh i sequenced that
01:45:29.430 --> 01:45:32.329
wrong you know now i gotta like match or switch
01:45:32.329 --> 01:45:34.840
or something And you know, like the first time
01:45:34.840 --> 01:45:36.899
I'll do it, it'll take me like two minutes and
01:45:36.899 --> 01:45:41.199
then it'll be a minute 30. Then it'll be 50 seconds,
01:45:41.359 --> 01:45:44.699
then 30 seconds type of thing. Like I shave like
01:45:44.699 --> 01:45:48.180
so much time off every time just because the
01:45:48.180 --> 01:45:51.199
first, I'm not going to just dino and like cut
01:45:51.199 --> 01:45:52.880
feet and start throwing the shit when I have
01:45:52.880 --> 01:45:56.859
no idea what it is. But every time I climb it,
01:45:56.960 --> 01:46:00.100
I go way faster. So it would do, it would be
01:46:00.100 --> 01:46:03.180
the same for the speed climbing. But I wouldn't
01:46:03.180 --> 01:46:05.159
even come close to what the men and women do
01:46:05.159 --> 01:46:09.500
internationally. Well, maybe eventually if you
01:46:09.500 --> 01:46:13.420
did it so many times. I mean, I don't know. The
01:46:13.420 --> 01:46:15.640
speeds that they're putting up these days blow
01:46:15.640 --> 01:46:18.460
my mind. Yeah, okay, that's true. I mean, I guess
01:46:18.460 --> 01:46:21.239
I got to quit saying I can't. How can I get to
01:46:21.239 --> 01:46:24.159
their speed? Well, because I've seen videos.
01:46:24.380 --> 01:46:29.279
I think I saw Sam Watson doing blind speed climbing
01:46:29.279 --> 01:46:33.130
as an exercise. uh because i mean i guess eventually
01:46:33.130 --> 01:46:35.010
you do learn it so well that you should just
01:46:35.010 --> 01:46:38.550
kind of know without being able to see from what
01:46:38.550 --> 01:46:40.409
i understand like they're not looking at their
01:46:40.409 --> 01:46:41.850
feet and something like that like they're it's
01:46:41.850 --> 01:46:44.189
all muscle memory right so yeah all muscle memory
01:46:44.189 --> 01:46:47.489
and uh that's interesting i did not know that
01:46:47.489 --> 01:46:52.890
that he or other climbers uh climbed blindfolded
01:46:52.890 --> 01:46:55.810
for speed but but it makes sense that is an exercise
01:46:55.810 --> 01:46:59.520
yeah I've even seen it for like bouldering. I
01:46:59.520 --> 01:47:02.140
think not as much. I think I saw like one time
01:47:02.140 --> 01:47:05.640
in a gym, the comp kids were doing like a blindfolded
01:47:05.640 --> 01:47:11.579
exercise. I don't know what it helps with bouldering
01:47:11.579 --> 01:47:14.779
as much. I don't know what the exercise is for.
01:47:14.840 --> 01:47:19.619
Maybe just like trust or I don't know, power
01:47:19.619 --> 01:47:21.800
endurance, like moving slower. I'm not sure.
01:47:21.979 --> 01:47:25.060
Yeah, lock off strength. Yeah. I've definitely
01:47:25.060 --> 01:47:27.319
heard of that happening as well. I've even actually,
01:47:27.359 --> 01:47:29.939
I've been at the gym where Atlanta and I were
01:47:29.939 --> 01:47:33.420
at the gym and then people came over and they
01:47:33.420 --> 01:47:36.239
thought that we were like both pro climbers.
01:47:36.239 --> 01:47:38.619
And we were, that's how a pro climber trains
01:47:38.619 --> 01:47:42.300
is you, you do their beta or something. So I
01:47:42.300 --> 01:47:44.220
came down and I could hear her like talking to
01:47:44.220 --> 01:47:46.460
someone through the mic. And then she's like,
01:47:46.539 --> 01:47:48.420
no, like he's blind. And I'm like telling him
01:47:48.420 --> 01:47:51.090
like, two ladies were like oh like we just thought
01:47:51.090 --> 01:47:53.229
that's how you like became so good is that you
01:47:53.229 --> 01:47:56.470
guys called for each other and that way you had
01:47:56.470 --> 01:47:58.569
to like move slower and like wait for them to
01:47:58.569 --> 01:48:00.229
tell you this you try this different technique
01:48:00.229 --> 01:48:03.170
and she's like no like you just can't see what
01:48:03.170 --> 01:48:08.909
he's doing um but yeah they could the blind kids
01:48:08.909 --> 01:48:11.409
are not blankets other people i've seen doing
01:48:11.409 --> 01:48:13.630
it for kids and stuff and i think it's just building
01:48:13.630 --> 01:48:18.310
endurance because you have to wait You know,
01:48:18.310 --> 01:48:20.189
so I think there's some training would be like
01:48:20.189 --> 01:48:22.329
climbing like every hole is like wait three seconds
01:48:22.329 --> 01:48:25.170
hovering over it before you can grab it. So you're
01:48:25.170 --> 01:48:30.989
basically doing something similar to that. So
01:48:30.989 --> 01:48:32.989
yeah, it's pretty fun though. You should try
01:48:32.989 --> 01:48:35.989
blindfold climbing sometime. I would try it out
01:48:35.989 --> 01:48:37.949
on rope maybe. I would be interested in that.
01:48:38.710 --> 01:48:40.489
Yeah, bouldering is definitely, like I said,
01:48:40.489 --> 01:48:44.909
sketchier. I helped Justin Salas run like a blind
01:48:44.909 --> 01:48:47.479
climbing clinic. in salt lake city at the bouldering
01:48:47.479 --> 01:48:51.739
project and it was funny watching people having
01:48:51.739 --> 01:48:54.260
their their friends call for them and they'd
01:48:54.260 --> 01:48:57.779
be like a six inches or a foot off the pad and
01:48:57.779 --> 01:48:59.899
they're like okay now like let go like you can't
01:48:59.899 --> 01:49:02.420
down climb anymore and they'd be like ah and
01:49:02.420 --> 01:49:04.560
then they'd jump and they like they would land
01:49:04.560 --> 01:49:07.159
and they're like holy like they were scared even
01:49:07.159 --> 01:49:09.500
though their friends telling them like dude you're
01:49:09.500 --> 01:49:12.779
you're six inches from the mat just let go but
01:49:12.779 --> 01:49:15.020
they have no concept of where you are in space
01:49:15.879 --> 01:49:18.460
So it was kind of funny and neat getting to experience
01:49:18.460 --> 01:49:23.060
other people experiencing what we kind of go
01:49:23.060 --> 01:49:25.819
through all the time. Yeah, it's impressive for
01:49:25.819 --> 01:49:29.020
sure. But I think that brings me into the last
01:49:29.020 --> 01:49:34.020
question. Someone asked thoughts on new disciplines
01:49:34.020 --> 01:49:38.159
for para climbing. Some para climbers train in
01:49:38.159 --> 01:49:40.180
only boulder gyms because they're more accessible
01:49:40.180 --> 01:49:44.539
and there's so many more of them. Do you think
01:49:44.539 --> 01:49:46.479
that there would be like more paraclimbers who
01:49:46.479 --> 01:49:49.420
would want to compete in bouldering? No, because
01:49:49.420 --> 01:49:53.260
yes and no. The biggest thing is, is like the
01:49:53.260 --> 01:49:58.739
injury factor. So for me, I can't see where the
01:49:58.739 --> 01:50:01.220
mat is. I mean, I would still compete in bouldering.
01:50:01.899 --> 01:50:03.840
And I really hope that they can do that sometime.
01:50:04.720 --> 01:50:07.000
There actually was a bouldering comp last year
01:50:07.000 --> 01:50:12.340
in Colorado for paraclimbers. And I had my surgery,
01:50:12.420 --> 01:50:16.680
so I couldn't attend it. But for other climbers
01:50:16.680 --> 01:50:19.319
that say have spina bifida or something like
01:50:19.319 --> 01:50:22.640
that, and you now are coming off and you can't
01:50:22.640 --> 01:50:26.840
control your legs. We kind of experimented with
01:50:26.840 --> 01:50:30.420
this with Sequel Block. Some climbers that are
01:50:30.420 --> 01:50:34.859
now falling 60 feet, they don't have the leg
01:50:34.859 --> 01:50:37.189
strength to keep their legs from like... going
01:50:37.189 --> 01:50:39.670
like this and if you hit the water you're doing
01:50:39.670 --> 01:50:41.689
the splits it's gonna like rip your leg out of
01:50:41.689 --> 01:50:44.829
the socket oh geez um or someone who has a spinal
01:50:44.829 --> 01:50:47.189
cord injury and their back is safe fused together
01:50:47.189 --> 01:50:51.789
you know the impact of hitting a mat hard could
01:50:51.789 --> 01:50:58.329
dislodge that or so i mean i know like lag amputees
01:50:58.329 --> 01:51:03.529
hand amputees pretty well climb in boulder but
01:51:03.529 --> 01:51:06.390
even then if you're I wouldn't say anything for
01:51:06.390 --> 01:51:08.369
a hand amputee, but if you're a lag amputee and,
01:51:08.369 --> 01:51:11.630
you know, hit the mat and, you know, your prosthetic
01:51:11.630 --> 01:51:15.630
lands weird or hard, or even if you say climb
01:51:15.630 --> 01:51:17.430
without a prosthetic, when you land now on one
01:51:17.430 --> 01:51:20.409
lag, you don't have to absorb all that shock
01:51:20.409 --> 01:51:24.470
with one knee. So it's just like, I've seen some
01:51:24.470 --> 01:51:27.729
gyms put up top ropes on their boulders just
01:51:27.729 --> 01:51:31.850
to make it more inclusive. But then that's kind
01:51:31.850 --> 01:51:35.380
of sometimes in the way. So it'd be tough. It
01:51:35.380 --> 01:51:38.819
kind of have to be sign a waiver and for sure.
01:51:39.260 --> 01:51:41.619
Cause a lot of us want to do it. Um, cause you
01:51:41.619 --> 01:51:45.340
know, bouldering is, there's way different climbs
01:51:45.340 --> 01:51:50.199
like then some rope climbs. So anyway, I think
01:51:50.199 --> 01:51:51.479
a lot of us just like pushing the envelope and
01:51:51.479 --> 01:51:55.779
be like, you know, I can do this. Um, and this
01:51:55.779 --> 01:51:58.800
is just how I, how I do it differently and kind
01:51:58.800 --> 01:52:01.699
of want to show off their abilities. Like my
01:52:01.699 --> 01:52:04.359
buddy Justin, like he climbs. you know, double
01:52:04.359 --> 01:52:09.500
-digit V -boulders, like, quite frequently. You
01:52:09.500 --> 01:52:12.560
know, there's other lag amputees I have friends
01:52:12.560 --> 01:52:14.619
that, you know, climb double -digit V -grade.
01:52:15.079 --> 01:52:17.680
Wow, yeah. With, you know, like, missing a lag.
01:52:18.680 --> 01:52:22.659
Wow. Man, I suck. They've just put the effort
01:52:22.659 --> 01:52:25.180
in. Like, it's not that, like, when I say it,
01:52:25.199 --> 01:52:26.699
it's not like, oh, that guy's just a naturally
01:52:26.699 --> 01:52:29.119
talented athlete or he's naturally gifted at
01:52:29.119 --> 01:52:31.239
climbing. No, like, that man's put in the work.
01:52:31.739 --> 01:52:34.939
Yeah. I'm saying I did not put in the work. Yeah.
01:52:35.220 --> 01:52:37.060
It's, it's tough to get motivated to go to the
01:52:37.060 --> 01:52:39.260
gym and like your body's sore all the time and,
01:52:39.279 --> 01:52:42.760
and stuff like that. So, and a lot of like para
01:52:42.760 --> 01:52:45.359
athletes have to work, I'm going to say twice
01:52:45.359 --> 01:52:50.500
as hard, but put a lot more effort in to, and
01:52:50.500 --> 01:52:53.180
maybe not for everyone, but like, I'm sure a
01:52:53.180 --> 01:52:55.359
lot of able -bodied people have a lot of struggles
01:52:55.359 --> 01:52:57.279
as well. Like say for me, it's getting to and
01:52:57.279 --> 01:52:59.699
from the gym is hard. Not everyone has a car.
01:52:59.819 --> 01:53:02.000
So like someone else has to also take a bus or
01:53:02.000 --> 01:53:05.659
walk there. So I'm not saying that other people
01:53:05.659 --> 01:53:08.500
don't equally have the same problem sometimes,
01:53:08.640 --> 01:53:12.979
but on average, a paraclimber has to experience
01:53:12.979 --> 01:53:17.619
a lot more barriers than someone else. So I think
01:53:17.619 --> 01:53:19.220
that's why we want to show like we are capable
01:53:19.220 --> 01:53:22.199
of doing these things, you know, give us the
01:53:22.199 --> 01:53:25.180
time. But also because there's so few of us,
01:53:25.239 --> 01:53:29.270
it's very expensive for... a gym to shut down
01:53:29.270 --> 01:53:32.130
and hold up a comp if there's only going to be
01:53:32.130 --> 01:53:35.069
six people show up type of thing but you need
01:53:35.069 --> 01:53:39.189
to start somewhere because otherwise how's anyone
01:53:39.189 --> 01:53:41.529
like jazz and i were just skiing the other day
01:53:41.529 --> 01:53:45.529
and we saw this man on a a sit ski he's on the
01:53:45.529 --> 01:53:47.909
chairlift with me so i was like hey man do you
01:53:47.909 --> 01:53:50.609
do rock climb he's like no i can't rock climb
01:53:50.609 --> 01:53:52.689
and again like when people say the whole like
01:53:52.689 --> 01:53:57.420
i can't things i always have to fire back at
01:53:57.420 --> 01:54:01.579
them. And he gave me a few excuses as to why
01:54:01.579 --> 01:54:04.020
he can't do it. And eventually he was like, all
01:54:04.020 --> 01:54:06.119
right, yeah, you're right. Like, I just haven't
01:54:06.119 --> 01:54:10.159
tried it yet. And I hope he does, but he had
01:54:10.159 --> 01:54:11.539
never heard of it. And I was like, well, it's
01:54:11.539 --> 01:54:14.079
because, you know, we only had our first nationals
01:54:14.079 --> 01:54:17.020
two weeks ago. And this guy lives in Montreal
01:54:17.020 --> 01:54:19.279
where there's a pretty big pair climbing scene.
01:54:19.859 --> 01:54:22.739
But by that there's like eight people, but like,
01:54:22.739 --> 01:54:25.449
that's a big scene. Like. You know, you go to
01:54:25.449 --> 01:54:31.050
any other big city, there's not many. But if
01:54:31.050 --> 01:54:33.989
there was more comps and more adaptive programs
01:54:33.989 --> 01:54:37.350
and stuff like that, more people would get involved.
01:54:37.729 --> 01:54:41.170
It would continue to grow. If you go to the States
01:54:41.170 --> 01:54:44.090
or other countries, you know, like the U .S.
01:54:44.090 --> 01:54:46.350
Nationals, I didn't see a number this past weekend,
01:54:46.390 --> 01:54:48.489
but I think last year there was 250 athletes
01:54:48.489 --> 01:54:51.189
there. And you compare that to Canada where there's,
01:54:51.189 --> 01:54:57.600
I think last year nine of us competed. But their
01:54:57.600 --> 01:54:59.300
first nationals, I think they had 10 people.
01:55:00.079 --> 01:55:03.520
Yeah, it just takes time. Yeah, our first nationals,
01:55:03.520 --> 01:55:07.119
we had 30. But again, a gym has to be willing
01:55:07.119 --> 01:55:12.159
to shut down, pay its root setters to set this
01:55:12.159 --> 01:55:15.659
comp for a week. It's a big, there's no money
01:55:15.659 --> 01:55:19.319
in it. So someone has to kind of take the loss.
01:55:21.170 --> 01:55:24.010
to build the space for us. So I think we're all
01:55:24.010 --> 01:55:27.010
very appreciative of the people that do this
01:55:27.010 --> 01:55:29.569
for us. Yeah. Well, I hope this at least helps
01:55:29.569 --> 01:55:32.609
get the word out there. Yeah. I hope so as well.
01:55:32.729 --> 01:55:36.270
Well, I think that is all the questions I had
01:55:36.270 --> 01:55:39.029
for today. Um, is there any like last minute
01:55:39.029 --> 01:55:41.670
words of wisdom you want to get out there? Words
01:55:41.670 --> 01:55:45.529
of wisdom. Um, yeah, don't say I can't say how
01:55:45.529 --> 01:55:51.329
can I, um, no, and I guess, uh, I don't know,
01:55:51.329 --> 01:55:56.210
be inclusive to people with disabilities. And
01:55:56.210 --> 01:55:59.170
as in don't judge people in the sense of, you
01:55:59.170 --> 01:56:01.130
know, like when someone starts climbing for the
01:56:01.130 --> 01:56:03.930
first time, they're not going to be good at it.
01:56:04.109 --> 01:56:07.289
But if you give them an opportunity to learn,
01:56:07.409 --> 01:56:09.529
they're also going to become very good at it.
01:56:10.369 --> 01:56:12.829
I think a lot of people might see a pair climber
01:56:12.829 --> 01:56:14.569
climb for the first time and be like, oh, like
01:56:14.569 --> 01:56:15.970
I don't want to climb with that person because
01:56:15.970 --> 01:56:18.949
they're not at my level. But if everyone's told
01:56:18.949 --> 01:56:20.670
that they're never going to get to your level.
01:56:21.850 --> 01:56:24.909
So, and a lot of people don't have that intrinsic
01:56:24.909 --> 01:56:26.909
motivation, especially that's kind of why I was
01:56:26.909 --> 01:56:29.130
asking, how does the average person get into
01:56:29.130 --> 01:56:33.949
rock climbing and stay at it? Because if you
01:56:33.949 --> 01:56:37.390
go to this adaptive meetup, you see a few other
01:56:37.390 --> 01:56:39.090
adaptive climbers there, but they're already
01:56:39.090 --> 01:56:41.590
like crushing it. You're just like, well, I can't
01:56:41.590 --> 01:56:43.789
do that. But they're kind of discrediting and
01:56:43.789 --> 01:56:45.630
forgetting the fact that this person also started
01:56:45.630 --> 01:56:48.899
here. And it takes time to build up to here,
01:56:49.020 --> 01:56:53.479
but you need climbing partners to allow you to
01:56:53.479 --> 01:56:57.000
build that. So yeah, I just, I hope that people
01:56:57.000 --> 01:56:59.739
that are listening to this can, can learn to
01:56:59.739 --> 01:57:02.000
incorporate or invite people out to the climbing
01:57:02.000 --> 01:57:04.899
meetups. So like they're into their gym and give
01:57:04.899 --> 01:57:07.800
them a catch and let them learn how to belay.
01:57:08.479 --> 01:57:11.520
And eventually you can build that partnership
01:57:11.520 --> 01:57:15.859
and, you know, you'll have another climbing partner.
01:57:16.579 --> 01:57:19.739
Awesome. Okay, great words to end on. Well, thanks
01:57:19.739 --> 01:57:22.260
for having me on here. Yeah, yeah. Thank you
01:57:22.260 --> 01:57:24.239
so much for joining me. Do you want to let people
01:57:24.239 --> 01:57:25.699
know where they can find you if they want to
01:57:25.699 --> 01:57:29.079
hear more about your story? Yeah, my handle on
01:57:29.079 --> 01:57:32.340
Instagram and other platforms is The Blind Explorer.
01:57:32.960 --> 01:57:36.420
Yeah, I will add that to the description. Awesome.
01:57:36.579 --> 01:57:38.159
Thank you again. And it was amazing to talk to
01:57:38.159 --> 01:57:41.800
you. Yeah, thank you. Thank you so much for making
01:57:41.800 --> 01:57:44.140
it to the end of the podcast. Don't forget to
01:57:44.140 --> 01:57:46.359
like and subscribe if you enjoyed. Otherwise,
01:57:46.479 --> 01:57:49.779
you are a super big climber. If you're listening
01:57:49.779 --> 01:57:52.340
on a podcasting platform, I'd appreciate if you
01:57:52.340 --> 01:57:55.300
rate it five stars and you can continue the discussion
01:57:55.300 --> 01:57:58.439
on the free competition climbing discord linked
01:57:58.439 --> 01:58:00.920
in the description. Thanks again for listening.
